V
vocatio
Guest
You mean there’s an abridged bible?
- Status
V
vocatio
Guest
Salve,
I had this elaborate illustration planned out, but find this way to over the top. Charity begins by planting a seed and letting got to the growning.
I’m a fundamentalist converted back to Catholicism once I realized the bible only thing don’t work.
Righteousone
Stop testing the Lord. We do not know the Fathers plan. I left 17 years in all sencerity thinking convinced by fundamentalist…my wife and her family…that the Catholic Church is apostate…or as you guys love to say…“the whore of Babylon”. It took God’s grace with a sencere love of God that ended up bringing me home. My name is on the priest abuse list as a victim. People run for various reasons. It’s call self-preservation. Had our conversion priest reacted the way you did we would most likely not be sitting in our Parish church today. My wife, also a victim in a fundamentalist church, would never have accepted the priesthood had he been like describe your own actions. However, I’m with you, just stay away from insulting others. Remember, it’s not you that’s doing the conversion, that is God…the Holy Spirit. Give credit where it is due. Keep up the good work defending the faith, just think about doing it charitably while you are doing it. Just because someone deals you a right cross doesn’t mean you give it back. Accept it as a suffering…ofer it up to God for that person’s sake.
O Bone Iusus, libera nos peccasi nostra, libera no abignibus gehaene, perduc in paradisimus omnes animas presertim, eas que plus misericoriae tua indegent…
spelling is most likely off but you get the point.
PAX et bonum
PAX tecum
PAX vobiscum
I had this elaborate illustration planned out, but find this way to over the top. Charity begins by planting a seed and letting got to the growning.
I’m a fundamentalist converted back to Catholicism once I realized the bible only thing don’t work.
Righteousone
Stop testing the Lord. We do not know the Fathers plan. I left 17 years in all sencerity thinking convinced by fundamentalist…my wife and her family…that the Catholic Church is apostate…or as you guys love to say…“the whore of Babylon”. It took God’s grace with a sencere love of God that ended up bringing me home. My name is on the priest abuse list as a victim. People run for various reasons. It’s call self-preservation. Had our conversion priest reacted the way you did we would most likely not be sitting in our Parish church today. My wife, also a victim in a fundamentalist church, would never have accepted the priesthood had he been like describe your own actions. However, I’m with you, just stay away from insulting others. Remember, it’s not you that’s doing the conversion, that is God…the Holy Spirit. Give credit where it is due. Keep up the good work defending the faith, just think about doing it charitably while you are doing it. Just because someone deals you a right cross doesn’t mean you give it back. Accept it as a suffering…ofer it up to God for that person’s sake.
O Bone Iusus, libera nos peccasi nostra, libera no abignibus gehaene, perduc in paradisimus omnes animas presertim, eas que plus misericoriae tua indegent…
spelling is most likely off but you get the point.
PAX et bonum
PAX tecum
PAX vobiscum
P
Pier
Guest
Remember a few years ago when one publisher (who shall remain unnamed) tried to condense it even further, but it didn’t sell well? They left in only the parts they considered important…You mean there’s an abridged bible?
You can’t make this stuff up.
R
Ronald_E
Guest
Righteousone, I can’t sleep and got up about 4 am. I have looked at your thread and had some thoughts about anger and those who leave Catholicism.
Anger influenced me to leave when I was 18 and Grace brought me home 40 years later. I have posted this elsewhere. My anger was related to being very sensitive and introverted; which I know now is a blessing but in the past I thought it was a weakness and a curse. Introverts are very passionate people who appear to have an innate sense of morality and a sense of how we are to treat one another. This influences the introvert to observe how fragile human relationships are and causes them to go into hiding to protect themselves in a world that is controlled by the extrovert who tends to be more aggressive and less sensitive to the needs of others.
Every introvert is going to have a lot of fear and rage because they will not fit in like the general population. It is difficult for introverts to develop the social skills that extroverts seem to easily express. There will be fear of others and self-hatred that is repressed in the psyche of the introvert. However, the core feeling of the introvert is intense pain and loneliness associated with the shame of not being good enough.
