Planned Parenthood, Abortion, and Contrception

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Lost_Sheep

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I got into a discussion the other day with a friend of mine who is a strong supporter of Planned Parenthood. She knows that I sit on the Pro-Life side of the fence.

One of her arguments in support of PP is that by providing birth control, there will be less likelihood of unwanted pregnancies and therefore less abortions.

While I kind of agree with the “lesser of two evils” idea, i.e., killing a child is worse than not creating a child in the first place, how should I respond to her that both abortion and contraception are both intrinsically evil.

BTW, she is not a person of faith so I doubt that a religious-based argument will sway her.
 
You could try pointing out to her that in most of the developed world, contraception is plentiful, has been for years, and has not stopped unwanted pregnancies. In fact, it is the development and ready availability of contraception that contributed to the boom in abortion.

Because of effective contraception methods, sex became separated from pregnancy. People seek sex without having first discerned the likelihood of becoming pregnant. Your friend may be one of those people who claim that it is our RIGHT as a free and civilized society to have sex without the shadow of pregnancy lurking about, and that is abominable.

Sex has become very self-serving, and not self-giving. Love and marriage and sex are all ordered towards the creation of life through a complete sharing between two people (This doesn’t have to be a physically related child). When you put a barrier between those things, we become less human, and all life becomes disposable.
 
Here is a post that can answer your question:
JimG said:
Yes, fornication is a lesser evil than abortion—but—fornication causes more abortion because non-marital sex leads to abortion as a remedy for failed birth control. More fornication always means more abortion.

Contraception leads to fornication. Fornication leads to abortion. Shall a mother say to her child, ‘be glad I sent you to be raised by two women or two men, because I could have had you killed.’?

It is not a good practice to support evil actions just because they are lesser evils. Bad actions lead to more evil. Good actions lead to more good.
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If I say I don’t want to get lung cancer from smoking cigarettes and still smoke at least a pack a day should the fact that I don’t want cancer negate the responsibility I assume for the likely results and consequences of my smoking habits?
 
If the recent ten videos of PP doesn’t make someone pro-life, I don’t know what will.
 
There are two ideas I would bring to her attention: 1) Most contraception pills actually cause a fetus at the very beginning of life to abort. 2) I believe that world wide most abortions are committed on women (the baby variety) because some cultures are only going to have a few children and many prefer males.:(:mad::confused:😊
 
Here is a statistic about abortions and contraception from Planned Parenthood’s own research arm (the Guttmacher Institute).

• Fifty-one percent of women who have abortions had used a contraceptive method in the month they got pregnant, most commonly condoms (27%) or a hormonal method (17%).

In otherwords they used birth control, it failed, killed the baby anyway. So no it doesn’t reduce abortions. What it does is cause people to have a false sense of “safety” resulting in more sexual encounters. Since pregnancy is an unanticipated consequence of that behavior, abortion become the final step when things weren’t as safe as expected.

You can find this and other stats from the Guttmacher Institute here.
 
It’s truly shameful that the black community & women’s groups do not support pro-life causes considering the large number of black babies & female babies aborted. 😦
 
SMH_2015 said:
It’s truly shameful that the black community & women’s groups do not support pro-life causes considering the large number of black babies & female babies aborted. 😦
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This is especially sobering, given the stats in NYC alone.
 
Lost_Sheep said:
I got into a discussion the other day with a friend of mine who is a strong supporter of Planned Parenthood. She knows that I sit on the Pro-Life side of the fence.

One of her arguments in support of PP is that by providing birth control, there will be less likelihood of unwanted pregnancies and therefore less abortions.

While I kind of agree with the “lesser of two evils” idea, i.e., killing a child is worse than not creating a child in the first place, how should I respond to her that both abortion and contraception are both intrinsically evil.

BTW, she is not a person of faith so I doubt that a religious-based argument will sway her.
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Her argument might hold water with some if it weren’t patently false. Multiple studies have shown that the easier it is to get free birth control, the higher the rates of unwanted pregnancies, abortions and STDs. The presence of a Planned Parenthood facility in a neighborhood leads to an increase of unwanted pregnancies and abortions. They don’t provide any necessary services to women and with the wondrous advent of Obamacare, there shouldn’t be any need for them whatsoever since everyone should now be able to go to a reputable medical facility for all their medical needs.
 
abortion is murder, and it’s especially horrible because it gives people the right to murder under the law. Anyway you look at it, it’s murder. I remember watching the TV show “House” and House even said it’s murder ON TELEVISION.

also, there is such a thing as natural family planning where a woman knows exactly when she is ovulating and when she is not. It makes a woman more in-tune with her body and is actually a really beautiful way to respect yourself ( if you’re a woman) in that you realize how amazing your body is, and how amazing God is.

