Pets afterlife?

[LilyM]

Do you think animals have souls?

All living creatures have souls, of course. A ‘soul’ is the animating lifeforce within a living creature. But that’s not to say all have immortal, able-to-survive-physical-death-and-destined-for-heaven-or-hell souls. St Thomas Aquinas certainly didn’t think so.

pacoenelsaco:

And I already said that God doesn’t love animals or plants as much as He loves us humans. But He loves them to a degree. And I for one believe that He wouldn’t create all these things just to discard them when heaven comes on Earth

And people love their computers and cars. Human beings similar to myself created them and, I am sure, love their creations too. Are we aware even as we love these things that they are temporary, destined to stop working and end up as scrap metal/recycled spare parts one day? Of course. Just because we create something and love it doesn’t mean it isn’t destined to be temporary. Same with God, surely.

Remember, there will be a NEW heaven and a NEW earth. Not ‘current earth version 2.0 - just the same but a bit brighter and whiter’ but something radically different.

St Paul promises us that the afterlife will contain new wonders that eye hasn’t seen, nor ear heard nor the mind of man conceived of. I’m confident that whatever they are, they will be more than enough to detach us from any selfish clinging to the inferior attachments of this earth.

Isn’t that the whole reason Jesus said there’ll be no marrying or giving in marriage in heaven - that that sort of bond of marital love will be replaced by an infinitely greater and infinitely more universal, but at the same time more impersonal, love - a Godly love?

Same applies to the bond of love you have for your pets - imagine feeling the same love but infinitely greater, and having that infinitely greater bond of love with EVERY HUMAN YOU CLAP EYES ON!

How could you even think of missing a pet when you have that sort of love reflected back at you from your fellow brothers and sisters among the heavenly saints!

 

[BlueShadow123]

It would be really nice if the bible mentioned it, but it didn’t need to because it has nothing to do with our salvation. Either way, fighting about it isn’t going to get us anywhere. We will never truly know until we’re dead. But we can always hope that they will be there.

 

[Brooke449]

I want to thank all of the people who have posted on this thread. You have no idea how much you have helped me. I lost a beloved cat on Friday morning. He was old and sick and it was time to put him out of his misery. He taught me SO much about God’s unconditional love for me. I am so grateful to have shared almost 15 years with him. He was an amazing gift and I will always be happy to have shared so much time together. Thank you to everyone who has posted here about the possibilities of being reunited. You have given me hope! Thank you!

 

[Meximo]

@Brooke449 I am so sorry for your loss. We lost our ball of fluff before Halloween he would have been 13 y/o this past Sunday. Our other bag of fluff is on her last legs she’s 16. Cats especially have a way of humbling us. Hope is always a good thing and God is so good and great!!!

Many blessings for you!

 

[Solo1959]

I am very sorry for your loss. Pets are part of the family - often the best part. All they do is give joy and love. I know you are thankful for the 15 years you shared. Again, I am very sorry.

 

[youngblood]

It is true that we have no clear revelation on God’s plan for the animals as far as afterlife. I read a passage in Dante’s Divine Comedy referring to “brute souls” (animals) being bound to the body. In other words, the animal’s soul is inseparable from its body.

With this in mind, I choose to believe that my deceased cat is sleeping right where he is buried. He is not in Heaven, but when Christ comes to resurrect us all, perhaps our animals will “wake up” and join us in the new Kingdom.

I realize that this is all my own speculation and not based on any direct teaching. However, keep in mind that no one has the right to tell you will never see your pet again, as there is no official doctrine on this matter.

 

[Marie5890]

When I think about any comments any early church father into the present has ever said about whether or not animals have immortal souls I think about where that is all coming from

Our Hebrew ancestors literally sacrificed animals. They were also forbidden to worship animals which was common amongst other ancient religions.

I base their thoughts more on those realities (can you imagine how they would have to face the fact that they were sacrificing creatures of God’s creations that also had immortal souls the way we do?)

I think when ever that was taught, it was coming from a reality of the above facts that they couldnt even imagine that they were sacrificing other creatures.

ALL CREATION, which includes our beloved four leggers and all other animals whom we have ever physically consumed, was created by Our God. We are not the only creation on the planet to be able to claim that.

All are God’s creations. Including your companions whom you pet and love and whom love you back with complete unconditional love.

