Parish Dos and Don'ts from Millennials

[DarkLight]

One thing I do think is nice with the internet now, it’s very easy to see what’s going on at multiple different parishes. So I’ve signed up for email blasts from various local parishes, not just my own. The one closest to me is convenient for Mass (and has actually done a wonderful job of having multiple confession times, given that we have one priest and two churches). But it has mostly retired people or families with young kids, which means pretty much everything occurs between 9am and 6pm. I work 9-5 with an hour commute.

So I’m attending an evening women’s study at another parish in the area that’s got a lot more working women. And I go to adoration & confession at a parish nearer my work - and the grocery store.

 

[Jimbo]

My pet peeve, however, is when you have 5 parishes all within about 5 miles of each other and all of them are having the Masses in the morning at 8 ,9 etc.

THIS!

When there are multiple parishes in a relatively short distance, PLEASE make one work for working folks and another for non working folks.

One of my huge frustrations, and it’s just a matter of human nature, is that often the people doing scheduling do it for what makes sense for them; or what makes sense for what they perceive as their ‘loyal clientelle’. So you get someone who is retired making the mens group meet at 8:30 am. Well bully for you, but don’t then go and complain when the men’s group is decidedly older than you want.

I would get that a ton with some knight invitations. ‘You should join!’ ‘You meet when I work’ ‘That’s just an excuse!’ Whatever.

It would work well if St. Josephs met at 8:30am and had mass at nine, and St. John the Beloved’s had times that worked well with those who are still in the workforce, often pulling hours that they don’t have control over.

 

[Jimbo]

I always wonder what the Catholic Church is going to do in 15-20 years when a good number of the older generation have either passed on or are no longer physically able to volunteer. Presently we aren’t seeing the numbers we would need from the younger generations for the most part, both in terms of financial giving and volunteering (as well as Mass attendance) to keep the current number of parishes afloat.

Isn’t that kind of the point of the article? If you want them, you have to get them. To get them, you have to make it possible for them to join.

Well, if we wanted younger adults to attend our events, we would have to do…(this)…and (that)…and so on…concede to our demands or you’ll just go on being an old people’s group. I thought, After listening to this, that actually sounds pretty good to me.

Which is fine… to an extent. We need to get the youth involved. And many want to be, but we have to balance things out a bit.

I’m a GenX’er, and I think we need to give the Millennials a bit of a break. They came up in a time of economic mess; and many are having a hard time getting as good of a job as their parents did when they graduated. The economy is different and the jobs just aren’t there in the quantity they once were. So many are pulling a couple jobs to make one decent full time income.

This generation needs to be properly catechized and, yes, catered to (if that’s what making mass, confessions, and ministries available to them is) if we want them to be around. And we do want them to be around. Not only is it smart, but it’s our job as Catholics.

I’m not saying we have puppet masses and water down the doctrine. I’m saying we keep the orthodoxy (which is not only correct, but also attractive to many who grew up in a morally relative culture) and manipulate the logistics to help them out.

Just my $0.02.

 

[EnglishTeacher]

Isn’t that kind of the point of the article? If you want them, you have to get them. To get them, you have to make it possible for them to join.

Yes, and I think I said that more or less, right after the part of my comment that you quoted. BUT the thing is that younger people are just don’t give as much financially for whatever reason. Our town has a parish with a new young priest, and he has brought in many young families and “millenials” (he is a milennial himself) by doing some of what the article suggests. The parish has also lost a few older parishioners for various reasons. Interestingly, even though attendance and membership by younger people is up, giving is down.

 

[Jimbo]

Right back at you.

I mentioned ( or at least tried too, I’m not always clear) that Many millenials can’t because they don’t have the cash. If I wasn’t clear, I apologize.

 

[EnglishTeacher]

Right. Overall this generation is not doing as well financially as our parents and probably never will. So even if parishes manage to attract more young people (and I hope they do), they will have to recognize the fact that they generally can’t count on the same amount of income from 10 “millennial” households as they could from 10 “baby boomer” households. (So I think we are saying the basically the same thing. )

And of course our main concern as a Church is not numbers but spreading the gospel - bringing people to Jesus so that they can know him and make him known to others. But we are going to have to deal with the reality that in a very few years, we are probably going to have to do that on a tighter budget, which will force some difficult choices (closing parishes, discharging staff, etc.)

 

[phil19034]

Jimbo:

Isn’t that kind of the point of the article? If you want them, you have to get them. To get them, you have to make it possible for them to join.

Yes, and I think I said that more or less, right after the part of my comment that you quoted. BUT the thing is that younger people are just don’t give as much financially for whatever reason. Our town has a parish with a new young priest, and he has brought in many young families and “millenials” (he is a milennial himself) by doing some of what the article suggests. The parish has also lost a few older parishioners for various reasons. Interestingly, even though attendance and membership by younger people is up, giving is down.