Honestly these pro-choice people and their arguments never make any sense to me. okay so it’s a womans choice…to kill someone. She is no different from a murderer in prison except that the person in prison is doing time. And if shes a victim of rape? okay I’ll pray for her but if she kills that child then she’s creating another victim and comiting a greater sin. If she doesn’t want the child? Give the child up for adoption, there are hundreds of people who would love to adopt a child. Now lets say the person is a teenager and can’t afford to have a child much less is too irresponsible to take care of them…well if you’re too young to have a child, don’t you think you’re too young to have sex? For some reason people no longer correlate sex with getting pregnant, either way give the child up for adoption.

But honestly there is a small percentage of abortions that result from rape and the sad truth is people do it because it’s convenient for them. Ending a life is convenient for them. And that puts the value of life down a couple notches, not just for unborn babies but for eveyone. And that is why it’s dangerous for society, because if society can believe that a baby who has no way of defending themselves has no rights because their own mother thinks so, then whats to stop that same person from killing an elderly person who can no longer take care of themselves or defend themselves. Your friends way of thinking is dangerous, because it creates the illusion that human life is expendable.
 
Graceful_Lamb said:
If the recent ten videos of PP doesn’t make someone pro-life, I don’t know what will.
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👍

I have a pretty strong stomach… I’ve seen a lot of very gruesome things…
I couldn’t make it thru some of those… I haven’t had nightmares since I was a child - those gave me nightmares.
Wish I had never seen them!
 
Lost_Sheep said:
There have also been rumors those videos have been edited. Who really knows?
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“Edited” how? Putting words in peoples’ mouths that they didn’t actually say? Using photoshop instead of real aborted babies? 🤷 Even the people in the videos haven’t said any of it was faked (as far as I know).
 
Lost_Sheep said:
There have also been rumors those videos have been edited. Who really knows?
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SMH_2015 said:
“Edited” how? Putting words in peoples’ mouths that they didn’t actually say? Using photoshop instead of real aborted babies? 🤷 Even the people in the videos haven’t said any of it was faked (as far as I know).
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The footage was edited to remove the bathroom breaks and a few other, imho, minor/unrelated timeline. The full video was provided.

Even with the edited portions, the audio wasn’t tampered with in anyway, as shown by PP own “independent” investigator (Which BTW has ties with one or more of PP people):
Planned Parenthood’s Own Experts Find “No Evidence of Audio Manipulation” in Eight Shocking Videos

The truth will come out:
WASHINGTON (AP) — A House committee chairman issued a subpoena Tuesday for an anti-abortion group’s unedited videos about Planned Parenthood’s provision of fetal tissue for research. (…)
In an email, David Daleiden, the center’s founder, said he was beginning to copy the footage Chaffetz requested to a hard drive to send the committee.
No one in their right mind would provide an unedited version unless they are absolutely certain of the contents! If I were a betting Man, I’d bet that even congress will not show the entire footage.

If you can stomach it… here’s the link to CME’s youtube channel with the full footage:
youtube.com/user/centerformedprogress
:tears:

Lost_Sheep, if your friend can sit thru all of those, and still support PP, then, imho, your only option is to pray for her soul and for the Holy Spirit to bring your friend to the truth, the way, and the light.
 
Lost_Sheep said:
There have also been rumors those videos have been edited. Who really knows?
Click to expand...
What amount of editing would change a conversation where a Dr is casually discussing how you have to cut the face off a live baby to harvest its brain?
 
Lost_Sheep said:
There have also been rumors those videos have been edited. Who really knows?
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Edited for brevity, the CMP has stated this repeatedly. This is standard practice in the media industry especially as soundbyte clips have become popular. The edited video canard is tossed out because PP supporters would prefer to dismiss all the videos without having to acknowledge any of the content. When I have brought up the fact that unedited, full length videos are available (one is even 5.5 hours!) the PP supporters refuse to comment.

PP is following the old mantra, “What are you going to believe? What I say or your lying eyes?”
 
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