Paul VI's decicion to not allow birth control

[markomalley]

Interesting. This must have just been a drive-by posting. The OP joined on the 7th. Posted this on the 7th. And apparently hasn’t been back since that time. Oh, well.

 

[Lypher]

The commission was not created to “consider allowing birth control.” First, birth control is not immoral. Birth control is the spacing/planning of children and the Church has never taught that is wrong when a couple has ***just ***reasons. They can do so via abstaining (periodic through rhythm of the cycle and, later, NFP, or complete as long as the need is there). It is contraception that the Church teaches is immoral, not spacing births.

I agree Kind of… NFP can be immoral if used incorrectly. Just reasons really need to be prayerfully considered as well as the term periodic needs to be faithfully applied unless just reasons are present. Is using NFP selfishness, or truly needed? I think our Church does not do a very good job forming the consciences of the flock with regards to NFP. It is just as effective, if not better, then most other birth control, but that is the issue often time Parishes advertise it as Birth Control and it should not be used unless their are truly dire needs. I believe it is just as sinful if used uncharitably as a condom. Not as bad as the Pill is an abortificient, but still selfish.

Humanae Vitae in article 10

"With regard to physical, economic, psychological and social conditions, responsible parenthood is exercised by those who prudently and generously decide to have more children, and by those who, for serious reasons and with due respect to moral precep, decide not to have additional children for either a certain or an indefinite period of time.

Responsible parenthood, as we use the term here, has one further essential aspect of paramount importance. It concerns the objective moral order which was established by God, and of which a right conscience is the true interpreter. In a word, the exercise of responsible parenthood requires that husband and wife, keeping a right order of priorities, recognize their own duties toward God, themselves, their families and human society.

From this it follows that they are not free to act as they choose in the service of transmitting life,* as if it were holly up to them to decide what is the right course to follow.* On the contrary, they are bound to ensure that what they do corresponds to the will of God the Creator. The very nature of marriage and its use makes His will clear, while the constant teaching of the Church spells it out. (10)"

What came on the scene that was new was the hormonal “birth control pill”. What the study was to undertake was whether or not this new technology was permissible. Did it violate the Church’s teaching regarding contraception, or was it somehow different that conformed with the moral law? THAT was the question at hand.

I agree with this, although this study allowed great pondering across all forms of contraception. As saying yes to this form would cause a rethinking of Condoms and its impact on society after the Anglican Lambeth Conference, which had happened in 1930 and brought in all the ills associated with it. I believe the Church was trying to determine if the pill was just another piece of fruit from the same poisonous tree.

(Just like the Church later studied artificial reproductive technologies, some of which turned out to be moral methods of assisting couples and some of which turned out to be immoral and a violation of the sixth commandment.)

Can you please elaborate as I am curios here? Are you talking about brining someones natural functions back to order for reproduction, or some kind of human interference?

Now, from there, this “commission” went askew and off down the rabbit hole. That’s why the Pope rejected its findings and ultimately reaffirmed the Church’s teaching. In the end, the Pill was just like every other method that had come before it-- contraceptive.

100% Agree…

This implies that the Church’s teaching can change. This is not accurate. The Church’s teaching on contraception is immutable. The only thing up for discussion was whether or not this new technology was contraception. And, of course, it turns out it was.

100% Agree…

Now the Pope, in Humanae Vitae, did reiterate why contraception is immoral and the profoundly bad consequences its widespread acceptance in society would have.

His prophetic insight was laughed at during the time, but he was SO right…

Read Casti Connubii, Humanae Vitae, and works by Dr. Janet Smith.

All outstanding sources… I also like the web site “One More Soul” as they have some really good information on the Condom and the misinformation that PP and others put out about it.

onemoresoul.com/category/contraception

1KE, I liked and agreed with all of the information presented in your post…Thank You…, however I think as Catholics we need to make sure that when we talk of NFP that we make certain that our Sisters and Brothers understand it should be used pretty sparingly as a general rule.

God Bless You.

P.S. I am really curious about your thoughts on the medical procedures.

 

[Cheesedog34]

Interesting. This must have just been a drive-by posting. The OP joined on the 7th. Posted this on the 7th. And apparently hasn’t been back since that time. Oh, well.