I have a hard time believing that Our Lord is can’t feel that connection to them. I mean, His Mother was carried by a donkey, He rode a donkey when it came to His triumphal entry into Jerusalem.

All life has a sense of preciousness to it, because He gave it life. All life, all creation, speaks of His glory, His majesty, His love.

That doesnt mean we need to be radical about it, but it is all part of His Glory, make no mistake

 

[severus68]

All living creatures have souls, of course. A ‘soul’ is the animating lifeforce within a living creature. But that’s not to say all have immortal, able-to-survive-physical-death-and-destined-for-heaven-or-hell souls. St Thomas Aquinas certainly didn’t think so.

And people love their computers and cars. Human beings similar to myself created them and, I am sure, love their creations too. Are we aware even as we love these things that they are temporary, destined to stop working and end up as scrap metal/recycled spare parts one day? Of course. Just because we create something and love it doesn’t mean it isn’t destined to be temporary. Same with God, surely.

Remember, there will be a NEW heaven and a NEW earth. Not ‘current earth version 2.0 - just the same but a bit brighter and whiter’ but something radically different.

St Paul promises us that the afterlife will contain new wonders that eye hasn’t seen, nor ear heard nor the mind of man conceived of. I’m confident that whatever they are, they will be more than enough to detach us from any selfish clinging to the inferior attachments of this earth.

Isn’t that the whole reason Jesus said there’ll be no marrying or giving in marriage in heaven - that that sort of bond of marital love will be replaced by an infinitely greater and infinitely more universal, but at the same time more impersonal, love - a Godly love?

Same applies to the bond of love you have for your pets - imagine feeling the same love but infinitely greater, and having that infinitely greater bond of love with EVERY HUMAN YOU CLAP EYES ON!

How could you even think of missing a pet when you have that sort of love reflected back at you from your fellow brothers and sisters among the heavenly saints!

Really, how can we compare computers and cars made by human beings to sentient beings created by God who also created God.

Love is not limiting, the mor you love the more there is. It is not mutually exclusive, you can love your pets and humans. About like, that is another matter altogether. It is easier to like your dog for example a lot than many human beings I know off.

 

[severus68]

When I think about any comments any early church father into the present has ever said about whether or not animals have immortal souls I think about where that is all coming from

Our Hebrew ancestors literally sacrificed animals. They were also forbidden to worship animals which was common amongst other ancient religions.

I base their thoughts more on those realities (can you imagine how they would have to face the fact that they were sacrificing creatures of God’s creations that also had immortal souls the way we do?)

I think when ever that was taught, it was coming from a reality of the above facts that they couldnt even imagine that they were sacrificing other creatures.

ALL CREATION, which includes our beloved four leggers and all other animals whom we have ever physically consumed, was created by Our God. We are not the only creation on the planet to be able to claim that.

All are God’s creations. Including your companions whom you pet and love and whom love you back with complete unconditional love.

I have a hard time believing that Our Lord is can’t feel that connection to them. I mean, His Mother was carried by a donkey, He rode a donkey when it came to His triumphal entry into Jerusalem.

All life has a sense of preciousness to it, because He gave it life. All life, all creation, speaks of His glory, His majesty, His love.

That doesnt mean we need to be radical about it, but it is all part of His Glory, make no mistake

Amen, they are also God’s creatures.

 

[ccarter]

After loving my dogs to much I have learned some of the Faith through them. I didn’t understand the body of church term or the bridegroom. It just seemed so far out and the ectasy and love that has been expressed. Then I thought how much I loved my little Pit Bull baby and it all fit in. I adored every bit of him. When I asked for blessed Mother Mary to intervene and help me quickly as a mother my prayer was answered right then. My dog was out of his head in pain and we didn’t know how to pick him up without hurting him. My heart was being torn apart by his cries. I left the room and came back and he got up and bravely walked to the back door and into the car to his death awaiting at the Vets. I had prayed to God first but it wasn’t fast enough and so I knew Mary could intercede. I can still see him walking bravely and slowly like a little soldier. I still ask out Heavenly Father to bless him and take car of him until I get there.

