Pet peeve, literally a peeve about pets!

[Kaninchen]

PETA and like organisations are immoral, as long as one human being does without the necessities of human life, they are taking the bread from the mouths of people and giving it to animals

what can we do about it?

Well, this is not something I’d normally say in case somebody thought me a ‘bleeding heart’ or something but I give to animal charities.

I also give up one working day a week to working for a charity for the destitute. Objectively-speaking, it would be better for me to work at my profession and give them the money but I feel more involved doing it this way.

One thing I’ve found is that most people working in the charity field and most people who actively give to charity tend to be concerned about the whole range of need but their priorities change from time to time.

Another thing I’ve noticed is that the people who complain most about some activity of a charity that they don’t approve of (the activity and/or the charity itself) are not usually drawn from the ‘charitable’ side of the population.

People who want to do something in the field of charity don’t talk about it, they go out and do something.

 

[happymommy]

based on the idea that to give the food that could be given to the hungry, to an animal. thats the basis of my thinking.

im not assuming that one cant split their charity dollar, but rather that until every child of G-d is fed, its wrong to give those life giving dollars to animals.to animals

sorry but as marley told scrooge, “my business?, my business was the whole human race” or something to that idea.

p.s. what you personally have is not yours, its G-ds. your just using it right now.

That’s right, it is Gods, but He has trusted me with it to use as I see the need. I’m not a fan of PETA, but I see nothing wrong with people helping to care for neglected animals. If you stop taking care of the animals, there will be sick or dead animals everywhere. How is that helpful to anyone?

Let’s look at other things that people use their money on that should be going to feed all of Gods people…do you take a vacation? Get you hair cut? Buy new clothes, when you could buy used? Drive a car instead of taking the bus? Do you go out for dinner? I give to the fire department, should I stop worrying about them having proper equipment and give it to the homeless instead? I give to our Church, some of that goes to local charities, but not all…do you suggest I stop giving to my parish unless all of the money goes to feeding people? I give to make a wish, I guess the dying children shouldn’t get to go see Mickey Mouse…I’ll be sure to tell them that, next time they call. I also give to the local food pantry. We give to many people and orginazations and volunteer our time. We are happy to do so. I’m glad God has blessed us to be able to do these things.There are a lot of people in need of help in this world and there is more than one cause that is worth giving too. If God has put it on your heart to feed the poor, wonderful! Do it. Telling others that they are wrong for giving to something that is important to them, helps no one. God has put it in my heart and that of my husband to help in many ways and we do. We don’t just talk about it, we do it. Actions speak louder than words!

 

[zzz]

Have you opened your house to a stranger?

That’s a fair question, Cristiano…and yes, i have…at different times…for periods ranging from a few days to a few months (and I would have to say the little I was able to do for them paled in comparison to what they added to my life)

 

[nicolep]

By that same rationale, you should not have the internet because that money could go to feed homeless people. You should not spend any money on books because that money should go to homeless people. You should not pay for unnecessary snack food because that money should go to homeless people. You should not pay for a car or insurance because that money could go to homeless people and you could walk everywhere you need to go. Have you bought any sacramentals recently? If so, that money should have gone to homeless people. Did you buy anyone a frivolous gift at Christmas (outside of required items for standard care)? That money, too, should have gone to homeless people. Do you own a TV? The money for the TV or cable should have gone to homeless people.

The list could go on and on forever. So, let me get this straight…every cent you spend outside of your necessary care (which is takes a lot less money that people in western society realize) to help homeless people. If you spend money on any of the above, based on your argument, you have made an immoral choice.

My choice, however, is not immoral. You may believe it is, but that’s not the case. No one is arguing that homeless people don’t need to receive more care. The argument lies in that animals should not be helped at all until every homeless person has a warm place to sleep and a full stomach. It’s not going to happen for a myriad of reasons. I won’t list them all, but most of us are adults and can figure them out.

One last thing, caring for animals is a whole lot cheaper than caring for people.

 

[Cristiano]

That’s a fair question, Cristiano…and yes, i have…at different times…for periods ranging from a few days to a few months (and I would have to say the little I was able to do for them paled in comparison to what they added to my life)

Then the righteous will answer him and say, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? When did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? When did we see you ill or in prison, and visit you?’ And the king will say to them in reply, ‘Amen, I say to you, whatever you did for one of these least brothers of mine, you did for me.’