Well, younger families typically have less disposable income than older folks.

Also, the average monthly mortgage a Gen X or Millennial has to pay vs a Baby Boomer is insane (esp for the first house).

For example:

• My dad finished paying his 30 year mortgage in 2008. His monthly mortgage was LESS than $300 per month.
• My mortgage for a townhouse with 3 bedrooms is approx $2300 per month.

Some people say “move where it is cheaper.” My response is: “Find me a job where I can support my family in said cheaper area and I will do it.”

My job is very niche, and (for better or worse) only really available in a handful of the largest cities in the US. If I change careers, it will most likely have to start all over again. That’s not something I’m willing to do at 41 years of age with an 8 year old and a 4 year old.

The Baby Boomers typically had their kids at a younger age than Gen X and Millennials. For many of the them, by the time they were 50, their kids were already out of the house. And they typically have their mortgage paid off by the time they were 60. Kids and mortgage are two huge expenses, that when gone allows a couple a lot more expendable revenue.

Gen X and Millennials are typically not having their first child until after 30 years old, which means we will still be paying for college well into our 50s.

For me, I will be 52 when my oldest graduates HIGH SCHOOL. And I’ll be 56 when my youngest graduates HIGH SCHOOL. By contrast, my dad was 44 when I graduated high school.

Anyway, that’s why older people donate more money to the Church. Also, donations also tend to increase over time, but when people are only getting a max of 2-3% raises each year; it makes it hard to increase donations by 5% or more.

 

[DarkLight]

Don’t forget about student loans. The jump over the past few decades in the amount of debt your average college graduate has is astronomical. If you’re spending a few hundred a month to pay your loans, that’s money you can’t give.

 

[EnglishTeacher]

For sure. I have plenty of firsthand experience with that myself, unfortunately.

 

[Gorgias]

that’s just the impression I get from nit picking and/or taking exception to ideas that have worked elsewhere.

Fair enough. My experience (in a number of parishes in a number of states over the past 30 years) tells me that there’s no one silver bullet. The stories from some dioceses are highly encouraging – but, conversely, the experiences in varied regions of the country (due to varied contexts found there), tells me that this is a problem that must be analyzed and solved regionally – perhaps on a level smaller than the diocesan level!

But, unless we get people back to the sacraments, and back to various daily devotions, and back to adoration, it’s hard to see how things get better.

Here’s my gut feel: unless people know why they should get back to the sacraments, or understand the value of devotions, or come to realize why adoration is important and valuable… it’s hard to see how we make progress. I think that’s your take, too…

Is it so bad to have an overload of seniors in one church, and an overload of young families in the next church up the street? Couldn’t we approach it in a “let the market decide” sort of way?

Yes and no.

I think that letting people gravitate where they will is better than having them get swept away altogether. However, I’m not keen on the “go where you’re feeling fed” notion. If you find a place 45 minutes away that you feel “feeds” you, then you’ll go there for Mass. But… will you go there on Monday night for Bible study, or Wednesday night for a social event? Not likely – it’s too inconvenient to get over there. And, that being the case, will you go to the Monday night Bible study or Wednesday evening social at the parish in your neighborhood? Well… no, and probably because you don’t know anyone there! So, “go where you feel fed” really means “isolate yourself from your Catholic community”. It’s counter-productive and somewhat destructive, IMHO.

But, if there are two parishes in a particular community, then by all means – pick one and stick with it!

These Mass times were convenient for people who were on their way home or to work.

So it’s not like the Church never accommodated work schedules before.

I’m guessing that, back in those days, there were multiple priests in every parish, and the “low man on the totem pole” was the one who drew the 2am Mass. That’s not the case these days. Which Sunday morning Mass would you suggest we eliminate such that an “accommodation Mass” might be scheduled?

When there are multiple parishes in a relatively short distance, PLEASE make one work for working folks and another for non working folks.

Parishes tend to schedule individually, since they’re run individually. Like I’ve said (twice on this thread, already?), if you want oversight at the multi-parish level, you have to appeal up the chain of command.

 

[blackforest]

No, but it should be possible, if one does not have kids, to make an early mass before work starts at 8:00 am. Or a mass over lunch break, or perhaps at 530 or 6 on the way home.

There’s the commute factor to consider, as well. In both major and smaller cities, working and middle class people have been gentrified to the outskirts but are still expected to commute 30-120 minutes to their jobs. (High Walk Score areas are also mostly the domain of the wealthier class). It’s worse for the working poor relying on public transit, especially with inefficient bus systems and unreliable transfers. That said, parishes can’t do everything, but it would be nice to see them do something.

 

[Peeps]

You speak often of your daughter who works in the theatre.

I would hope she has checked out the Actor’s Chapel:

She has. It has issues.

