Patriarch Bartholomew's Encyclical encourages dialogue with other churches and laments those who are opposed to dialogue."

[Mannyfit75]

I have one posted a thread about my own desires for the unity of both the Catholic Church and the Eastern Orthodoxy. When I wrote the thread, there were some Eastern Orthodox here on this thread who were oppose to the idea of uniting with the Catholic Church.

I responded by saying, what if the Patriarch’s of your Churches agree to to full communion with Rome. The response was hostile and claimed that “orthodoxy” will not be compromised.

I responded that the Eastern Orthodox laymen have a duty to be obedient to their Bishops and I quoted St. Ignatius of Antioch.

I don’t remember who I had the dialogue with but I think Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople’s Encyclical prove my case. Bartholomew then noted, “they are challenged in “an unacceptably fanatical way” by some who claim to be defenders of Orthodoxy.”

So to you Eastern Orthodox who is “against dialogue with the Catholic.” I urge you read his Encyclical.

Jesus Christ does not want to see a divided Church and he and the Angels will rejoice once the Catholic Church and Eastern Orthodox will be one full communion.

Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople’s newest encyclical encourages dialogue between the Orthodox Church and other Christian churches and laments those who are “unacceptably fanatical” in challenging such dialogue. He specifically condemned the false rumors spread about Catholic-Orthodox dialogue.

Patriarch Bartholomew’s patriarchal and synodal encyclical was dated Feb. 21, Orthodoxy Sunday, when the Orthodox Church celebrates the defeat of the iconoclastic heresy.

His letter began by noting the failure of those who tried to suppress, silence or falsify the Orthodox Church. He said that the Ecumenical Patriarchate cares about “protecting and establishing” the unity of the Orthodox Church in order that the Orthodox Christian faith may be confessed “with one voice and in one heart.”

Orthodoxy, he said, must be promoted with humility and interpreted in light of each historical period and cultural circumstance.

“To this purpose, Orthodoxy must be in constant dialogue with the world. The Orthodox Church does not fear dialogue because truth is not afraid of dialogue,” Bartholomew continued, saying that a Church enclosed within itself would no longer be “catholic.”

Dialogue with the outside world must first pass through all those who call themselves Christian, he wrote.

“We must first converse as Christians among ourselves in order to resolve our differences, in order that our witness to the outside world may be credible,” the Patriarch continued, citing Jesus’ prayer that all his disciples “may be one.”

From this source, the Ecumenical Patriarchate has conducted official Pan-Orthodox theological dialogues with the larger Christian Churches to discuss divisions in faith.

He noted that although these dialogues are conducted “with the mutual agreement and participation of all local Orthodox Churches,” they are challenged in “an unacceptably fanatical way” by some who claim to be defenders of Orthodoxy.

Source: blog.echurchwebsites.org.uk/2010/02/21/patriarch-bartholomew-constantinoples-newest-encyclical-encourages-dialogue-orthodox-church-christian-churches/

 

[Nine_Two]

Uniting with the Catholic Church and entering dialogue with Christian churches are two very different things.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Uniting with the Catholic Church and entering dialogue with Christian churches are two very different things.

They are but they are connected. Dialogues between Catholic and Eastern Orthodox looks for a common ground and opens many debates concerning theology, and other matters of faith. The dialogue objective is the unity of both Churches. That is the dialogue ultimate aim? Why? Because the one Founder of both our Churches, Jesus Christ, prayed that his believers will be “ONE” just as the Father and Jesus are One."

 

[Nine_Two]

They are but they are connected. Dialogues between Catholic and Eastern Orthodox looks for a common ground and opens many debates concerning theology, and other matters of faith. The dialogue objective is the unity of both Churches. That is the dialogue ultimate aim? Why? Because the one Founder of both our Churches, Jesus Christ, prayed that his believers will be “ONE” just as the Father and Jesus are One."

Actually given that the Ecumenical Patriarchite continues dialogue with the Church of England, despite having come to the conclussion some time ago that union between the two is impossible shows that we don’t have relations solely for the purpose of union.

I think these dialogues can be seen in much the same way as dialogues between nations. You have them to gain a better understanding of each other, union is not necessarily a purpose.

I do believe that dialogue with the Catholic Church may eventually lead to reconciliation (and I think we must be very careful to use that term rather than saying one will join the other, as that implies that they are wrong.), but I think that is still a ways off.

 

[josephdaniel29]

I responded that the Eastern Orthodox laymen have a duty to be obedient to their Bishops and I quoted St. Ignatius of Antioch.

Yes but no one, Orthodox or Catholic, has a duty to obey a schismatic and heretical bishop.

Yours in Christ
Joe

 

[Mannyfit75]

Yes but no one, Orthodox or Catholic, has a duty to obey a schismatic and heretical bishop.

Yours in Christ
Joe

True like Patriarch Nestorius who lead the heresy in 431 AD.

What if the entire Eastern Orthodox Patriarchs and their bishops from Constantinople to Moscow were to agree with full communion with Rome? Would you still be against it?

 

[Mannyfit75]

Actually given that the Ecumenical Patriarchite continues dialogue with the Church of England, despite having come to the conclussion some time ago that union between the two is impossible shows that we don’t have relations solely for the purpose of union.

The Vatican also continue dialogue with the Church of England but unity would not be possible with them since the Catholic Church does not recognized the ordination of women.

I think these dialogues can be seen in much the same way as dialogues between nations. You have them to gain a better understanding of each other, union is not necessarily a purpose.

I do believe that dialogue with the Catholic Church may eventually lead to reconciliation (and I think we must be very careful to use that term rather than saying one will join the other, as that implies that they are wrong.), but I think that is still a ways off.

I do believe that the eventually dialogue between our two Churches will lead to final reconciliation as you stated. We should be careful. Like the Patriarch of Constantinople said, “These dialogues are long and involve LONG debates” Ultimately, the Holy Spirit will determine the faith of our Churches.

 

[josephdaniel29]

True like Patriarch Nestorius who lead the heresy in 431 AD.

What if the entire Eastern Orthodox Patriarchs and their bishops from Constantinople to Moscow were to agree with full communion with Rome? Would you still be against it?

What if the Pope announced he was not infallible nor had supreme jurisdiction, and that all Catholics must submit to the Orthodox Church’s teachings in all things. Would you obey?

Yours in Christ
Joe

 

[dzheremi]

And? It seems to me that Catholics, particularly of the Latin variety, put the cart before the horse when it comes to dialogue between the Orthodox and those in union with Rome. As long as Rome talks of union before coming to the same faith as that of the Orthodox (because the reverse situation will not happen, ever), or more precisely without ever talking of coming to that faith (as Rome seems to think everything is hunky dory and we basically share the same faith, just different expressions of it or something), Latins can kiss all their dreams of union goodbye. It shows a very real disinterest in dialogue to gloss over the differences between the two communions in interest of…I’m going to assume…trying to draw Orthodox closer towards Rome. I don’t blame Orthodox for being reticent, though I will agree that disruptions of such talks (as have happened in the past) do not do anything but make the hardliners on whatever side they come from look like idiots. As I’ve said in other threads on this topic, nothing substantial with regard to “union” will come from these talks, but just the same they ought to be allowed to be held if those involved feel them beneficial in some way. It never hurts to just talk.