I am trying to keep this short. The protection against shame is anger. When my rage first came out it was expressed in my early 30’s through the use of f-bombs. This was expressed to a WW II fighter pilot whose company had joined the company I worked for and he was trying to establish his authority over me. Growth is not graceful.
I have the sense that the woman you encountered is an introvert who has not explored her hatred very much. I also sense that you are an introvert because of your passion for our faith. Introverts are extremely sensitive to rejection and any facial expression or tone of voice can trigger the history of pain and rejection in their lives and it can be associated with the person present at that time. You happen to be the lucky one.
What every introvert wants to know is are we loveable or will you love me if you see this ugliness in me that I cannot even love?
I am done for now. I hope this makes sense.
Anger influenced me to leave when I was 18 and Grace brought me home 40 years later. I have posted this elsewhere. My anger was related to being very sensitive and introverted; which I know now is a blessing but in the past I thought it was a weakness and a curse. Introverts are very passionate people who appear to have an innate sense of morality and a sense of how we are to treat one another. This influences the introvert to observe how fragile human relationships are and causes them to go into hiding to protect themselves in a world that is controlled by the extrovert who tends to be more aggressive and less sensitive to the needs of others.
Every introvert is going to have a lot of fear and rage because they will not fit in like the general population. It is difficult for introverts to develop the social skills that extroverts seem to easily express. There will be fear of others and self-hatred that is repressed in the psyche of the introvert. However, the core feeling of the introvert is intense pain and loneliness associated with the shame of not being good enough.
I am trying to keep this short. The protection against shame is anger. When my rage first came out it was expressed in my early 30’s through the use of f-bombs. This was expressed to a WW II fighter pilot whose company had joined the company I worked for and he was trying to establish his authority over me. Growth is not graceful.
I have the sense that the woman you encountered is an introvert who has not explored her hatred very much. I also sense that you are an introvert because of your passion for our faith. Introverts are extremely sensitive to rejection and any facial expression or tone of voice can trigger the history of pain and rejection in their lives and it can be associated with the person present at that time. You happen to be the lucky one.
What every introvert wants to know is are we loveable or will you love me if you see this ugliness in me that I cannot even love?
I am done for now. I hope this makes sense.
O
onenow1
Guest
Hi, righteousone
O Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek to be comforted as to comfort, to be understood as to understand, to be loved as to love.
Because it is in giving that we receive, it is in pardoning that we are pardoned,and it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.
Peace,OneNow1
PS. If your friend knows this prayer already, a reminder would not hurt.
Code:
Prayer of St. Fransis
_____________________________________
Lord make me an instrument of your peace.
where there is hatred let me sow love.
where there is injury pardon.
where there is doubt faith.
where there is despair hope.
where there is darkness light.
where there is sadness joy.Because it is in giving that we receive, it is in pardoning that we are pardoned,and it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.
Peace,OneNow1
PS. If your friend knows this prayer already, a reminder would not hurt.
P
Pinkyyy
Guest
Righteous, she had no right to speak to you that way and she was getting too emotional. But, and this is not my agreeing with her, there is nothing you can do to convince her - nor should you (you wouldn’t like if if she were trying to convince you to leave Catholicism). Nobody should be arguing with someone over which is right because each believes they are right - no one has a right to try to make someone switch religions. You can not make her see that you are right (nor can we make you see).
That being said, you are both right. The writings are religious, but the roman pontiff did decide which books were “right” (by his standards) because there was divide through some Catholics then.
S
Salamander
Guest
**
As for the Messianic prophecies of the Christ:
Acts 17:1-13
"When they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia, they came to Thessalonica, where there was a Jewish synagogue. 2. As his custom was, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures, 3. explaining and proving that the Christ had to suffer and rise from the dead. “This Jesus I am proclaiming to you is the Christ,” he said. 4.Some of the Jews were persuaded and joined Paul and Silas, as did a large number of God-fearing Greeks and not a few prominent women.