 

[cargau]

i saw a telethon in the area the other day for various pet charities, in the wealthiest parts of town they have adopt-a-pet centers in expensive retail store space, we have pet shelters scattered throughout the area where stray and unwanted animals are cared for, fed, watered, and kept warm.

but just last winter, they found a man who froze to death down town.

i cant help but to be angry that while that man froze to death, some animals had warm kennels, they had food and water, what did this son of G-d have?

someone please tell me why its ok to let a mentally, or physically ill man freeze to death while there are resources being used for stray animals?

PETA and like organisations are immoral, as long as one human being does without the necessities of human life, they are taking the bread from the mouths of people and giving it to animals

what can we do about it?

Who said that this has to be an either/or proposition. It seems that the two examples you cited are really quite different.

Animals do not need to suffer so that someone may stay warm. While it is quite tragic that the homeless man died, his survivability was not going to be made any better or worse if the animals were warm or not.

I would ask, what are you and I doing to help people who can’t fend for themselves. We are aghast that someone (probably the government) isn’t doing enough when we are reluctant to lift a finger. Please know, I am not berating you. Rather, your letter is a wakeup call to me (and anyone else) that people suffer and die because we (me) didn’t do enough.

I think it all starts with the guy or gal in the mirror…

 

[warpspeedpetey]

Telling others that they are wrong for giving to something that is important to them, helps no one. God has put it in my heart and that of my husband to help in many ways and we do. We don’t just talk about it, we do it. Actions speak louder than words!

yes they do and the action of giving resources to a pet charity while there are people going hungry is objectively wrong, ones first duty is to there fellow man, we are our brothers keeper, animals are for food, and labor.

i dont see how a laundry list of activities changes that. it certainly doesnt matter to a child in the appalachians that did not have lunch today because it wasn’t a school day

im a very analytical person, you disagree for what you feel are valid reasons, i am simply not sympathetic to them. to me the facts are bare and undeniable, evey dollar given to a pet charity from your charitable budget, is several fewer meals that a poor person will do with out. how can one say to the hungry “thats enough for now, what i have left i want to give to a dog charity.”

it is a zero sum game.

to further demostrate, what if the hungry lined up at your door, you have 100 dollars worth of food to give this month. your handing out food to people when you notice you are down to the last 10 dollars worth of food, do you turn to the needy person and say “im sorry, but i cant give you this food, becuase i need to feed stray dogs with it”?

of course not. you would be disgusted by anyone who did that. well i am too.

i understand you feel different but i dont yet see a reason that changes how i feel about the subject.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

Who said that this has to be an either/or proposition. It seems that the two examples you cited are really quite different.

Animals do not need to suffer so that someone may stay warm. While it is quite tragic that the homeless man died, his survivability was not going to be made any better or worse if the animals were warm or not.

I would ask, what are you and I doing to help people who can’t fend for themselves. We are aghast that someone (probably the government) isn’t doing enough when we are reluctant to lift a finger. Please know, I am not berating you. Rather, your letter is a wakeup call to me (and anyone else) that people suffer and die because we (me) didn’t do enough.

I think it all starts with the guy or gal in the mirror…

i think it all starts with our personal responsability,one for the other also.

and this one individuals plight may not have changed based on our personal behavior, but it highlighted to stark relief for me that every dollar given to a pet charity is one less dollar that could be given to a hungry person.

as i told happymommy, its a zero sum game, people have limited budgets for chairity. when a dog gets a bowl of food, a person doesn’t.

 

[happymommy]

i dont see how a laundry list of activities changes that. it certainly doesnt matter to a child in the appalachians that did not have lunch today because it wasn’t a school day

im a very analytical person, you disagree for what you feel are valid reasons, i am simply not sympathetic to them. to me the facts are bare and undeniable, evey dollar given to a pet charity from your charitable budget, is several fewer meals that a poor person will do with out. how can one say to the hungry “thats enough for now, what i have left i want to give to a dog charity.”

i understand you feel different but i dont yet see a reason that changes how i feel about the subject.

