People of all different religions love God.. so why do so many people end up in Hell?

[distracted]

You haven’t proven your premise that “so many” people end up in hell. Have you been there? How do you know this?

Edwin

technically i cannot prove it… not to anyone’s satisfaction save my own…

I am convinced because of my experiences in life and what i have learned through reading, etc…

i could never begin to explain to you or make it clear to you all that i have experienced and learned so as to convince you or anyone else that there is a Hell and that many go there… I have read of many saints who say that many go there. I trust the saints… and again, could never prove to you or anyone WHY i trust them… Suffice it to say that my experiences in life alone would cause me to trust them on this and virtually everything else… (also Jesus said that there are many who will try to enter Heaven but will not be “strong enough” (St Lk 13:24… st Mt 7:13,20)

Yes, i have been to “hell” as a matter of fact (small h rather than cap H)…

again, very long story … :banghead:uch::hypno:

 

[distracted]

Souls go to Hell because they don’t want to be with God. They hate Him so much that they don’t want to be with Him for all eternity. At the moment of death they used their will in opposition to the will of God. God’s will is for us to be with Him in Heaven, but for the souls of the damned, they chose not to be with Him. They are the ones who put themselves into Hell, not God. They are the ones who separated themselves from God. They willed to be in Hell; it is not God’s will for them. If a person lived his life in sin but at the moment of death he/she accepted God’s grace and ask for forgiveness and that being said, chooses to be with God, then he/she will not go to Hell.

I think we should not forget how merciful God is. God’s justice always comes with mercy, and God’s mercy always comes with justice. One cannot exist without the other.

Also, love is the way to Heaven. If a person, at the moment of death, has a little love for God in his/her heart, that love will be enough to avoid Hell because that person, with a little love, will choose to be with the One he/she loves.

i agree w/ everything but the last sentence… paragraph

just loving God is not enough. In fact in today’s Mass readings God speaks of those who love Him AND keep His commandments… those are the ones who are in his favor…

like i said in OP it is easy to love God at least most of the time…

If a person “loved God” and yet didn’t keep his commandmnets… and when he died still didn’t repent of his evils, he would not go to Heaven or Purgatory… because he is in total agreement w/ his sins, as it were… does not reject them or wish to be purified of them…

It is very dangerous to bleieve and/or teach that just loving God saves one from Hell…

 

[distracted]

Purgatory does have a nice ring to it. I am surprised it is only a Catholic teaching. I would think most believers would be all for it.

i would believe on logic alone…

how can any sinner, when he dies, whether repentent or not… go directly into the presence of an absolutely HOly and perfectly Good God…?

the ugliness has to go…

thank God for the Real Presence… Holiness that we humans have access to NOW…

 

[distracted]

A man dies and sits before God. The man now knows that there is an afterlife and there is a God. His whole life is laid before him and he can clearly see all the wrongs that he has done, the petty, selfish deeds, all the acts against his fellow man and the God that created him. He feels like dirt, he missed the purpose of life and now it is too late. He knows, can see with his very eyes there is a God, but he still doesn’t believe in His mercy and wills himself to a place without such a God because he deems himself unworthy.

I sure this is not Church teaching but I also don’t know where to put a thought like this: That man wills himself to Hell not because of specifically going against God but because he doesn’t believe in His mercy.

If we not believing in His mercy we not believing in Jesus Christ and no one gets to the Father except through Him.

Just a thought I had while reading the thread.

your words are powerful… have had this kind of thing revealed to me before… but kinda “forgot” and was kind of “distracted”… :hypno:

God did (does) everything he can to get us to Heaven (sent his son, established His infallible Church…)… If we miss the boat it is definitely in no way God’s fault…

.

thank you so much for this post… it is awesome…

 

[distracted]

An experiment:

• Imagine a religion where there was no continuous threat of Hell, from the moment you were born.
• How much power would the men and women who run the religion have over their people without that threat?

Now ask yourself, who told YOU that many people end up in Hell?

i think Post 21 and 22 answer this…

if you are saying that the Church uses Hell to keep people “in line” well, you are partly correct…

but your implication that it does so for evil motives… is not correct…

and you don’t know Catholicism…

 

[chosen_people]

maybe… maybe not…

yes and no.