But not all of the Thessalonians agreed:
(Paul next gets to Athens and wow, it really gets interesting especially when we consider houses of worship, idols, man’s accomplishments, etc.)
Acts 17: 24-31
24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’
(and why you ask?)
29 “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by man’s design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.”
Divine Intervention Anyone? Anyone?
When we put other “men and women” like Joseph and Mary on a pedestal, we take away the authority of the one God (3-in-one) whom we worship. I understand we will not agree on this one, but it don’t hurt to try!That gives us the “how.” What did they find written in there? Did they find explicit information about Jesus, or just that St. Paul’s accounts of Christ don’t contradict the Messianic prophecies?
What in the world are you talking about?
As for the Messianic prophecies of the Christ:
Acts 17:1-13
"When they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia, they came to Thessalonica, where there was a Jewish synagogue. 2. As his custom was, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures, 3. explaining and proving that the Christ had to suffer and rise from the dead. “This Jesus I am proclaiming to you is the Christ,” he said. 4.Some of the Jews were persuaded and joined Paul and Silas, as did a large number of God-fearing Greeks and not a few prominent women.
But not all of the Thessalonians agreed:
- But the Jews were jealous; so they rounded up some bad characters from the marketplace, formed a mob and started a riot in the city. They rushed to Jason’s house in search of Paul and Silas in order to bring them out to the crowd. 6. But when they did not find them, they dragged Jason and some other brothers before the city officials, shouting: “These men who have caused trouble all over the world have now come here, 7. and Jason has welcomed them into his house. They are all defying Caesar’s decrees, saying that there is another king, one called Jesus.” 8. When they heard this, the crowd and the city officials were thrown into turmoil. 9. Then they made Jason and the others post bond and let them go.
- As soon as it was night, the brothers sent Paul and Silas away to Berea. On arriving there, they went to the Jewish synagogue. 11. Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. 12.Many of the Jews believed, as did also a number of prominent Greek women and many Greek men. 13. When the Jews in Thessalonica learned that Paul was preaching the word of God at Berea, they went there too, agitating the crowds and stirring them up." (I didn’t say it, God says it.)
(Paul next gets to Athens and wow, it really gets interesting especially when we consider houses of worship, idols, man’s accomplishments, etc.)
Acts 17: 24-31
24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’
(and why you ask?)
29 “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by man’s design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.”
Divine Intervention Anyone? Anyone?
P
Pier
Guest
We take away from God because we respect those who lived their lives for Him alone, setting exemplary examples for us?** When we put other “men and women” like Joseph and Mary on a pedestal, we take away the authority of the one God (3-in-one) whom we worship. I understand we will not agree on this one, but it don’t hurt to try!
As for the Messianic prophecies of the Christ:
Acts 17:1-13
"When they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia, they came to Thessalonica, where there was a Jewish synagogue. 2. As his custom was, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures, 3. explaining and proving that the Christ had to suffer and rise from the dead. “This Jesus I am proclaiming to you is the Christ,” he said. 4.Some of the Jews were persuaded and joined Paul and Silas, as did a large number of God-fearing Greeks and not a few prominent women.
But not all of the Thessalonians agreed:
In Berea
- But the Jews were jealous; so they rounded up some bad characters from the marketplace, formed a mob and started a riot in the city. They rushed to Jason’s house in search of Paul and Silas in order to bring them out to the crowd. 6. But when they did not find them, they dragged Jason and some other brothers before the city officials, shouting: “These men who have caused trouble all over the world have now come here, 7. and Jason has welcomed them into his house. They are all defying Caesar’s decrees, saying that there is another king, one called Jesus.” 8. When they heard this, the crowd and the city officials were thrown into turmoil. 9. Then they made Jason and the others post bond and let them go.
(The message: the Bereans eagerly accepted Paul’s teachings about Jesus; some, some of the Thessalonians, did not. They were [some of the] Jews, not the Greeks.)
