Please explain Calvinism & Arminianism more

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I do not quite understand what Calvinists and Arminians believe. If I get into a debate/discussion with Protestants, I would like to know which denominations are Calvinist and which are Arminian. I also would like to know what the beliefs are of those two groups and how those beliefs compare with the doctrine of the Catholic Church. For instance, what scriptures should I use to appeal to a Calvinist or an Arminian to show the truth of Catholicism? Also, what Protestant sources detail their beliefs?
 
Simply put, Calvinists (and Lutherans) believe that regeneration precedes faith and Arminians believe the opposite.

Calvinists are best known for teaching TULIP:

Total Depravity - Human beings are born sinful and sin because they are sinful, they deserve only death and hell.
Unconditional Election - God chooses to save some people but not in view of any merit inhering in them, he does so solely out of grace.
Limited Atonement-Jesus did not die for everyone, He died only for the elect.
Irresistible Grace-Whom God chooses to save will, inevitably, be saved, he or she cannot resist Him.
Perseverence of the Saints-The elect will persevere in the faith unto glory because it is God who preserves them.

Arminians believe, more or less, differently on each of these points.

For the record, Lutherans believe in, possibly two or three of these points.
 
Which points do Lutherans believe? Do Arminians reject all of those beliefs?
 
lak611 said:
Which points do Lutherans believe? Do Arminians reject all of those beliefs?
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TULIP was written specifically to show how Arminism is incorrect so they are by nature opposites. (I am Arminian) To see a comparison of the two check here:
fivesolas.com/cal_arm.htm

Most denominations ascribe to one or the other a few denominatins can’t seem to make up their mind and Non-denominational Churches, well for those there is no way to tell but to go ask the pastor. :banghead: Lutherans appear to be a mixture of the two. see dawningrealm.org/reign/index.html#Lutheran
 
There are many distinctions, but the most fundamental is the concepts of predestination vs. free will. Calvinists often believe in “double predestination”, which means (stated very simply) that God has predestined (as opposed to merely having aforeknowledge of) those who will be saved and those who will be damned. Many Presbyterians are Calvinists. Lutherans generally believe in “single predestination” (God has chosen the elect for salvation…those who are damned are damned by their own actions not God’s choice). Arminians generally believe that while salvation is through the grace of God only, God allows people to choose whether they will accept that grace. Most Methodists and Baptists, and many non-denominational churches, are Arminian in approach.
 
No Baptist church in my area is arminian. Someone once told me it was regional??
 
I dont know what Calvin had against people from Arminia. its a nice country.
 
Syele said:
No Baptist church in my area is arminian. Someone once told me it was regional??
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Syele,

It probably is. I say that because, there is a Baptist church nearby that the pastor is a “4 point” calvinist, but most of the ones round here close are more Armenian.

But my experience is very limited. Baptists historically, according the the London Baptist Confession of Faith, are pretty much Calvinist (except for not doing infant baptism and sprinkling and what all). But that’s maybe beside the point :whistle:
 
Reformed_Rob said:
Syele,

It probably is. I say that because, there is a Baptist church nearby that the pastor is a “4 point” calvinist, but most of the ones round here close are more Armenian.

But my experience is very limited. Baptists historically, according the the London Baptist Confession of Faith, are pretty much Calvinist (except for not doing infant baptism and sprinkling and what all). But that’s maybe beside the point :whistle:
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**mumbles under her breath about people who can’t stick to one side or the other. 4 points sheesh. (Which one did he grab from the other side?)
 
lak611 said:
I do not quite understand what Calvinists and Arminians believe. If I get into a debate/discussion with Protestants, I would like to know which denominations are Calvinist and which are Arminian.
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The Church of Christ (Campbellites) are very very Arminian. Like, they are the incarnation of Arminianism.

Most Presbyterians are Calvinists. Not all, but if you meet a Presbyterian Calvinist, probably you won’t get them to admit “I don’t know how to respond to that verse” in a short discussion.

It will take time…it’s a very complex system.

One Catholic apologist said that Calvinism is probably the single most comprehensive system of belief that a Catholic is likely to encounter.