It is true that knowledge of ( belief in ) Heaven & Hell can keep a person on the right track (limit his “freedom” so called) … which makes it so important for us to share waht we know with others…

but God would not have visited and spoken w/ Moses… or sent the prophets or Jesus to us if it weren’t for the importance of us conforming ourselves to God’s laws… & the absolute necessity of doing so…

If your parent tells you not to touch the hot burner on the stove and you do it anyway & get burnt… it is not your freedom of lack thereof that is the problem… You had the freedom to obey or disobey… and it is NOT the parent’s fault what you chose to do… Jesus came to warn us of Hell… and he speaks of Hell more than Heaven…

If you know with absolute certainty that you will burn yourself if you touch the stove then you no longer have real free choice. The child touches the stove anyway because he does not grasp or does not accept the consequence of his touching the stove. In as much as I understand your religion, Catholicism believes that even after “touching the stove” true remorse and repentance may change those consequences.

 

[distracted]

In my experience it is NOT easy to love God. If it was then everyone who was Christian would go to heaven. But even amongst the faithful there are those that fall away. This is because loving God also comes with obeying him. What is easy is to pay lip service to God, but to love him…well that is another story.

i have loved God all my life… but there have been times when i couldn’t take what was happening to me and i “hated” Him… or so i thought…

I have often gotten the thought that i don’t want to do His will anymore… I am human…

true, i never left him for more than a few minutes… to speak of… never sinned against him even when i was angry (unles you call it a sin to be totally honest and tell Him you hate Him…because… blah blah blah…? I call this just “communicating” with Him, which is, of course, just telling Him what He already knows anyway… and being myself… He certainly doesn’t want me to be someone else… [except to ditch my sins, that is…])

anyway… I find it rather easy to lov God most of the time… and yet any # of times when i didn’t love him… (because i didn’t UNDERSTAND Him…) i could have … gone w/ my feelings of “hate”… and whatever… and i suppose i could have stayed there…

Fear of God really ***is ***the beginning of all wisdom… as the Word tells us…

Who are we to STAY angry and hateful with God?? We are so finite, so needy… so powerless…

as the Word says "What do you have that you have not been given?"

 

[distracted]

distracted
i have to admit that it is difficult for me to always believe in an eternal Hell… temporary Hell (otherwise known as purgatory) is not hard for me to believe in ONE BIT… but permanent Hell… hmmm… I believe it in my head… have no problem in my head beliving…

but in my heart… well, something seems kind of… ungodly about it…

Rory
Hi distracted. I came across an author today who suggested a view of Hell that I had never really considered in quite this way before: —The Creator and the Creature, Fr. Frederick Faber, 1856, TAN Publishers reprint 1978, p. 268, 269

It may be that isolated from the rest of the book, these comments will seem less powerful. Fr. Faber has been finding God’s love for us everywhere. Of course, Hell might be the last place one should look for love. But even in that most terrible place, we can with the eyes of faith see God’s love for us in our weakness and woundedness. If it doesn’t help, I understand. Possibly Fr. Faber waxes poetic and perhaps overly optimistic at times…but on the other hand, I shudder to think how much love for God I might ever have learned, or how easy it could be to stumble mortally even now, if I had no acquaintance with the schoolmaster of holy fear.

God bless us and increase our faith…

Rory

gotta go…

but this brought tears to my eyes…

God bless…

(loved tht quote by the priest)…

 

[Richard_Kastner]

I was reading through this post trying to find someone to answer when I realised that everyone, at least everyone that I read, seems to have it wrong.

Here’s Matt7:13Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

It says here not that some won’t make it, but most won’t make it and in Matt7:22 it says

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

So the very things that these people were doing that they thought were pleasing to God were called iniquity by Jesus. Well, what were those things. I’m sure they were doing many of the things that people on this post say are ways to get to heaven. They were probably loving one another. They were probably keeping the commandments. They were probably being good people (at least what they thought was good). But the bottom line is that there is nothing that we can do that is good enough to get us into heaven. The absolute only way to heaven is faith in what Jesus Christ has done for us on the cross.
Jn.14:6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

 

[RoryMcKenzie56]

distracted
Fear of God really ***is ***the beginning of all wisdom… as the Word tells us…

Who are we to STAY angry and hateful with God?? We are so finite, so needy… so powerless…

Rory
I have to say a little more about this wonderful book by Fr. Faber.

I am gratified that short quote from Fr. Faber resonated with you. The Name of the book again is The Creator and the Creature. But the subtitle is illuminating. *The Wonders of Divine Love. *The first half of the book took a few weeks, you know, spiritual reading before bed type stuff. It was good and true but being a reminder of our position in the Cosmos, being created beings with no more rights than minerals or vegetables. It was true and perhaps motivating by way of duty with the certain knowledge that we are utterly dependent and obliged to God. I almost read out of duty. Heh. But the second half has been entirely different!