- As soon as it was night, the brothers sent Paul and Silas away to Berea. On arriving there, they went to the Jewish synagogue. 11. Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. 12.Many of the Jews believed, as did also a number of prominent Greek women and many Greek men. 13. When the Jews in Thessalonica learned that Paul was preaching the word of God at Berea, they went there too, agitating the crowds and stirring them up." (I didn’t say it, God says it.)
(Paul next gets to Athens and wow, it really gets interesting especially when we consider houses of worship, idols, man’s accomplishments, etc.)
Acts 17: 24-31
24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’
(and why you ask?)
29 “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by man’s design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead.”
Divine Intervention Anyone? Anyone?
Do you have any pictures of loved ones in your home? Are you reminded of your love and fondness for them when you see them?
A photo is a flat image of someone’s likeness. And do you ask people to pray for you? One reformed friend calls it a prayer chain - why would it be different asking a saint to pray** for **us?
My goodness, and I guess you don’t go to Church, either…
A question for you: What did Christ mean when He said: This is my Body, This is my Blood, and do this in memory of Me? at the Last Supper…
Are you aware that this sacrament is offered everyday in the Daily Mass? As per His instructions? We are the temple of the Lord, and He is housed in the tabernacle, encased within finely crafted metals created by the Lord - the same type of metals which had been offered to Him by the three wise men from the east upon His birth, along with incense and fine oils. Why would offering the finest things of this earth to the Lord be an insult to Him? Please remember, the Lord was pleased when He was offered the best gifts from His faithful, not the worst…
Please consider these questions, and their answers…
God bless you!
O
onenow1
Guest
Hi, Salamander
Originally Posted by Salamander
When we put other “men and women” like Joseph and Mary on a pedestal, we take away the authority of the one God (3-in-one) whom we worship. I understand we will not agree on this one, but it don’t hurt to try!
Quote= OneNow1: Notice what God says to Cain, after he slew Abel.
10 And the LORD said, "What have you done? The voice of your brother’s blood is crying to me from the ground.
Quote= OneNow1:Sounds like a Abel is petitioning God to me.
Our hope here is that abel was his brother’s keeper in heaven. Unlike Cain, who didn’t care.
Peace, OneNow1 :twocents:
Originally Posted by Salamander
When we put other “men and women” like Joseph and Mary on a pedestal, we take away the authority of the one God (3-in-one) whom we worship. I understand we will not agree on this one, but it don’t hurt to try!
Quote= OneNow1: Notice what God says to Cain, after he slew Abel.
Genesis 4: 9-10.
9 Then the LORD said to Cain, “Where is Abel your brother?” He said, “I do not know; am I my brother’s keeper?”10 And the LORD said, "What have you done? The voice of your brother’s blood is crying to me from the ground.
Quote= OneNow1:Sounds like a Abel is petitioning God to me.
Our hope here is that abel was his brother’s keeper in heaven. Unlike Cain, who didn’t care.
Peace, OneNow1 :twocents:
R
Ronald_E
Guest
Salamander, We did not put Joseph and Mary on a pedastal, God did. God especially chose Mary to be the Mother of Jesus our Savior. Do you know that mothers retain the cells of their children in their bodies throughout their lives after giving birth to them. What does that say about Mary?
Actually, this thought occurred to me the other day. The only way I came to begin to appreciate Mary as the Mother of God was through the Sacrament of Communion which I began to receive again three years ago after a 40 year journey in the desert.
Grace returned me to Jesus and about a year later He began to teach me about His Mother who is now my spiritual Mother. However, without the Eucharist it seems beyond reason to comprehend.
Actually, this thought occurred to me the other day. The only way I came to begin to appreciate Mary as the Mother of God was through the Sacrament of Communion which I began to receive again three years ago after a 40 year journey in the desert.
Grace returned me to Jesus and about a year later He began to teach me about His Mother who is now my spiritual Mother. However, without the Eucharist it seems beyond reason to comprehend.
