Persisting question on Confession

[sareesh_james]

**I’ve this nagging doubt on confession, which I’d like to put forth for kind clarification.

Would it suffice for a valid confession and absolution, if someone sincerely and wholeheartedly repents and confesses his sin ,specifying only the salient details of the sin i.e. time and place, no of times, against whom, etc or
Does he/she have to mechanically divulge very nitty gritty of the sin and the act of committing it in order for the confession to be complete.

For e.g.: For someone guilty of committing the sin of adultery, does it count as a valid confession if, he/she sincerely repents and confesses the sin specifying with whom they have sinned, number of times, place etc (i.e. main details) or is the confession only complete if every detail during sinning is stated (i.e. graphic description, which in turn could be perhaps very uncomfortable and painful for that person).

I would be highly grateful if you could provide an answer to this bothering question. I’ve tried to obtain a clarification in this regard to no avail.

Thank you.**

 

[puzzleannie]

the priest does not need the backstory, state your sins in time and number (or frequency). if he needs detail he will ask. just use the nouns and verbs, leave out the adjectives and adverbs

 

[Mrs_Sally]

The priest does not need to hear nitty gritty details. You also don’t necessarily have think through and count up a specific number (23 times) and frequency or approximation is enough (2x a week for a year, about 15 times). If he needs more details, he will ask.

My pastor tolds us in a homily not to come in and confess other people’s sins (ie, my husband does this…, my coworker always…), so I would think that one would not even name the partner by name. You are confessing your own sins, not anyone else’s.

I will pray for you that you fully experience the grace of a good confession.

 

[sareesh_james]

The priest does not need to hear nitty gritty details. You also don’t necessarily have think through and count up a specific number (23 times) and frequency or approximation is enough (2x a week for a year, about 15 times). If he needs more details, he will ask.

My pastor tolds us in a homily not to come in and confess other people’s sins (ie, my husband does this…, my coworker always…), so I would think that one would not even name the partner by name. You are confessing your own sins, not anyone else’s.

I will pray for you that you fully experience the grace of a good confession.

So, not specifying / elaborating on nitty gritty, does not invalidate a confession or render it incomplete according to our dogma, right?
(I ask this question, because even though I made a fully sincere and repentful confession and received absolution, I just had this nagging doubt at the back of my mind because of the issue above.)

 

[baltobetsy]

Here are examples for confessing the sin of adultery that you used as an example.

Not enough information: I broke the 6th Commandment four times.

Too much information: I work with this great guy with blonde hair and blue eyes, who always talks to me and makes me feel good about myself. I’ve been going to the No-Tell Motel with him out on Route 98 every Thursday afternoon for a month, while we tell the boss we’re out on sales calls. He’s way better in bed than my husband because he (insert graphic details here). I like to (insert more graphic details here). I’m worried my husband will wonder why I’m wearing my fancy underwear on Thursdays, since I’m not saying yes to him as often.

Just enough information: I slept with a man not my husband four times, lied about my whereabouts and deprived my husband of the affection that I owe him.

I would expect the priest to talk with the penitent about her relationship with her husband and how she can rebuild it, as well as making sure she intends to end the affair.

It doesn’t have to be juicy and embarrassing at all.

Betsy

 

[baltobetsy]

So, not specifying / elaborating on nitty gritty, does not invalidate a confession or render it incomplete according to our dogma, right?
(I ask this question, because even though I made a fully sincere and repentful confession and received absolution, I just had this nagging doubt at the back of my mind because of the issue above.)

If your confession had been incomplete, the priest would have told you so and asked you questions. If he gave you absolution, he had enough information and everything is fine. Remember, you’re really confessing to God, who knows already what you did.

Betsy

 

[sareesh_james]

Here are examples for confessing the sin of adultery that you used as an example.

Not enough information: I broke the 6th Commandment four times.

Too much information: I work with this great guy with blonde hair and blue eyes, who always talks to me and makes me feel good about myself. I’ve been going to the No-Tell Motel with him out on Route 98 every Thursday afternoon for a month, while we tell the boss we’re out on sales calls. He’s way better in bed than my husband because he (insert graphic details here). I like to (insert more graphic details here). I’m worried my husband will wonder why I’m wearing my fancy underwear on Thursdays, since I’m not saying yes to him as often.

Just enough information: I slept with a man not my husband four times, lied about my whereabouts and deprived my husband of the affection that I owe him.

I would expect the priest to talk with the penitent about her relationship with her husband and how she can rebuild it, as well as making sure she intends to end the affair.

It doesn’t have to be juicy and embarrassing at all.

Betsy

Thank you for the elaborate explanation. It more or less answers my query.

One very pertinent issue during confession, I realise, is that many anxious people (like me), though repentful and intending to make a good confession, dread of having to reveal every little detail of the sin, because it could be very painful and uncomfortable, but at the same time, feel that their confession might not count if they do not do so.
But I guess, as illustrated by your explanation, that all Jesus needs for us to do is to repent and seek forgiveness with all our heart and soul and try not to sin again. I figure then, that the mechanical and ceremonial description of the act of sinning is of no use to him!