In the second half Father, after having shown what true justice would require of those who would be dutiful, he begins to number the ways and pains this Creator has taken to be generous to those who are so prone to forget their obligations or abuse His gifts. It is nothing more than a sober, common sense reflection upon the truths of our holy faith that is as equally true as the first half in which we were reminded of our obligations. The difference is that reflection upon these truths are not motivating only by way of mere duty, but more by way of gratitude and love for how dearly generous and forbearing God has been, and promises to be to us all along life’s way.

Gotta go myself…Its barbecue day and time for a few beers and wonderful times with family. Praise be to the good God who marks our every moment with opportunities to please Him, and for being so very very easily pleased with our slightest movements of affection for Him.

Rory

 

[StrawberryJam]

If you believe in purgatory why do you believe many are in hell?

 

[geometer]

.

It’s easy to love God… How can a person not? He made this beautiful world, he gave us each other

(thanks a lot, God… )

so anyhow…

apparently loving God is not enough to get us into Heaven… Even atheists love God to some extent because they love (appreciate) what God has created (sex, etc)

John Edward, who is a natural medium, has found many people on the other side, so to speak, who don’t seem to be in hell, who were non-believers in this life.

I think this is great support for the wisdom of God. God evidently does not expect us to adopt all of the right oppinions…

 

[juliamajor]

Your evidence, Is a medium?

 

[geometer]

Your evidence, Is a medium?

Sometimes you simply have to trust that there are honest people, without rushing to judgement.

What is your evidence about the after life?

 

[distracted]

If you know with absolute certainty that you will burn yourself if you touch the stove then you no longer have real free choice.

God never intended that we have absolute freedom except in Heaven… We have absolute freedom to do whatever we want on Earth but we do not have asolute freedom from consequences… . a person can think tht fornication is OK but Wait till he/she suffers the consequences… Of course these days people think that ignoring such consequences (for such a seemingly harmless sin… if they call it sin at alll) makes them go away… How delusional…

The child touches the stove anyway because he does not grasp or does not accept the consequence of his touching the stove. In as much as I understand your religion, Catholicism believes that even after “touching the stove” true remorse and repentance may change those consequences.

well, a burnt hand is hard to make right again (depending on the extent of the damage…) some people are so foolish about sin that they seem to keep “putting t heir hand to the hot burner” as it were… thinking that if they just do it enough they’ll get used to it and then maybe it won’t hurt so much… all the while they build callouses that harden and destroy the ability to feel pain… and in the end their hand doesn’t look so good… or function very well…

thank God for Purgatory … the Real Presence…

God can, through Christ & our submission to Him, fix the damage but the more sin, the more work you both have to do… and one must remember that “God’s spirit will not always strive with man…” There comes a point where a soul can choose sin so much as to become virtually hopeless… (although with God all things are possible…) A person can get to where he/she has blashphemed the Holy Spirit… become so hard can’t receive Christ…

 

[distracted]

I was reading through this post trying to find someone to answer when I realised that everyone, at least everyone that I read, seems to have it wrong.

Here’s Matt7:13Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

It says here not that some won’t make it, but most won’t make it and in Matt7:22 it says

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

So the very things that these people were doing that they thought were pleasing to God were called iniquity by Jesus. Well, what were those things. I’m sure they were doing many of the things that people on this post say are ways to get to heaven. They were probably loving one another. They were probably keeping the commandments. They were probably being good people (at least what they thought was good). But the bottom line is that there is nothing that we can do that is good enough to get us into heaven. The absolute only way to heaven is faith in what Jesus Christ has done for us on the cross.
Jn.14:6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

it seems YOU are missing something…

for one hting, since you value the bible and (likely) the bible alone… Where does it SAY this in Scripture… that FAITH alone is what gets you to Heaven???

This makes no sense even when using strictly biblical quotes to explain

… Have you read the Bible??

When someone asked Jesus what must he do to gain eternal life He said Obey the Commandments… and then in order to be perfect (Be perfect as your father in Heaven is perfect St Mt 5:48?) go give your possessions to the poor and follow Me…

the reason those who did “great deeds” in his name were not saved is because we must not just do ONLY certain good deeds… we must do everything Jesus says… (and btw: Jesus said far more than what is contained in written Sctipture… which is why He gave us the Church).