 

[severus68]

After loving my dogs to much I have learned some of the Faith through them. I didn’t understand the body of church term or the bridegroom. It just seemed so far out and the ectasy and love that has been expressed. Then I thought how much I loved my little Pit Bull baby and it all fit in. I adored every bit of him. When I asked for blessed Mother Mary to intervene and help me quickly as a mother my prayer was answered right then. My dog was out of his head in pain and we didn’t know how to pick him up without hurting him. My heart was being torn apart by his cries. I left the room and came back and he got up and bravely walked to the back door and into the car to his death awaiting at the Vets. I had prayed to God first but it wasn’t fast enough and so I knew Mary could intercede. I can still see him walking bravely and slowly like a little soldier. I still ask out Heavenly Father to bless him and take car of him until I get there.

My sympathies to you and all those who have lost pets. It is that much harder when we lose them for so many people do not understand so we end up mourning alone. As I know and love my God, I know I will see my non human loved ones too. God bless.

 

[LilyM]

Amen, they are also God’s creatures.

Fer crying out loud, plants are also God’s creatures. I’m sure He loves them, Jesus spoke very feelingly indeed about the flowers and the sparrows. God nonetheless gave man dominion over all - plants AND animals. Plants and animals were, as I think I said earlier, not created in His image and likeness. They were created for our use and enjoyment (as well as God’s enjoyment, to be sure). In heaven we will have no need or wish either of the use or the enjoyment. And there’s no good reason to believe that He will either.

We eat both plants and animals, we wear products of both plants and animals. We don’t eat or wear products of other human beings. There is a crucial difference, a difference that arises from the fact that humans have immortal souls whereas lesser creatures have finite souls.

 

[gaits]

Angels were not created in the image of God, yet they are in heaven. That they are not created in the image of God is no reason to assume animals will or will not be in heaven.

Most people who have ever loved a pet wish for their pet to be with them in heaven. Most people who do not like animals or have no feeling toward them one way or the other have no problem believing that there are no animals in heaven. Either way, since there is no definitive teaching on the subject, either viewpoint is a matter of personal opinion.

My personal opinion is that every part of God’s creation was created for the purpose of glorifying Him. All that is in heaven does and will glorify God for all eternity. If God desires that pets, or plants, or rocks for that matter be in heaven to glorify Him, then they will be. Once we are in heaven, our own personal happiness will be a non-issue. Our sole focus by then will be to glorify God. Who’s to say each of us will not have a unique experience? If the presence of our pets in heaven will cause us to glorify God all the more, then maybe we will see them. If the presence of animals will distract us from God, then likely the will not be there. For all we know, each of us will have a unique experience where what we see is individualized. I will see the things that help me to glorify God and will not see the things that distract me from Him. What helps me might distract you and vice versa, so maybe we won’t even see or experience the exact same things.

 

[LilyM]

Angels were not created in the image of God, yet they are in heaven. That they are not created in the image of God is no reason to assume animals will or will not be in heaven.

Most people who have ever loved a pet wish for their pet to be with them in heaven. Most people who do not like animals or have no feeling toward them one way or the other have no problem believing that there are no animals in heaven. Either way, since there is no definitive teaching on the subject, either viewpoint is a matter of personal opinion.

My personal opinion is that every part of God’s creation was created for the purpose of glorifying Him. All that is in heaven does and will glorify God for all eternity. If God desires that pets, or plants, or rocks for that matter be in heaven to glorify Him, then they will be. Once we are in heaven, our own personal happiness will be a non-issue. Our sole focus by then will be to glorify God. Who’s to say each of us will not have a unique experience? If the presence of our pets in heaven will cause us to glorify God all the more, then maybe we will see them. If the presence of animals will distract us from God, then likely the will not be there. For all we know, each of us will have a unique experience where what we see is individualized. I will see the things that help me to glorify God and will not see the things that distract me from Him. What helps me might distract you and vice versa, so maybe we won’t even see or experience the exact same things.

For the record, I have had pets during my life, and loved them dearly. I have loved them for what they are, animals, and not anthropomorphised them or taken their love as a substitute for human love, which it isn’t, or even worse, potentially God’s love, to the extent that I would be desolate if they weren’t with me in heaven. Same with many people I know.

My personal opinion is that

a) we weren’t given dominion over the angels, unlike the animals and plants, nor were we given the angels to be our food and drink, unlike animals and plants, and

b) anyone who wants more from heaven than the things we know for a fact to be there - ie the saints and God’s own presence - just doesn’t get it.

St Teresa of Avila got it. That is why she wrote ‘He who has God [not plants, animals or any other earthly creature] finds he lacks nothing, God alone suffices’.