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Thanks for the examples Betsy! This post should be stickied for furture reference!

 

[sareesh_james]

Thank you Sally, Betsy and Annie, for your unbeleivably prompt and vivid answers!

Being a new member here, this was my first post on a genuinely bothersome question. Thank you for sorting it out for me.

Thanks to you, After reading it again, I just realised my last comment was pretty insightful and reiterating → (All Jesus needs for us to do is to repent and seek forgiveness with all our heart and soul and try not to sin again. I figure then, that the mechanical and ceremonial description of the act of sinning is of no use to him!)

By the way, I’m a Catholic from India. So if anybody at anytime would like to know about the origination and development of Christianity in my country, I’d be glad to share!

 

[EasterJoy]

Betsy is right. She gave a good example about what kind of detail is called for: that is, enough that you admit the nature and severity of your sin. It doesn’t take a lot of detail, just enough for an open admission of what the bottom line of your offenses were. Whatever other detail your confessor needs in order to counsel you about how to avoid the sin in the future or to make amends for damage done, he’ll ask for.

And think about it…what difference does the so-called nitty-gritty make? Sin is banal, and even the most unusual details don’t make it unique. Adultery is adultery is adultery. There might be some kinds that seem worse than others, but there aren’t any that are OK, nor any beyond God’s forgiveness, assuming we are repentant.

 

[Vimy_Ridge]

I’ve always wondered about the repentance aspect. If someone is an alcoholic or a drug addict and they want to confess but they don’t have the willpower to give up their addiction how would they get out of the circle of this scenario: I want to go to confession but I know I’ll get drunk again and I still want to drink so I can not go and confess because I don’t have the resolve to quit.

 

[Mel_Stones]

I’ve always wondered about the repentance aspect. If someone is an alcoholic or a drug addict and they want to confess but they don’t have the willpower to give up their addiction how would they get out of the circle of this scenario: I want to go to confession but I know I’ll get drunk again and I still want to drink so I can not go and confess because I don’t have the resolve to quit.

Intent.

If their intent is to reconcile with God and sin no more, they will be forgiven/absolved - even if they know they are likely to sin again. If their intent is to get in good for the moment and make no attempt or intention to stop sinning, it would be in invalid confession.

It is all about intent.

 

[fulbert4605]

I’ve always wondered about the repentance aspect. If someone is an alcoholic or a drug addict and they want to confess but they don’t have the willpower to give up their addiction how would they get out of the circle of this scenario: I want to go to confession but I know I’ll get drunk again and I still want to drink so I can not go and confess because I don’t have the resolve to quit.

You must first firmly resolve to quit before approaching the sacrament of Confession. All sacraments must be approached with sincerity in order for the spiritual graces from that sacrament to be effective.

My pastor tolds us in a homily not to come in and confess other people’s sins (ie, my husband does this…, my coworker always…), so I would think that one would not even name the partner by name. You are confessing your own sins, not anyone else’s.

Exactly. This is between God and you. The offenses each person committed belong to that person only. Thus, the seal of the Confessional.

 

[EasterJoy]

I’ve always wondered about the repentance aspect. If someone is an alcoholic or a drug addict and they want to confess but they don’t have the willpower to give up their addiction how would they get out of the circle of this scenario: I want to go to confession but I know I’ll get drunk again and I still want to drink so I can not go and confess because I don’t have the resolve to quit.

You don’t even have to want to change, not the way you mean it. To want to want to change is sometimes where we have to start, to be willing to keep wanting what we have no power to achieve on our own power. We might really really want to run off with some lover, if we’re alcoholic we’re of course really really going to want a drink, but we can decide that we want and need to satisfy our need for God even more than we want to satisfy the desires that keep us from God and a sane and honest life, even when our desires torment us.

In fact, you could apply the 12 Steps exactly to our struggle with sin, and to how ongoing self-examination and the Sacrament of Reconciliation are a necessary part of our lives. Some of us are powerless over alcohol, but we’re all powerless over sin. We depend on grace in each moment.

When we resolve not to sin again, we aren’t promising that we won’t fail. We’re saying that we truly want not to fail. That is the first step to finding confidence in God, to “ask Him to remove our shortcomings”.

Besides, I don’t know anybody who doesn’t confess mostly the same thing every time they go to confession. Then, when they don’t, they move on to the next thing to confess over and over and over again. It never ends.

There is a story from the Desert Fathers:
Another brother asked Abba Sisoes, ‘I have fallen, Abba; what shall I do?’ The old main said to him, ‘Get up again.’ The brother said, ‘I have gotten up again, but again have I fallen.’ The old man said, ‘Get up again and again.’ So the brother asked, ‘How many times?’ The old man replied, ‘Until you are taken up either in virtue or in sin. For a man presents himself to judgment in that state in which he is found.’