Oh, I’ve been keeping up with this. Some posting have been enormously helpful. Others not so much.

I decided I was going to make sure the 8th graders knew exactly what the Church teaches on abortion and contraception and why. If they were to leave the class and not like it, decide to accept it, I was at least making sure they knew what their faith was teaching. It wasn’t well received.

This was the first year I ever taught ccd. I was shocked how little the kids knew about any part of their faith. I was most disturbed by this.

One student came to class and told me she told her mother what we were talking about and the mom thought it was totally inappropriate that we would take this topic on in ccd. Considering how little of the basics the kids knew, perhaps she was right.

I don’t think I will ever volunteer to teach ccd again.

Cheese

 

[Lypher]

Oh, I’ve been keeping up with this. Some posting have been enormously helpful. Others not so much.

I decided I was going to make sure the 8th graders knew exactly what the Church teaches on abortion and contraception and why. If they were to leave the class and not like it, decide to accept it, I was at least making sure they knew what their faith was teaching. It wasn’t well received.

This was the first year I ever taught ccd. I was shocked how little the kids knew about any part of their faith. I was most disturbed by this.

One student came to class and told me she told her mother what we were talking about and the mom thought it was totally inappropriate that we would take this topic on in ccd. Considering how little of the basics the kids knew, perhaps she was right.

I don’t think I will ever volunteer to teach ccd again.

Cheese

They will never learn unless you teach them… I hope you don’t quit…

 

[jmcrae]

They will never learn unless you teach them… I hope you don’t quit…

It is a very delicate thing to teach about sexuality to teenagers. Each teenager is at his or her own individual place in the journey. Yes, there are 12 year olds looking at pornography and experimenting with sex, but there are 16 year olds who have only the most hazy notion of what sex is, or how it works. You don’t want to go blowing away that second person’s innocence, just because you know of someone like the first person.

This is why you never do a session on sexuality without signed permission forms from the parents, ever.

 

[Lypher]

It is a very delicate thing to teach about sexuality to teenagers. Each teenager is at his or her own individual place in the journey. Yes, there are 12 year olds looking at pornography and experimenting with sex, but there are 16 year olds who have only the most hazy notion of what sex is, or how it works. You don’t want to go blowing away that second person’s innocence, just because you know of someone like the first person.

This is why you never do a session on sexuality without signed permission forms from the parents, ever.

Well you may be right were you are from. Please note I live in the Keys and so outlook and access to information is likely different. Out 7th Graders have sex ed in school and Key West is rife with Rainbow flags. That being said the youth already know about procreation, what the seem to lack is Church teaching. Silence For the Lambs…

You are right that it would be pretty easy to get a signed form. That being said I don’t think CCD is the place for sex ed, Just church teaching on marriage which includes sex. Contraception, Abortion, NFP, very broad brush strokes on why not how… just my opinion.

God Bless You…

 

[kage_ar]

Theology of the Body for teens.

 

[Lypher]

Theology of the Body for teens.

Wouldn’t that put a binder in some peoples shorts…

 

[markomalley]

I decided I was going to make sure the 8th graders knew exactly what the Church teaches on abortion and contraception and why. If they were to leave the class and not like it, decide to accept it, I was at least making sure they knew what their faith was teaching. It wasn’t well received.

This was the first year I ever taught ccd. I was shocked how little the kids knew about any part of their faith. I was most disturbed by this.

I don’t think I will ever volunteer to teach ccd again.

Cheese

Good. Glad you’re not a drive-by.

Frankly, I have been concerned with the quality of CCD teaching for a long, long time. That includes the religion class kids are being taught in Catholic schools, as well (in many cases).

I know that in the case of mine, I realized that what she was getting in Catholic school religion class was utterly inadequate (if not, in some cases, plain wrong). So I took the responsibility to teach her myself. I’m, thankfully, not the only one.

Unfortunately, as a CCD teacher, you have to deal with not only making up for teaching those kids a lot of what they should have learned when they were younger…you have to deal with parents who went through the same abysmal type of CCD as their kids. And, as you have learned with this lesson, who have been taught basic lessons of moral theology incorrectly from their youth, as well.

If you really want to get depressed about the situation, sometime read Pascendi Dominici Gregis (on the doctrine of the modernists), written by Pope St Pius X back in 1907. You will think that you are reading about the Church today, rather than about the Church back in the first decade of the last century.