If being face-to-face with God in His own presence isn’t in and of itself enough to stimulate a heavenly soul to glorify Him maximally, then it seems to me that soul will be eternally blind to His power and glory, and no amount of the presence of animals or other inferior goods is going to make a single bit of difference.

While we are on earth, yes, we can use the presence of God in the people and things around us as aids to glorify Him. Further, we need them because we CANNOT see Him face-to-face. That is why He gives them to us, to lead us to Him. What is there in heaven that we need to be led to? He is THERE, in front of us - what more, what different, can we possibly want or need apart from Him alone?

A God who isn’t in and of Himself sufficient to inspire my utmost awe and reverence and love when I behold Him, but instead requires external aids such as animals to make Himself appear more awesome, and more worthy of reverence and love, even when I am in His very presence, isn’t a deity worthy of worship.

Isn’t heaven - being with God for eternity - good enough as it is? Do we need to make it like Disneyland, where the presence of externals is necessary to add to the enjoyment?

 

[severus68]

Fer crying out loud, plants are also God’s creatures. I’m sure He loves them, Jesus spoke very feelingly indeed about the flowers and the sparrows. God nonetheless gave man dominion over all - plants AND animals. Plants and animals were, as I think I said earlier, not created in His image and likeness. They were created for our use and enjoyment (as well as God’s enjoyment, to be sure). In heaven we will have no need or wish either of the use or the enjoyment. And there’s no good reason to believe that He will either.

We eat both plants and animals, we wear products of both plants and animals. We don’t eat or wear products of other human beings. There is a crucial difference, a difference that arises from the fact that humans have immortal souls whereas lesser creatures have finite souls.

Plants are not creatures. We are made good stewards of all of God’s world and creation and we will have to answer to God one day. I for one do not eat any animal. The fact that you and other humans do does not define the difference. That we are made in God’s image and have superior intellect gives us the obligation to treat other sentient creatures with compassion and mercy. We were not given animals to eat in the world God created.

There has been so much violence in this world caused by people who purport to speak on behalf of God.

Why are you so obviously upset about those who want or believe animals will be in heaven? Thank goodness it is God who decides and not you.

 

[LilyM]

Plants are not creatures.

God created them, they are living beings, they are certainly creatures. What else would you call them?

I for one do not eat any animal.

Do you wear or use leather?

The fact that you and other humans do does not define the difference.

No it doesn’t. The fact that God gave us dominion over them, and gave them to us to be our food, as scripture indicates, does make a difference. The fact that God through Moses commanded the killing and eating of lamb on Passover makes a greater difference.

The fact that Jesus - not a mere imperfect human but God Himself - personally ate animals, in the form of fish (and almost certainly lamb), and gave fish (and almost certainly lamb) to others to eat, puts the matter beyond reasonable doubt.

Jesus wasn’t a less than perfect steward, and in His entirely perfect stewardship He exercised His rightful prerogative to eat fish (and almost doubtless other meats as well) and to encourage others to do so too.

That we are made in God’s image and have superior intellect gives us the obligation to treat other sentient creatures with compassion and mercy. We were not given animals to eat in the world God created.

Says who? Not scripture. Not the example of Christ, who Himself ate flesh ‘in the world He created’

There has been so much violence in this world caused by people who purport to speak on behalf of God.

I don’t purport to speak on behalf of anyone. The words of scripture and the example of Christ’s own life are eloquent enough.

Why are you so obviously upset about those who want or believe animals will be in heaven? Thank goodness it is God who decides and not you.

I am upset that people are so attached to earthly relationships, including those with their pets, that they see them as somehow necessary to complete their happiness in heaven. God alone is enough, and if He isn’t, no additional pets or anything else will make us happy there.

 

[severus68]

God created them, they are living beings, they are certainly creatures. What else would you call them?

Do you wear or use leather?

No it doesn’t. The fact that God gave us dominion over them, and gave them to us to be our food, as scripture indicates, does make a difference. The fact that God through Moses commanded the killing and eating of lamb on Passover makes a greater difference.

The fact that Jesus - not a mere imperfect human but God Himself - personally ate animals, in the form of fish (and almost certainly lamb), and gave fish (and almost certainly lamb) to others to eat, puts the matter beyond reasonable doubt.

Jesus wasn’t a less than perfect steward, and in His entirely perfect stewardship He exercised His rightful prerogative to eat fish (and almost doubtless other meats as well) and to encourage others to do so too.