You never did say if we should stop having vacations and buying wanted but not needed things and use that money to feed the poor. In fact you just called it a laundry list of things. If you truly want to feed the poor, then you would be in support of giving up “extra” things and giving that money and time away. As you said

that every dollar given to a pet charity is one less dollar that could be given to a hungry person.

So shouldn’t we being giving every extra dollar we have to the poor? You blew off my “list” in the last post, so I’ll ask, what do you do to help feed the poor? I’m hoping after calling those of us who do work hard to help others immoral, that you do, do something other than just judge.
I’m not trying to change how you feel about anything, I just don’t agree that we are immoral and I think it’s wrong of you to judge others and call them that.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

You never did say if we should stop having vacations and buying wanted but not needed things and use that money to feed the poor. In fact you just called it a laundry list of things. If you truly want to feed the poor, then you would be in support of giving up “extra” things and giving that money and time away. As you said So shouldn’t we being giving every extra dollar we have to the poor?

do you really need a trip to antigua or europe? do you need a new car every couple of years? that flat panel tv? those DVDs of movies you have already seen?

yes, every extra dollar should go to the poor as the ideal, that was how the earliest Christains lived. i dont expect current culture to live that, people spend so much on unneeded things, our entire culture defines you by what you possess. it ends up possessing you.

You blew off my “list” in the last post, so I’ll ask, what do you do to help feed the poor?

 

[nicolep]

The OP is obviously not interested in hearing anything other than, “You’re so right!” Well, I’m not going to say it because I don’t think you’re right. If you interested in having a real discussion (other than just telling me how immoral I am, which is extremely offensive considering you have no idea how I live my life) let me know.

I’ve stated my points. Most of which you ignored. Therefore, I’m bowing out. It’s a waste of my time.

 

[happymommy]

do you really need a trip to antigua or europe? do you need a new car every couple of years? that flat panel tv? those DVDs of movies you have already seen?

 

[warpspeedpetey]

The OP is obviously not interested in hearing anything other than, “You’re so right!” Well, I’m not going to say it because I don’t think you’re right. If you interested in having a real discussion (other than just telling me how immoral I am, which is extremely offensive considering you have no idea how I live my life) let me know.

I’ve stated my points. Most of which you ignored. Therefore, I’m bowing out. It’s a waste of my time.

i didn’t ignore your points, i simply didnt see your post. having read them now, you are using whats called a slippery slope argument.

i never said to do without for yourself or your family nor implied it, though i have no respect for conpsicuous consumption.

i am refering to the limited charitable budget athat most people have, and the idea that until every person in need is taken care of, it is immoral to give any of it to a pet charity.

nor did i say you were immoral, i said i belive a certain act to be immoral and why.

nor did i claim to know how you live your life.

being offended by my opinion is an emotional response to a rational position.

please give me rational reasons as to why it is ok to give money to a pet charity, when there are human beings in need?

i dont really ‘do’ emotion. i am really looking for a rational discussion of the morality of this act.

chill on the hostility. you aren’t getting that from me.

 

[Calliso]

I agree with others that you can do both! Helping an animal doesn;t mean that a human must suffer anymore then helping humans means that you must forget about all the stray animals and what not. I have two adopted pets and have donated to human charities as well.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

warpspeedpetey;4835853:

The only trip we go on is to go camping! So no, I don’t go on big trips. My car is 8 years old and I don’t have a flat panel t.v., DVD’s were gifts…anything else?

why are you taking it personally, i was obviously speaking about an average person. i have no idea how you live. thats not what im getting at.

well, first I should tell you that I DON’T give to animal charities…but I don’t think it’s immoral to do so, that is your opinion

.

good, im glad you dont.

Now, if you could find something in Church teaching that says we should not help these charities, then that would be great. Until then we will just keep having the same debate, not that it’s not fun, but really pointless in the long run.

i dont know of a specific teaching, but does the church have any animal charities?

it would seem if it was a moral activity the church would be involved.

taking care of stray animals isn’y any of the corporeal works of mercy i know.

like many thing i think it just hasn’t come up yet.