J
jmcrae
Guest
I disagree. Does the Queen take away from God by being greater than us? Does the President of the United States take away from God by being the most powerful man on earth?
We don’t have to keep ourselves low, or force others to become low, in case they over-top God, because it is simply not possible to over-top God - no human being, no matter how much greater she is than I am, will ever be greater than God, or ever come anywhere close to threatening His greatness.
In this, there is great freedom. We are free to be great, and also to be recognized as great, because God is so much greater than us that He has nothing to fear from our greatness - or from Mother Mary’s greatness, nor than of St. Joseph or any other Saint.
In Berea
- As soon as it was night, the brothers sent Paul and Silas away to Berea. On arriving there, they went to the Jewish synagogue. 11. Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. 12.Many of the Jews believed, as did also a number of prominent Greek women and many Greek men. 13. When the Jews in Thessalonica learned that Paul was preaching the word of God at Berea, they went there too, agitating the crowds and stirring them up." (I didn’t say it, God says it.)
You’re dancing around my question.Divine Intervention Anyone? Anyone?
Were the Bereans convinced by Scripture Alone, or by the Holy Tradition of the Catholic Church as given to them by St. Paul plus Scripture?
(And if they were convinced by Scripture Alone, why do we not see Jews being converted to Christianity in their synagogues, where they read out daily the self-same Scriptures that the Bereans read?
S
Salamander
Guest
Well, Queen? (where’d ya find that one?)I disagree. Does the Queen take away from God by being greater than us? Does the President of the United States take away from God by being the most powerful man on earth?
We don’t have to keep ourselves low, or force others to become low, in case they over-top God, because it is simply not possible to over-top God - no human being, no matter how much greater she is than I am, will ever be greater than God, or ever come anywhere close to threatening His greatness.
In this, there is great freedom. We are free to be great, and also to be recognized as great, because God is so much greater than us that He has nothing to fear from our greatness - or from Mother Mary’s greatness, nor than of St. Joseph or any other Saint.
You’re dancing around my question.
Were the Bereans convinced by Scripture Alone, or by the Holy Tradition of the Catholic Church as given to them by St. Paul plus Scripture?
(And if they were convinced by Scripture Alone, why do we not see Jews being converted to Christianity in their synagogues, where they read out daily the self-same Scriptures that the Bereans read?
Holy Tradition of the Catholic Church? Uh, find it in the scriptures for me, please.
Scripture Alone: what’s wrong with that…they were looking it up while he was telling them the Good News (matching it with his words from the Holy Spirit)
And your last question: the answer is choice. The Jews and Greeks who did not believe are representative of those today who hear the message and like weeds, chaff, and others, go by the wayside never to be heard from again (exist). They choose not to obey Christ’s command: “He who believes and is baptized, will be saved, but he who does not believe, will be condemned.” Mark 16:16
Hebrews 5:9 “And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all them that obey Him.”
Those who do not obey are condemned already. The Bereans believed and obeyed.
S
swariffin
Guest
Der Brother (or Sister, sorry if I am mistaken),
I think you should not challenged her. Just ask her to teach you the history of their church from the OT, then to Jesus, then to the Apostle, and then to whoever started the “Bride of Christ” church, in a continuous chain of history. Make sure no blank from the end of 100 AD to whenever her “Bride of Christ” church started. Also, ask her how she get the bible from the original writing until whatever she get in her hand. That should be simple enough. Please bring her answer in this forum, because it is interesting to know. God bless you and her.
Z
Zooey
Guest
Ah, me…
I once was
young, and now am old… and I have yet to find any merit in arguing with:whacky: People Who Only Do What The Little Voices In Their Heads Tell Them To Do.
Righteousone, you have a good heart, & you love the Lord. I don’t blame you for speaking out, because you were greatly provoked…but I would pray for the lady, but interact with her as little as possible until she gets back on her meds.
People that angry are, IMHO, not just :whacky:, but** potentially dangerous to themselves and others**.