Instead of a “my Bible verses vs. your Bible verses” type discussion, maybe you could ask how a person knows if they are truly saved.

A Calvinist will probably say something along the lines of … “Well, I really can’t be sure, but I know that if I have true faith and if I persevere to the end, then I am saved.”

An Arminian…I guess maybe they would say something like…“If I have true faith and if I persevere to the end, then I am saved.”

Sorry, that probably doesn’t help much! Except for my point is that a Calvinist is involved in this mystery of predestination…that is…they can never know the future, whether they will persevere or not. Remember, one point is the “P” the “Perseverance of Saints.” But they have faith and will rely on something (grace?) to persevere.

Of course there is a mystery to what we believe, but we as Catholics have tangible things to let us enter into the reality of our salvation. Not that a Protestant will care, but at least they will maybe come away better understanding what we believe and why. And a seed would be planted!
 
Most Calvinists would Say they know they are saved and going to Heaven, that it’s possible to know for sure. They would say if they weren’t elect then God wouldn’t have drawn them to profess their faith. They will usually only admit they can’t know positively that they are elected if you press them alot saying that maybe their faith isn’t as true as they think. (Well, that is, if they don’t get mad at you first for making a point like that) Calvinists don’t need to perservere to the end. they believe God’s elect will perservere reguardless of anything man does. People have no free-will. (Well someone once said they get to choose little things like weather to have pizza or green beans for dinner?!?)
 
Arminianism comes from the theories produces by Jacobus Arminius who lived in the early 17th century and his views seem to be closer to the Council of Trent’s than they were of Calvin in that the elect were predestined not by an arbitrary choice of God, rather, God knew from the start of creation who would accept Him or reject Him. Arminius’ thoughts were sumerized in his, “Five Articles of Remonstrants” which were rejected by the Reformed Church.
 
TOME said:
Arminianism comes from the theories produces by Jacobus Arminius who lived in the early 17th century and his views seem to be closer to the Council of Trent’s than they were of Calvin in that the elect were predestined not by an arbitrary choice of God, rather, God knew from the start of creation who would accept Him or reject Him. Arminius’ thoughts were sumerized in his, “Five Articles of Remonstrants” which were rejected by the Reformed Church.
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Do you know what the “Five Articles of Remonstrants” are? I would like to see that to compare it to the T.U.L.I.P. five points that the Calvinists believe.
 
lak611 said:
Do you know what the “Five Articles of Remonstrants” are? I would like to see that to compare it to the T.U.L.I.P. five points that the Calvinists believe.
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That is exactly what the link I provided was… I’ll copy and paste it here in case you couldn’t go to the link for some reason:

The “Five Points” of Arminianism ****1. Free Will or Human Ability Although human nature was seriously affected by the fall, man has not been left in a state of total spiritual helplessness. God graciously enables every sinner to repent and believe, but He does not interfere with man’s freedom. Each sinner possesses a free will, and his eternal destiny depends on how he uses it. Man’s freedom consists of his ability to choose good over evil in spiritual matters; his will is not enslaved to his sinful nature. The sinner has the power to either cooperate with God’s Spirit and be regenerated or resist God’s grace and perish. The lost sinner needs the Spirit’s assistance, but he does not have to be regenerated by the Spirit before he can believe, for faith is man’s act and precedes the new birth. Faith is the sinner’s gift to God; it is man’s contribution to salvation.
2. Conditional Election God’s choice of certain individuals unto salvation before the foundation of the world was based upon His foreseeing that they would respond to His call. He selected only those whom He knew would of themselves freely believe the gospel. Election therefore was determined by or conditioned upon what man would do. The faith which God foresaw and upon which He based His choice was not given to the sinner by God (it was not created by the regenerating power of the Holy Spirit) but resulted solely from man’s will. It was left entirely up to man as to who would believe and therefore as to who would be elected unto salvation. God chose those whom He knew would, of their own free will, choose Christ. Thus the sinner’s choice of Christ, not God’s choice of the sinner, is the ultimate cause of salvation.
3. Universal Redemption or General Atonement Christ’s redeeming work made it possible for everyone to be saved but did not actually secure the salvation of anyone. Although Christ died for all men and for every man, only those who believe on Him are saved. His death enabled God to pardon sinners on the condition that they believe, but it did not actually put away anyone’s sins. Christ’s redemption becomes effective only if man chooses to accept it.
4. The Holy Spirit Can be Effectually Resisted The Spirit calls inwardly all those who are called outwardly by the gospel invitation; He does all that He can to bring every sinner to salvation. But inasmuch as man is free, he can successfully resist the Spirit’s call. The Spirit cannot regenerate the sinner until he believes; faith (which is man’s contribution) precedes and makes possible the new birth. Thus, man’s free will limits the Spirit in the application of Christ’s saving work. The Holy Spirit can only draw to Christ those who allow Him to have His way with them. Until the sinner responds, the Spirit cannot give life. God’s grace, therefore, is not invincible; it can be, and often is, resisted and thwarted by man.
5. Falling from Grace Those who believe and are truly saved can lose their salvation by failing to keep up their faith, etc. All Arminians have not been agreed on this point; some have held that believers are eternally secure in Christ–that once a sinner is regenerated, he can never be lost.
 