To answer your question, I would not turn away some one at my door, I would give them my last $10 and then feed the dog whatever scraps I had left. See you can do both:thumbsup:

ok

So what about other charities? Ones that maybe don’t feed the poor, but do help in someones life: like the firefighters, make a wish or even a pro-life organization. Do you feel that it is wrong to give to these instead of feeding the poor or is it okay as long as it’s not an animal?

no, i pretty much feel like the most basic needs should be met first. thats not saying they arent good works, but to a person needing food and shelter, not much else matters. that said, im not an emotional person. there isn’t much that pulls on my heart strings, im very analytical, cost\benefit kind of guy.

i grew up in the country, for me animals are food, and labor.

 

[Highwayhound]

Please consider this hypothetical trip to Bermuda or Bahamas. If I am paying for this trip then someone has a job booking the ticket. Next, someone will have a job pumping gas into my car so I can drive to the airport. Then someone has a job to scan me as I go through security (hopefully I only get wanded ). Then the pilot and stewardess each has a job.

I will leave it at that and not continue on to what good my spending will do for the people at my vacation site. The point being all these jobs creat income and all these paycheck receipitants can then donate to mulitple charities. I know I do. I would contend that there is nothing wrong with a vacation. When it becomes wrong is when a person lives only for the next moment of pleasure. The last sentence is a paraphrase of a segment from a speech or writing of Pope John Paul II. I am reading the book In My Own Words which is a complilation of bits from his speeches and writings.

Lastly, by God’s grace we here in America have such a great opportunity. We can help people and look out for animals. I would pray that people would first seek to help other humans.

God bless

 

[jmcrae]

i grew up in the country, for me animals are food, and labor.

And if the animals aren’t looked after, they don’t make very good food, and are not fit for labour. Of what value is a sick dog? but if you make him well, he can become a guard dog, or he can pull a sled, or he can guide the blind, or he can track down illegal drugs - or, he can be a child’s pet, and teach the child how to be compassionate and to be responsible for the life of another living creature.

 

[happymommy]

happymommy;4835924:

why are you taking it personally, i was obviously speaking about an average person. i have no idea how you live. thats not what im getting at.

I’m not taking it personally, just showing that the average person doesn’t get the big trips and all the extra goodies!

.

good, im glad you dont.

i dont know of a specific teaching, but does the church have any animal charities?no, they don’t, but they don’t say we can’t give to them either

it would seem if it was a moral activity the church would be involved.

taking care of stray animals isn’y any of the corporeal works of mercy i know.

like many thing i think it just hasn’t come up yet.

To answer your question, I would not turn away some one at my door, I would give them my last $10 and then feed the dog whatever scraps I had left. See you can do both:thumbsup:

ok

no, i pretty much feel like the most basic needs should be met first. thats not saying they arent good works, but to a person needing food and shelter, not much else matters. that said, im not an emotional person. there isn’t much that pulls on my heart strings, im very analytical, cost\benefit kind of guy.
yes, I can tell that and I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I’m not willing to pass up helping other needs to only focus on one. I think firefighters need our support. My nephew puts his life on the line to help complete strangers, I want to know that he is safe! I also like knowing that because of my help local families had a good Christmas dinner. You can feed the hungry and clothe the naked and still make time for other needs that matter too. You might want to try having some emotion. It’s great to give and you shouldn’t do it for yourself, but because it is what God wants us to do. There comes great JOY in living your life the way Christ wants you to live it! He wants us to give and care for others, it should be done out of love!
i grew up in the country, for me animals are food, and labor.yup, me too. But that doesn’t mean it’s okay to let them suffer and go hungry. They aren’t worth much if you do!

 

[warpspeedpetey]

And if the animals aren’t looked after, they don’t make very good food, and are not fit for labour. Of what value is a sick dog? but if you make him well, he can become a guard dog, or he can pull a sled, or he can guide the blind, or he can track down illegal drugs - or, he can be a child’s pet, and teach the child how to be compassionate and to be responsible for the life of another living creature.

stray dogs arent considered food here…though ive heard some things…

 

[warpspeedpetey]

then i suppose we disagree, i just cant find a justification when it comes to animals. i would agree on firefighters, but their equipment should be bought with tax money, though sometimes its not.

i have emotions, i think…(im doing the robot)

im just not emotional over animals.

they are food, do you cry over your mashed taters?