If you can stand it, though, please keep teaching CCD. Although I don’t believe that anybody is asking you to sacrifice your soul for it, consider the souls of the kids you are teaching (and, perhaps, the souls of a couple of their parents, as well).

 

[Lypher]

Good. Glad you’re not a drive-by.

Frankly, I have been concerned with the quality of CCD teaching for a long, long time. That includes the religion class kids are being taught in Catholic schools, as well (in many cases).

I know that in the case of mine, I realized that what she was getting in Catholic school religion class was utterly inadequate (if not, in some cases, plain wrong). So I took the responsibility to teach her myself. I’m, thankfully, not the only one.

Unfortunately, as a CCD teacher, you have to deal with not only making up for teaching those kids a lot of what they should have learned when they were younger…you have to deal with parents who went through the same abysmal type of CCD as their kids. And, as you have learned with this lesson, who have been taught basic lessons of moral theology incorrectly from their youth, as well.

If you really want to get depressed about the situation, sometime read Pascendi Dominici Gregis (on the doctrine of the modernists), written by Pope St Pius X back in 1907. You will think that you are reading about the Church today, rather than about the Church back in the first decade of the last century.

If you can stand it, though, please keep teaching CCD. Although I don’t believe that anybody is asking you to sacrifice your soul for it, consider the souls of the kids you are teaching (and, perhaps, the souls of a couple of their parents, as well).

 

[jmcrae]

Wouldn’t that put a binder in some peoples shorts…

Give regular Theology of the Body to the parents, first, and then they’ll be more than happy to let you give their kids Theology of the Body for teens.

 

[Lypher]

Give regular Theology of the Body to the parents, first, and then they’ll be more than happy to let you give their kids Theology of the Body for teens.

 

[Highwayhound]

Oh, I’ve been keeping up with this. Some posting have been enormously helpful. Others not so much.

I decided I was going to make sure the 8th graders knew exactly what the Church teaches on abortion and contraception and why. If they were to leave the class and not like it, decide to accept it, I was at least making sure they knew what their faith was teaching. It wasn’t well received.

This was the first year I ever taught ccd. I was shocked how little the kids knew about any part of their faith. I was most disturbed by this.

One student came to class and told me she told her mother what we were talking about and the mom thought it was totally inappropriate that we would take this topic on in ccd. Considering how little of the basics the kids knew, perhaps she was right.

I don’t think I will ever volunteer to teach ccd again.

Cheese

Cheese,

You jumped right into the fire. I think 8th grade would be one of the toughest grades to teach for a first year teacher. Do you have any other teaching/coaching experience?

One thing I did which helped me was to watch one video about the Catholic faith each week for a year. After 52 weeks I had developed a good base from which to teach.

If the kids sense that you care and love them they will respond better to you as a teacher. Also, do not be afraid to allow joy to be exhibited in your classroom. One week two girls had the giggles. No amount of hushing could stop it so I let them giggle. The next week the two girls were back to their normal attentive selfs. One boy asked me how I could teach in a class like that. I told him it is okay to experience joy and to let others be joyful. What I have is a group of 7th graders which are willing to engage in conversations with me and in the process they learn more than if I simply dictate to them everything. It is always clear whom the leader of the classroom is, but they also know that I value their (name removed by moderator)ut and opinions.

If in the end you decide not to teach so be it, but if you would like some ideas on teaching and classroom management I am willing to give you the benefit of my experience. Feel fre to message me.

God bless

 

[Cheesedog34]

Another approach to bring to you students would be to point out that IF there had been one contraceptive act in their past then they would not be here. You can take this back to their parents, grandparents, great grandparents, and on. There might be nobody to fill their place or it might be someone with a completely different genetic makeup, but they would not be sitting in class this having this discussion.

One of the best things we can do for students is to give them somethings to ponder and think over with their brains.

Are you having a good time teaching this class?

God bless

Sadly, no, I’m not enjoying it. I guess i didn’t get into it for my enjoyment, but I did think I would like it much better than I am. I’m not a teacher by trade, but I thought it would be a better experience. I felt like i made absolutely no difference - never reached one kid not for one minute. I will not volunteer to teach again.