 

[Peeps]

Right. Overall this generation is not doing as well financially as our parents and probably never will. So even if parishes manage to attract more young people (and I hope they do), they will have to recognize the fact that they generally can’t count on the same amount of income from 10 “millennial” households as they could from 10 “baby boomer” households. (So I think we are saying the basically the same thing. )

And of course our main concern as a Church not numbers but spreading the gospel - bringing people to Jesus so that they can know him and make him known to others. But we are going to have to deal with the reality that in a very few years, we are probably going to have to do that on a tighter budget, which will force some difficult choices (closing parishes, discharging staff, etc.)

This is a very wise observation, IMO.

I can’t help but wonder if, instead of building youth centers and fellowship halls, if we should instead make plans to invite people to our homes, have yard parties, do more meetings in bars and restaurants, have concerts in the park, sponsor an ice skating show (our family is completely fanatical about ice skating!), do swim parties, etc.

And of course, do more and more outreaches like this that include the poor, the non-English speaking neighbors, the unemployed, the mentally-ill, etc.

E.g., sponsoring a trip to a ball game or other sporting event, or have “Movie Clubs.”

I know that none of these things has anything to do with “church,” but in reality, they do, because they meet people where they are instead of expecting people to come to where we are in our beautiful church buildings.

It just seems like we spend a lot of money on things that really don’t matter, and so being forced to cut the budget might be a blessing in disguise if it forces us to live our Christianity outside of the church doors.

 

[phil19034]

I’m guessing that, back in those days, there were multiple priests in every parish, and the “low man on the totem pole” was the one who drew the 2am Mass. That’s not the case these days. Which Sunday morning Mass would you suggest we eliminate such that an “accommodation Mass” might be scheduled?

That was not my point, and I think you know that.

The point is, individual parishes SHOULD be always looking at their schedule and reevaluating it every year. Demographics change.

Of course, we are not really going to be able to schedule a 2AM mass in today’s day & age, however, perhaps there might be a parish where they need a 7PM Saturday Mass. Or a 6PM Sunday Mass.

Or maybe instead of having daily mass every day at 6:15 and 8:15, they need to move the daily mass to the evenings once or twice a week?

And confession: I know we have discussed this before, but I do not feel that having regularly schedule confession just once a week is enough. Every community is different, but I do think each parish* could schedule confession at least twice a week (even with just one priest.)

NOTE 1: I said parish, not church. If a parish has more than one church, I’m only saying twice per parish, not per church.
NOTE 2: And if a pastor has multiple parishes by himself, he should advertise confession times for each parishes at all of his parishes. In that situation, I don’t think he needs to necessarily have to offer confession two times at each parish, but he should try to pick up at least a one more at the parish he lives in (if possible).

 

[Peeps]

Actually, a 2 a.m. Mass wouldn’t be a bad idea in a city like ours.

There’s something about that time–if you’re worried or scared or depressed or sad, it’s a time when it feels like night will never end. Having a Mass at that time would give people a really good place to go when they are feeling like life just isn’t worth doing.

 

[Gorgias]

That was not my point, and I think you know that.

Fair enough. Yet, if you’re going to talk about “accommodation Masses”, I’ll retort with stories about the days when there were so many priests that they didn’t have enough assignments for all of them, and some picked up odd jobs on the side to make ends meet until there was an assignment for them!

Of course, we are not really going to be able to schedule a 2AM mass in today’s day & age, however, perhaps there might be a parish where they need a 7PM Saturday Mass. Or a 6PM Sunday Mass.

If we’re talking about shifting Mass times? Sure. Adding them, though, beyond the current times, if there aren’t priests available?

NOTE 1: I said parish, not church. If a parish has more than one church, I’m only saying twice per parish, not per church.
NOTE 2: And if a pastor has multiple parishes by himself, he should advertise confession times for each parishes at all of his parishes.

That kinda already happens. At least, in my experience.

 

[Shasta-Rose]

I remember reading a long time ago about a “butchers’ Mass.” It was at 4:00 in the meat processing area, and right before the first shift started. Everybody showed up in their aprons.

 

[F_Marturana]

My parish has a 7:30 pm vigil mass on Saturday , and also a 5:00 pm on Sunday.

I really like 7:30 on Saturday.

 

[Peeps]

My parish has a 7:30 pm vigil mass on Saturday , and also a 5:00 pm on Sunday.

I really like 7:30 on Saturday.

The 7:30 p.m. Mass Sat does sound really nice. Great way to end a busy Sat, or for some people, begin a fun Sat. night.

I work Saturdays several weekends a month, and often I have a hard time making it to the 4:30 p.m. Sat. Mass. We used to have a 6:00 p.m. Sat. mass, but they stopped that several years ago. Too bad. It was perfect for me.

 

[blackforest]

If not Mass, a very tired, on-call priest or deacon available by phone or door buzzer . . .