 

[Vimy_Ridge]

Intent.

If their intent is to reconcile with God and sin no more, they will be forgiven/absolved - even if they know they are likely to sin again. If their intent is to get in good for the moment and make no attempt or intention to stop sinning, it would be in invalid confession.

It is all about intent.

Intent and resolve are the same, the addict does not have the resolve or will to quit, they can not find the will in and of themselves, they need grace, but do not have it at the moment. Take a drunk who knows himself well, his fridge is loaded with beer he goes and confesses but he does not throw out the alcohol first because he knows he will buy it again.

 

[Vimy_Ridge]

You don’t even have to want to change, not the way you mean it. To want to want to change is sometimes where we have to start, to be willing to keep wanting what we have no power to achieve on our own power. We might really really want to run off with some lover, if we’re alcoholic we’re of course really really going to want a drink, but we can decide that we want and need to satisfy our need for God even more than we want to satisfy the desires that keep us from God and a sane and honest life, even when our desires torment us.

In fact, you could apply the 12 Steps exactly to our struggle with sin, and to how ongoing self-examination and the Sacrament of Reconciliation are a necessary part of our lives. Some of us are powerless over alcohol, but we’re all powerless over sin. We depend on grace in each moment.

When we resolve not to sin again, we aren’t promising that we won’t fail. We’re saying that we truly want not to fail. That is the first step to finding confidence in God, to “ask Him to remove our shortcomings”.

Besides, I don’t know anybody who doesn’t confess mostly the same thing every time they go to confession. Then, when they don’t, they move on to the next thing to confess over and over and over again. It never ends.

There is a story from the Desert Fathers:
Another brother asked Abba Sisoes, ‘I have fallen, Abba; what shall I do?’ The old main said to him, ‘Get up again.’ The brother said, ‘I have gotten up again, but again have I fallen.’ The old man said, ‘Get up again and again.’ So the brother asked, ‘How many times?’ The old man replied, ‘Until you are taken up either in virtue or in sin. For a man presents himself to judgment in that state in which he is found.’

This was very helpful, thank you. To want to want to change, I like that.

 

[EasterJoy]

Intent and resolve are the same, the addict does not have the resolve or will to quit, they can not find the will in and of themselves, they need grace, but do not have it at the moment. Take a drunk who knows himself well, his fridge is loaded with beer he goes and confesses but he does not throw out the alcohol first because he knows he will buy it again.

We can’t dare to succeed, unless we dare to fail. Failing is closer to succeeding than not even trying is. We can’t just give in to despair, then try to pretend we have not given in.

If we want to want to, we keep asking to want to. And if the addict you mention goes to confession about his drinking, he would also confess the beer still in his refrigerator, since in keeping it he has chosen to frequent a near occasion of sin.

There will be days when we don’t want to want to. Ask God to help us to want to want to want to again. Wherever we are, whatever it takes, make a step forward, even if the last umpteen tries have been one step forward and two steps back. Then we will at least not have the sin of despair to confess, the next time. But if we do, we can confess that, too, get up, and try again.

At any rate, the Sacrament of Reconciliation is not about a one-time success over sin. It is about admitting we are sinners, and yet not giving in to either presumption or despair, but rather choosing to hope in God’s mercy.

 

[EasterJoy]

This was very helpful, thank you. To want to want to change, I like that.

It did me good to write it, because lately I have become very tired of wanting to want to, and yet not doing. So I will keep trying to want to, as well.

 

[Vimy_Ridge]

If we want to want to, we keep asking to want to. And if the addict you mention goes to confession about his drinking, he would also confess the beer still in his refrigerator, since in keeping it he has chosen to frequent a near occasion of sin.

I never considerd that, I thought a priest would tell them to get rid of the near occasion to sin first before the person could be absolved. That is why I saw addiction as vicious circle. You are very insightful, thanks again.

 

[Lainey63]

Intent and resolve are the same, the addict does not have the resolve or will to quit, they can not find the will in and of themselves, they need grace, but do not have it at the moment. Take a drunk who knows himself well, his fridge is loaded with beer he goes and confesses but he does not throw out the alcohol first because he knows he will buy it again.

Many times an alcoholic/addict does resolve to never drink again and is full of remorse & shame…but they can’t do it alone. The alcoholic says many prayers to God…we call them “jackpot prayers” and promises God if He will help me get out of this jam…I promise I will quit drinking!
Many people think that giving up the bottle, pills whatever can be done on willpower alone…it cannot. To answer your query about the drunk who keeps his fridge full because he knows he cannot quit but goes to confession anyway is an example of the first step of AA…he’s admitting he is powerless over alcohol. In short that person needs to get help…like AA or NA for drugs and I am sure if that person goes to confession the priest will tell him/her the very same thing…get help.