I’m not kidding. I am an old lady who has seen a lot of things in my life, and this woman is dealing with a deck of, say,
47 cards. Tops.
Whatever she says or does, chalk it up to her being deeply, deeply disturbed, and pray. Pray for her, pray for yourself, pray for the poor people who have to put up with her on a daily basis.
Neither you, nor the rest of the folks who inhabit her general space deserve to have her go off on you. Especially if, God help us, she happens to hear angry enough voices to act out…maybe big time.
I know you are upset. I know that you are trying to help her, but I have had to deal with a couple of people with, shall we say, issues. She has them. In spades.
:twocents:
I once was
young, and now am old… and I have yet to find any merit in arguing with:whacky: People Who Only Do What The Little Voices In Their Heads Tell Them To Do.Righteousone, you have a good heart, & you love the Lord. I don’t blame you for speaking out, because you were greatly provoked…but I would pray for the lady, but interact with her as little as possible until she gets back on her meds.
People that angry are, IMHO, not just :whacky:, but** potentially dangerous to themselves and others**.
I’m not kidding. I am an old lady who has seen a lot of things in my life, and this woman is dealing with a deck of, say,
47 cards. Tops.Whatever she says or does, chalk it up to her being deeply, deeply disturbed, and pray. Pray for her, pray for yourself, pray for the poor people who have to put up with her on a daily basis.
Neither you, nor the rest of the folks who inhabit her general space deserve to have her go off on you. Especially if, God help us, she happens to hear angry enough voices to act out…maybe big time.
I know you are upset. I know that you are trying to help her, but I have had to deal with a couple of people with, shall we say,
issues. She has them. In spades.:twocents:
R
RobHom
Guest
I think that often times…discussing religious beliefs with non-Catholics is like trying to push a miles of string straight across a swiftly flowing river. Their minds are so closed to reality that its truly “shocking”. Their dismal knowledge of history is appalling. In fact its pretty much beyond belief…
They (protestants) cite “biblical passages”…in mini-soundbites more often than not taken out of context…and cite the translations of only those they agree with as “proofs”…
They forget that the Old Testament was not written as it happened, in fact…virtually none of the Bible as we know it today was “written” as it happened. Ancient Hebrew…was a language of “consonantal sounds” and “pictographs”… ancient-hebrew.org/4_home.html And at present there is no one alive…who can actually translate “the Original” documents written in that language. There are other issues that protestants make point on…their opinions about how ancient Greek is translated…and yet whats truly interesting…is that the Greeks disagree with them.
Oral history is what it was all about. There was no written word before a certain time. It was all “oral histories and traditions” passed down through the generations…in fact…the books of the New Testament didn’t show up until after Christ’s Death and Resurrection… and the earliest Catholics/Christians…had nothing, virtually NOTHING…but oral histories and oral traditions to go on and follow as well as believe.
In my heart…and in my mind, I have ZERO doubts about the validity of the Catholic Church’s Authority, the Pope’s Authority, or the Teachings of the Holy Catholic Church. I accept the Bible for what it is. But I do not accept it is all there is. If it was, then why does Genesis contain TWO different chapters describing God’s creation of the earth…? If it is the inerrant word of God…then answer this…how can both be “inerrant”?
Sorry folks, but all the “balderdash” about: Its not in the Bible so its not true… is little more than “prideful and arrogant” justification for their beliefs…its that simple. Because…if they were to believe as we believe…they would have nothing to argue about…and they would either be atheists or Catholics!!
As to the woman who can’t seem to “control” her emotions… I would simply tell her kindly: If you can’t discuss it calmly and without profanity and emotion…then we have absolutely nothing to discuss.
They (protestants) cite “biblical passages”…in mini-soundbites more often than not taken out of context…and cite the translations of only those they agree with as “proofs”…
They forget that the Old Testament was not written as it happened, in fact…virtually none of the Bible as we know it today was “written” as it happened. Ancient Hebrew…was a language of “consonantal sounds” and “pictographs”… ancient-hebrew.org/4_home.html And at present there is no one alive…who can actually translate “the Original” documents written in that language. There are other issues that protestants make point on…their opinions about how ancient Greek is translated…and yet whats truly interesting…is that the Greeks disagree with them.