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** The “Five Points” of Calvinism1. Total Inability or Total Depravity Because of the fall, man is unable of himself to savingly believe the gospel. The sinner is dead, blind, and deaf to the things of God; his heart is deceitful and desperately corrupt. His will is not free, it is in bondage to his evil nature, therefore, he will not–indeed he cannot–choose good over evil in the spiritual realm. Consequently, it takes much more than the Spirit’s assistance to bring a sinner to Christ–it takes regeneration by which the Spirit makes the sinner alive and gives him a new nature. Faith is not something man contributes to salvation but is itself a part of God’s gift of salvation–it is God’s gift to the sinner, not the sinner’s gift to God.
2. Unconditional Election God’s choice of certain individuals unto salvation before the foundation of the world rested solely in His own sovereign will. His choice of particular sinners was not based on any foreseen response or obedience on their part, such as faith, repentance, etc. On the contrary, God gives faith and repentance to each individual whom He selected. These acts are the result, not the cause of God’s choice. Election therefore was not determined by or conditioned upon any virtuous quality or act foreseen in man. Those whom God sovereignly elected He brings through the power of the Spirit to a willing acceptance of Christ. Thus God’s choice of the sinner, not the sinner’s choice of Christ, is the ultimate cause of salvation.
3. Limited Atonement or Particular Redemption Christ’s redeeming work was intended to save the elect only and actually secured salvation for them. His death was a substitutionary endurance of the penalty of sin in the place of certain specified sinners. In addition to putting away the sins of His people, Christ’s redemption secured everything necessary for their salvation, including faith which unites them to Him. The gift of faith is infallibly applied by the Spirit to all for whom Christ died, therefore guaranteeing their salvation.
4. Irresistible Grace or The Efficacious Call of the Spirit In addition to the outward general call to salvation which is made to everyone who hears the gospel, the Holy Spirit extends to the elect a special inward call that inevitably brings them to salvation. The external call (which is made to all without distinction) can be, and often is, rejected; whereas the internal call (which is made only to the elect) cannot be rejected; it always results in conversion. By means of this special call the Spirit irresistibly draws sinners to Christ. He is not limited in His work of applying salvation by man’s will, nor is He dependent upon man’s cooperation for success. The Spirit graciously causes the elect sinner to cooperate, to believe, to repent, to come freely and willingly to Christ. God’s grace, therefore, is invincible; it never fails to result in the salvation of those to whom it is extended.
5. Perseverance of the Saints All who are chosen by God, redeemed by Christ, and given faith by the Spirit are eternally saved. They are kept in faith by the power of Almighty God and thus persevere to the end.
 
Sounds like the Arminians are closer to Catholic beliefs. As far as Baptists go, if they are Calvinist, why do they bother with evangelization? If you are a Calvinist, evangelization is pointless, because God has already chosen who will be saved so man need not preach!
 
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