Penance and Punishment

[StephenL]

I was watching a new years taping of The Journey Home with the Bishop of Birmingham and they were discussing penance and how the Priest Penance may be different than God’s. So my question is if we to Confession and have penance from the Priest why does our Punishment go beyond the confessional especially for mortal sins?
Thank you
God Bless!

 

[Zekariya]

The priest gives us a penance for us to start working toward the remission of our temporal punishment.

Our penance, sufferings, prayers, and indulgences lessen some of our temporal punishment.

An indulgence can pay for part or all of our temporal punishments that we earn from sin that we commit. When we die, if we have not paid for all of our temporal punishments, we will pay for them in purgatory.

A partial indulgence remits part of our temporal punishment. A plenary indulgence remits all of our temporal punishment we have earned up to that point.

 

[JerryZ]

I was watching a new years taping of The Journey Home with the Bishop of Birmingham and they were discussing penance and how the Priest Penance may be different than God’s. So my question is if we to Confession and have penance from the Priest why does our Punishment go beyond the confessional especially for mortal sins?
Thank you
God Bless!

The priest is NOT God, he CAN be helped by the Holy Spirit to discern our attitude and repentance and such but he and we are NOT assured of that.
He mostly uses his knowledge and exeperience but again he is NOT GOD.

On the other hand GOD is justice and we will have to make up for any shortcomings when we were in front of the priest. (In purgatory most probably)

Peace

 

[Neofight]

The priest is NOT God, he CAN be helped by the Holy Spirit to discern our attitude and repentance and such but he and we are NOT assured of that.
He mostly uses his knowledge and exeperience but again he is NOT GOD.

On the other hand GOD is justice and we will have to make up for any shortcomings when we were in front of the priest. (In purgatory most probably)

Peace

Well, careful now. It’s much more than being helped by the Holy Spirit. The priest is, in the confessional, “in persona Christi”, which means he acts in the person of Christ when giving absolution.

 

[ready]

Every deliberately sinful thought, word, deed and omission must be atoned for. The penance given in confession is our means to do this. If our temporal punishment is so great, then we will need to atone for them by doing many extra penances. Indulgences are a great way to remove or to reduce temporal punishment. God bless you.

 

[JerryZ]

Well, careful now. It’s much more than being helped by the Holy Spirit. The priest is, in the confessional, “in persona Christi”, which means he acts in the person of Christ when giving absolution.

Well I certainly was not addressing THAT theological reality. Which I fully believe and assent to.

Peace

 

[Shin]

The amount of penance truly due our sins is as a general rule, always more than the priest gives in the confessional.

And so the faithful are expected to do more than what is assigned. One could think of what is assigned as a seed, a beginning of the work.

To get an idea of a more accurate amount due you could look at how the earlier Church handled penances. Rev. F.X. Schouppe, S.J. has also written on the subject of the length of purgatory.

 

[ready]

I was not trying to say in my first post that sacramental penances necessarily wipe away all temporal punishment, even if that’s how I came across… The penance given in confession is supposed to be commensurate with the sins confessed. If the priest gives the penitent a Rosary as a penance for his sins confessed, it is possible that this penance can atone for the sins confessed if it is truly commensurate with the sins confessed, is that not correct or possible? – who really knows if one’s penance is truly commensurate and atones for the sins confessed, but God. Unless the Church or her theologians have taught that penance given in confession never atone for all of one’s confessed sins, then I can not believe that sacramental penance always runs short of perfect atonement. Yes, we each should be punishing ourselves for our past sins every day, so that we will not have to be punished for them in Purgatory for the sins we have neglected to confess and for the sins we are unaware of and for the sins we have committed and have already confessed – I try to do this every day and am not relying solely on my sacramental penances, for I know that this is the right course of action to take. I am aware that the penance given in confession does not necessarily atone for all one’s sins confessed, but if the penance is truly commensurate with the sins confessed, then isn’t it possible that the penance could wipe away all of the temporal punishment associated with the sins confessed? It seems only logical that this would be the case.