Says who? Not scripture. Not the example of Christ, who Himself ate flesh ‘in the world He created’

I don’t purport to speak on behalf of anyone. The words of scripture and the example of Christ’s own life are eloquent enough.

I am upset that people are so attached to earthly relationships, including those with their pets, that they see them as somehow necessary to complete their happiness in heaven. God alone is enough, and if He isn’t, no additional pets or anything else will make us happy there.

I do not really have to explain my lifestyle especially to one who obviously just sees animals as God given commodities but yes, I try to avoid animal products. I do not wear leather,

I did not intend this to be confrontational and thus be uncharitable. I do not think we can ever agree on this issue. However, I must say that I have always found that my attachments to all my loved ones human and otherwise and my love for them continually deeepens my love for and my relationship with God.

God bless.

 

[PaschalCatholic]

My uncle, who is not Catholic, has told my nephew that the family pets do not go to Heaven when they die. I have lost a lot of very beloved pets in my life, and I always thought I’d be reunited with them personally. But I heard something on EWTN a few weeks ago that made me question this. Is my uncle right? Does anyone know the Church’s teaching on animals when they die?

Lilder

So I hate to skip everything everyone else has said and get right to the point, but there are quite a lot of posts.
My best man in my upcoming wedding is a seminarian for my diocese and studies a lot of Aquinas. Aquinas (from Plato, Aristotle, and Augustine) teaches essentially that our souls are like an onion made of layers whereas something like our dog’s is made of only one.

aquinasonline.com/Topics/soul.html

My friend also told me that humans have what Aquinas called a “spiritual soul”. This soul is what makes it possible for us to live beyond our bodies’ capabilities. In God’s infinite wisdom, love, and power, He did not give this to plants or animals.
God bless,
B

 

[PaschalCatholic]

No it doesn’t. The fact that God gave us dominion over them, and gave them to us to be our food, as scripture indicates, does make a difference. The fact that God through Moses commanded the killing and eating of lamb on Passover makes a greater difference.

The fact that Jesus - not a mere imperfect human but God Himself - personally **ate animals, in the form of fish (and almost certainly lamb), and gave fish (and almost certainly lamb) to others to eat, puts the matter beyond reasonable doubt. **

Says who? Not scripture. Not the example of Christ, who Himself ate flesh ‘in the world He created’

I am upset that people are so attached to earthly relationships, including those with their pets, that they see them as somehow necessary to complete their happiness in heaven. God alone is enough, and if He isn’t, no additional pets or anything else will make us happy there.

Amen.
To add to the comment about animals being sentient and made in God’s image. Whether you believe that or not, there is no evidence to support it in Scripture or Tradition, or even science for that matter.
Scripture and Tradition tell us that man was made in God’s image, not everything. Yes, in all creation we see bits of God just as you see bits of someone’s personality in the artwork they create, but not every piece of art is intended to image its creator.
Science tells us that yes there are intelligent animals (chimps, dolphins, etc.) however, none of these are able to move beyond tasks given to a child. Sentience only means that an animal can feel or perceive which is not involved in being received into God’s kingdom. Even if animals could move beyond menial tasks, intelligence also has nothing to do with salvation. Please don’t get me wrong, I am in no way saying animals are bad or something to be abused. I am however saying that there is no rational explanation within science or the Church which would indicate that animals on Earth are first of all capable of many of the things we do and second of all able to receive Christ’s saving grace.
God bless,
B

 

[ProVobis]

After loving my dogs to much I have learned some of the Faith through them. I didn’t understand the body of church term or the bridegroom. It just seemed so far out and the ectasy and love that has been expressed. Then I thought how much I loved my little Pit Bull baby and it all fit in. I adored every bit of him. When I asked for blessed Mother Mary to intervene and help me quickly as a mother my prayer was answered right then. My dog was out of his head in pain and we didn’t know how to pick him up without hurting him. My heart was being torn apart by his cries. I left the room and came back and he got up and bravely walked to the back door and into the car to his death awaiting at the Vets. I had prayed to God first but it wasn’t fast enough and so I knew Mary could intercede. I can still see him walking bravely and slowly like a little soldier. I still ask out Heavenly Father to bless him and take car of him until I get there.

Sorry for your loss. This is something that may console you a little bit.

petloss.com/rainbowbridge.htm