Please help with annulment problem!

[Mapper71]

My fiancé is trying to get the necessary documents to complete a Lack of Form for an annulment. We have been having a huge problem trying to get his ex wife to return any phone calls or emails regarding her baptismal information, which is what we need. It took my fiancé months to track her down and once he did, she seemed very cordial and said she would get the necessary info and get back to him within a day or two. It has now been almost a month and after numerous phone calls and emails, she has yet to respond to anything. Is there any other way to go about getting this Lack of Form completed or do we really have to wait for her to respond? What if she never does? We currently live about 1500 miles apart and have been this way for 2 years. I insisted on living here until we are married and then will move out there. The church doesn’t seem to have any answers for us except wait on her response. I don’t know if we can wait much longer. Seeing each other 4 weeks out of the year isn’t cutting it anymore and paying $350-$400/plane ticket is eating our money! Is there anything we can do to move this along??

 

[puzzleannie]

if you can at least get from her or her family the name of the parish where she was baptized, your friends pastor or the tribunal can request the baptismal info directly from that parish, even if you know the town that will be a starting point.

 

[Mapper71]

Yes I know that but that’s the thing-he doesn’t know any of that info. He knows she was born in Florida, but not sure where. He married her without knowing her well and she left him 6 months later. He didn’t know her family at all and hardly any of her friends and has no way of contacting them. If we could just get the city and start contacting parishes it woudl be a step, but we have nothing. What if we can never get this info??

 

[Sure]

Just a thought…I wonder if a professional investigator could uncover where she was born and lived. Then perhaps you could check with all the parishes in that area for baptismal records.

 

[pigtown]

Does he know where she went to school? At least that would give you a city. Were they married in the R.C. Church? If so, that could also be a start especially if it was her family’s parish.

 

[Mapper71]

No they were married by a judge, which is why we can do the Lack of Form. He doesn’t know really anything about her childhood and we don’t have the money to pay a private investigator. Besides we know what city she is living in now, her phone number and her email address. We just can’t get her to respond.

 

[1ke]

Mapper, is your fiance a baptized Catholic?

 

[Mapper71]

No he isn’t Catholic. He isn’t any religion. His ex was Catholic which is why it makes it so hard to understand why we have to go through this!

 

[ElizabethAnne]

We currently live about 1500 miles apart and have been this way for 2 years. I insisted on living here until we are married and then will move out there.

I know you are asking advice about the annulment situation, but this two sentences really struck me. In my experience, long distance relationships have not worked well as preparation for marriage. The distance usually means that the couple knows little about how their intended is day-to-day, all year long.

I would suggest moving near each other for a period of time before the wedding. But I wouldn’t even do that until after the annulment paperwork is completed since he is currently presumed married to his first wife. I hope that you will be able to work that out quickly.

God bless you.

 

[1ke]

No he isn’t Catholic. He isn’t any religion.

Sigh.

This is a giant red flag all it’s own. Why would a practicing Catholic want to enter into a marriage with a non-Christian? Is he in RCIA? Does he intend to be baptized and practice the faith.

You have bigger issues than finding his ex-wife’s baptismal records.

His ex was Catholic which is why it makes it so hard to understand why we have to go through this!

What is hard to understand about it? He isn’t free to marry.

You will have to continue to work towards getting her Sacramental records, and continue to discuss the case with the tribunal if she does not answer.

 

[Sina]

Sigh.

Why would a practicing Catholic want to enter into a marriage with a non-Christian?.

Because they are in love ? Not every Saint was married to a Christian. Not every Saint was even a Christian their whole lives.

 

[1ke]

Because they are in love ?

A poor reason.

Not every Saint was married to a Christian.

That does not change Church teaching on mixed marriage. Many early church Saints were married to non-Christians before they themselves became Christians. That is not the same as seeking to marry a non-Christians, which the church repeatedly teaches against.

Not every Saint was even a Christian their whole lives.

Which is not relevant to the topic.

 

[Gertabelle]

Why would a practicing Catholic want to enter into a marriage with a non-Christian?

QUOTE]
Sina;2681485:

Because they are in love ?

It seems to me that it just can’t be said enough times:

Falling in love is a choice!

I speak from personal experience here, as a single mom with an annulment from the previous marriage. Finding a single, Catholic, early 40-something, employed, fatherly (for my son) man may not be easy, but the “slim pickin’s” does not mean I should go after any man just because I’m attracted to him. And there have been some extremely eligible, handsome, smart, funny, kind and compassionate single men in my life recently!

With regard to the annulment, surely your fiancee must have known SOMETHING about this woman during the time they were married – where she grew up, what part of the state she lived in, what high school she attended, her last name. Any of this information could be helpful for a search.

Mapper71, you mention that your fiancee married his first wife without knowing her well. Please be careful. With the two of you living 1500 miles apart, it’s questionable how well the two of you know each other. Again, I speak from experience – my ex husband lived in Boston and I in Denver before we married. I second the recommendation to live near one another before marriage – and the advice to marry a Catholic.

Keep praying. I’ll be praying for both of you as well.

Gertie

 

[Deacon_Ed]

No he isn’t Catholic. He isn’t any religion. His ex was Catholic which is why it makes it so hard to understand why we have to go through this!

Actually, that’s why you have to go through this. If she weren’t Catholic then there would be no possibility of a lack of form. Catholics are bound to canonical form so you have to prove that she was Catholic.

If you can find out where she was baptized you can get a copy of her baptismal certificate from the parish where she was baptized. Perhaps she can tell you that much and then you can follow up.

Deacon Ed

 

[lizaanne]

If you are Catholic, why are you even engaged to a married man in the first place? Until the Church determines that he is free to marry, he is considered married - period. Are you planning to marry in the Church? I’m assuming so since you are pursing a declaration of nullity for him.

I have to agree with other responses - red flags up for the poorly thought out first marriage, and that you as a Catholic are willing to marry someone who has little or now faith life at all. This doesn’t sound like a good foundation to me based on what you have told us so far.

I’m sure he knows stuff like her birth date and social security number, you have her address and phone. There are some online search services (make sure it is a reputable site) that will find out just about anything you want to know about a person for probably the cost of one of your plane tickets, or less. You should not have to hire a PI in this day and age of the Internet.

Have him look at his marriage certificate - mine has my parent’s names listed on it, this is more information for a search service to use to find her baptism location. If he doesn’t have it, he can request a copy from the location where the marriage took place.

In the mean time - I would at the very least suggest taking this extremely slow and wait until you can live in the same city (NOT TOGETHER) for awhile AFTER he has been found free to marry. In the mean time, just work on the paperwork and see what happens.

~Liza

 

[kage_ar]

When your boyfriend and his ex-wife applied for a marriage license - they would have listed the place of birth.

It does seem odd that someone would be married and not know anything about the person - surely he knew his in-laws?

 

[Inman]

I was going to suggest that you try to get a copy of her birth certificiate, but Florida’s birth certificates don’t have the city of birth.

The other idea I had was to contact the parish where she was registered when your fiance and her were together. I know when we registered at our parish recently, the form asked when and where our baptism, confirmation, etc. took place. You might also try her current parish if you know it.

What about calling her parents? Presumably, they would know. Perhaps it would be uncomfortable, but if you have no other choice. If the parents are catholic, they may want to see the marriage annulled to free up their daughter to marry again in the church and may be willing to help you.

The other idea I had is instead of calling parishes, call the record departments at the dioceses in Florida. There are probably only 5 or 6 in the state. Maybe they could tell you what parish her records are kept at.

Good luck.