 

[ready]

If a priest gives a penance in confession commensurate with the sins confessed by a penitent and the penitent performs the penance with a perfect love and a perfect sorrow, then all of the temporal punishment associated with his sins confessed can be remitted.

 

[paperwight66]

If a priest gives a penance in confession commensurate with the sins confessed by a penitent and the penitent performs the penance with a perfect love and a perfect sorrow, then all of the temporal punishment associated with his sins confessed can be remitted.

Then why doesn’t the Church teach we must go to confession every day and thus avoid Purgatory? Surely the Church doesn’t want anyone to go to Purgatory?

 

[ready]

Then why doesn’t the Church teach we must go to confession every day and thus avoid Purgatory? Surely the Church doesn’t want anyone to go to Purgatory?

I don’t understand what you are trying to say. Perhaps you have misunderstood what I have said in my last post?

 

[JerryZ]

Then why doesn’t the Church teach we must go to confession every day and thus avoid Purgatory? Surely the Church doesn’t want anyone to go to Purgatory?

Uhm I don’t know may be you have the wrong impression. ANY one in Purgatory is SAVED ie on his/her way to Heaven.

NO damnation for him/her.

You do not avoid purgatory by going to confession everyday but by being “Perfect”

Even if you DO go everyday to confession does that make you “perfect” not willing to sin anymore.
By sin I mean the most trivial of sins (Not heavy stuff).
In order to enter Heaven definitevily, we need to be scrubbed of this proclivety, tendency, this attachment we have to sin. Now If we attain to be “perfect” while still alive THAT would be the goal.
How’s that saying? The Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak

Peace

 

[paperwight66]

Uhm I don’t know may be you have the wrong impression. ANY one in Purgatory is SAVED ie on his/her way to Heaven.

NO damnation for him/her.

You do not avoid purgatory by going to confession everyday but by being “Perfect”

Even if you DO go everyday to confession does that make you “perfect” not willing to sin anymore.
By sin I mean the most trivial of sins (Not heavy stuff).
In order to enter Heaven definitevily, we need to be scrubbed of this proclivety, tendency, this attachment we have to sin. Now If we attain to be “perfect” while still alive THAT would be the goal.
How’s that saying? The Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak

But isn’t purgatory the suffering of temporal punishment that hasn’t been experienced during life?
So if going to confession means getting a penance which pays for the temporal punishment one would otherwise experience, the church should teach confession every day as a rule.
Which is a very badly expressed rhetorical question, querying the claim made earlier that the penance imposed during confession remits any temporal punishment which is owed.

Peace

 

[paperwight66]

Uhm I don’t know may be you have the wrong impression. ANY one in Purgatory is SAVED ie on his/her way to Heaven.

NO damnation for him/her.

You do not avoid purgatory by going to confession everyday but by being “Perfect”

Even if you DO go everyday to confession does that make you “perfect” not willing to sin anymore.
By sin I mean the most trivial of sins (Not heavy stuff).
In order to enter Heaven definitevily, we need to be scrubbed of this proclivety, tendency, this attachment we have to sin. Now If we attain to be “perfect” while still alive THAT would be the goal.
How’s that saying? The Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak

Peace

I totally agree with you. What I was questioning was the claim made earlier, that the penance received in confession remits temporal punishment (given certain conditions).
If time in Purgatory is paying off any outstanding temporal punishment, which seems to be what is said in any explanation of indulgences. then logically the more often we go to confession the better.

But the church does not teach we should go every day. So my conclusion is that there is not such a direct relationship between penances, temporal punishment., indulgences and time in purgatory.

 

[ready]

Dear paperwright66,

Penance in confession definitely remits temporal punishment – though not necessarily all of one’s temporal punishment. The only way for all of one’s temporal punishment to be remitted is for a person to have perfect charity with perfect sorrow for all of one’s sins, or for a person to receive a plenary indulgence. Mind you, I believe it is more the exception than the norm for a person to have **perfect **charity and perfect sorrow for all their sins. God bless you.