Oral history is what it was all about. There was no written word before a certain time. It was all “oral histories and traditions” passed down through the generations…in fact…the books of the New Testament didn’t show up until after Christ’s Death and Resurrection… and the earliest Catholics/Christians…had nothing, virtually NOTHING…but oral histories and oral traditions to go on and follow as well as believe.
In my heart…and in my mind, I have ZERO doubts about the validity of the Catholic Church’s Authority, the Pope’s Authority, or the Teachings of the Holy Catholic Church. I accept the Bible for what it is. But I do not accept it is all there is. If it was, then why does Genesis contain TWO different chapters describing God’s creation of the earth…? If it is the inerrant word of God…then answer this…how can both be “inerrant”?
Sorry folks, but all the “balderdash” about: Its not in the Bible so its not true… is little more than “prideful and arrogant” justification for their beliefs…its that simple. Because…if they were to believe as we believe…they would have nothing to argue about…and they would either be atheists or Catholics!!
As to the woman who can’t seem to “control” her emotions… I would simply tell her kindly: If you can’t discuss it calmly and without profanity and emotion…then we have absolutely nothing to discuss.
P
peary
Guest
Actually, the Church never taught that indulgences could be ‘sold’ -whether to shorten a soul’s purification after death or for the total remission of sin now and in the future. You will not find a Church document, a bishop’s letter, a papal bull, or any official pronouncement that the Church has ever taught that. “Temporal punishment” means in our ‘time’, or our lifetime.
V
Valke2
Guest
That’s a bit misleading. True, an indulgence sold would absolve one from punishment in this life and not, according to Church doctrine, affect thier soul in the hereafter. But if there were sales of indulgences then it does not take a long stretch of the imagination to figure out there was also forgiveness of sin after confession.
And whether such confession was valid or sincere wouldn’t matter to the people selling indulgences. All that would matter is that they were able to sell indulgences because the people buying them believed they were saving their souls and avoiding punishment.
R
Ronald_E
Guest
That is why it is important to separate what the faith truly is from those who practice it. Otherwise we have distortions of truth that are believed by those who do not know any better thought to be representative of the faith.
J
jmcrae
Guest
I am still trying to figure out how one would “buy” an Indulgence. I received an Indulgence yesterday, but nobody but me (and now you) knows that I have it. Indulgences are spiritual things that come to you when you do certain things. It is the doing of these things that gets you the Indulgence, and paying anybody anything wouldn’t change the fact of whether you had it, or not.
Yes, but what were they buying? There is nothing tangible about an Indulgence. Can I buy the devout recitation of five decades of the Rosary, without actually having to recite five decades of the Rosary with full devotion of heart? If so, what does that look like? (And if I’d still have to recite the five decades devoutly, I can do that for free - I don’t need to pay for the opportunity.)
T
Ted_in_Charlott
Guest
It’s never hopeless. Even if it is mental illness- God can fix it. Even if it is possession - God can fix it. No matter what God can fix it.
We in our limited comprehension of space and time are so into the now and lack paitience. When you do your rosary tonight, pray every bead for her. I think if you sit down and list everything that she has said and done, 50 beads sounds about correct. Other contemplative type things you can do are:
Offer up your trial to God. God can use your trial for the holy souls. The Holy Souls in turn can pray for her. Enlist their help always, pray for them so they can pray for your friends.
Offer up a Mass for her eternal soul.
Spend an hour in front of the Blessed Sacrament.
Send her a sweet card, saying you are thinking of her (no need to say anything else).
Say the Our Father for her. Ask God to forgive HER as God forgives YOU.
I will say her a Hail Mary right now. God bless you for caring enough for her to lose her as a friend. That’s a true friend.
- Status