One thing Jesus wants(that isn’t mentioned specifically in scripture) is: We must purify ourselves… (Rev 21:27) and be ONE with Christ… (which is what purifies)

you can go out and preach to the world and do these mighty deeds Jesus mentions … cast out demons…etc but if you do not LOVE JEsus and put Him first every step of the way of your life, in every detail of your life (or try to) … you won’t make it… possibly anyone who reads the Word over someone who is possessed or (and/or ) recites the rosary, etc… can cast out demons… (a great deed) but if that person doesn’t do *all *the other things Jesus requires, he won’t make it…

I know people who claim to have faith in God and His son… and they do certain things “right”… but they do (say) atrocious things to their brothers and sisters… violating Mt 25:31 and a whole slew of other psgs…

Faith alone is nothing… even the demons believe & tremble… (James 2:12)

 

[distracted]

distracted

It was good and true but being a reminder of our position in the Cosmos, being created beings with no more rights than minerals or vegetables.
Rory

everything you said made sense except this…

 

[distracted]

If you believe in purgatory why do you believe many are in hell?

this question doesn’t make a lot of sense to me… just because there’s purgatory doesn’t mean a lot of souls are going to go there… although the saints say that most who go to Heaven go to Purg before entering Heaven…

all Christians are in purgatory before Heaven… some just do their purgation here on Earth which is what God prefers… and wht we would prefer also if we knew what “was coming”…

Purgatory is supposed to be excrutiating… and i know it is… because… I have been made aware of God’s absolute holiness in many ways (rosary, the Real Presence…experience, etc.)…

i pray we are all offering up our sufferings in expiation for our sins… we can offer up every suffering we encounter… even mosquito bites… :etc…

 

[distracted]

John Edward, who is a natural medium, has found many people on the other side, so to speak, who don’t seem to be in hell, who were non-believers in this life.

I think this is great support for the wisdom of God. God evidently does not expect us to adopt all of the right oppinions…

i wouldn’t trust some human, whoever this Edwards is…

and yet it wouldn’t surprise me that non-belivers would be in purgatory, assuming tht is what mr Edwards is saying or implying…

if a non-beliver takes care of others (st Mt 25:31)… avoids evil… etc… well… God gives everyone a little of His Spirit even when they are not in His Church… and then there are some IN the Church who seem to have lost all or most of His Spirit… just being honest…

In any case, we just can’t trust other humans to clear these kinds of matters up… best policy is Better safe than sorry…

and besides, (as some posters seem to think?) becoming what Jesus wants (requires) is NOT all “hell” on Earth…or even all purgatory with no joy… even though a lot of the time it is because - for one thing, not everyone believes the way we do… or lives remotely like we Christians do… That’s hell on Earth to be sure…

I’ve read stories about after-life experiences and some books seem to speak only of a person (who almost dies) going into a pleasant reality… not wanting to go back… etc… but tht doesn’t mean that the person STAYS in that pleasant reality… (what some imply is Heaven) … Everyone at death goes to meet God but i doubt they necessrily stay with HIm… once they see their sins and the awful consequences their sins have had on themselves and others they likely don’t want to be with God any longer (?)… Some cannot stand holiness so they likely pitch themselves into (wherever) to get away from such absolute Holiness/Goodness… They didn’t pursue holiness / goodness in this life much so… they can’t stand it in the next… so they don’t go directly to Heaven… or at all… Hopefully they go to Purgatory… (assuming they are at least somewhat repentent)…

again, why take chances… ? People seem to be busy with just about everything these days except working out their salvation w/ fear & trembling. (phil 2:12)

 

[RoryMcKenzie56]

everything you said made sense except this…

*It was good and true but being a reminder of our position in the Cosmos, being created beings with no more rights than minerals or vegetables. *
Rory

Allow me to clarify.

The point is that all creatures with the exception of man invariably fulfill the purpose for which they were made. Along with some of the angels, only man has ever disobeyed God. Certainly God has granted us higher faculties, greater dignity, and potential for participation in the divine nature, but none of this changes our essential common ground with rocks and carrots, our createdness. We have no standing whereby we may approach God with any complaint. We come from Him, belong to Him, and go to Him along with the rest of Creation. In 1856 Fr. Faber was living in an age that was obsessed with the rights of man in the political realm and he thought that it was beginning to spill over into the spiritual realm. People seemed to him to be forgetful of what it means to be created, wholly contingent beings, dependent upon God from the very beginning of their existence.

My intent was not to suggest that the citizen of any particular state should have a standing in civil law equal to a bed of potatoes. But justice recognizes that our position as creatures with the Creator involve only obligations on behalf the creature and rights on behalf the Creator. The beautiful part of it though, is that in His wonderful generosity, the Creator seems to have an incorrigible love for us. If we will, He adopts his wildest and most unruly creatures to be His very own children, which of course involves certain rights and privileges which we do not deserve at all!

Thanks for letting me clarify…I hope it makes more sense now.

Rory