Pope Benedict changes Good Friday Prayer

[Tomster]

Last night Raymond Arroyo on his “World Over” program stated that Pope Benedict has changed the Good Friday prayer for the conversion of the Jews in the Traditional, EO, rite and not the Novus Ordo.

Comments?

 

[Aramis]

Last night Raymond Arroyo on his “World Over” program stated that Pope Benedict has changed the Good Friday prayer for the conversion of the Jews in the Traditional, EO, rite and not the Novus Ordo.

Comments?

No surprise. I suspect it will be closer to the latin of the NO… ecumenism at work…

 

[bpbasilphx]

The prayer and its preface are available may places on line (wdprs.com is one). Read it and see what you think.

 

[Aramis]

The prayer and its preface are available may places on line (wdprs.com is one). Read it and see what you think.

I can’t find that site…
CWN:

The new version, published in L’Osservatore Romano, reads:

Oremus et pro Iudaeis. Ut Deus et Dominus noster illuminet corda eorum, ut agnoscant Iesum Christum salvatorem omnium hominum.
Oremus.
Flectamus genua.
Levate.
Omnipotens sempiterne Deus, qui vis ut omnes homines salvi fiant et ad agnitionem veritatis veniant, concede propitius, ut plenitudine gentium in Ecclesiam Tuam intrante omnis Israel salvus fiat. Per Christum Dominum nostrum. Amen.

This prayer would be used only in the Latin language, in the extraordinary form of the Latin liturgy. However it could be translated:

Let us also pray for the Jews: that God our Lord might enlighten their hearts, so that they might know Jesus Christ as the Savior of all mankind.
Let us pray.
Let us bend our knees (kneel).
Please rise.
Almighty and eternal God, whose desire it is that all men might be saved and come to the knowledge of truth, grant in your mercy that as the fullness of mankind enters into your Church, all Israel may be saved, through Christ our Lord. Amen.

cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=56427

a pretty tiny step towards the NO wording…

 

[jj2011]

If this were no more than a matter of changing a Tuesday night novena prayer, I’d say fine. It isn’t.

I wonder if the Orthodox would change a prayer of that antiquity if the Talmud Rabbis called for it.

 

[Rolltide]

Here’s a link to a really good blog that discusses some of the ramifications of the prayer:

remnantnewspaper.com/Archives/archive-2008-a_papal_masterstroke.htm

Some people are skeptical about the reasons for the change, but most seem to be ok with it. The substance of the prayer has not changed. Even early reaction from the SSPX has been that they would obey the change and use it.

Now, consider this change in combination with the following letter from Joseph Ratzinger in 2003:

wdtprs.com/blog/2008/02/important-2003-letter-of-card-ratzinger-about-the-older-rite-of-mass/

This is a telling statement. It seems that the “master plan” for the church is to indeed have a single form of the Mass again, with the Extraordinary Form as the starting point. Gradually, the EO Form will influence the NO backwards, and they will merge into a new form that has truly developed organically.

 

[markadm]

Already discussed in detail on this forum here.

wdtprs.com/blog/ is the blog you’re looking for.

 

[stmaria]

Conservative Rabbis to Vote on Resolution Criticizing Pope’s Revision of Prayer
nytimes.com/2008/02/09/us/09prayer.html?_r=3&oref=slogin&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

"Most Catholics worship in the vernacular, and their prayers will not be affected. But last year, the pope made it easier for traditionalists to celebrate the Latin Mass that was the norm before Vatican II…The Rev. James Massa, executive director of the secretariat of ecumenical and interreligious affairs of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, said Friday that the prayer would be heard by “a tiny minority of Catholics and they will hear it in Latin."

So only a tiny minority will hear the truth.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Last night Raymond Arroyo on his “World Over” program stated that Pope Benedict has changed the Good Friday prayer for the conversion of the Jews in the Traditional, EO, rite and not the Novus Ordo.

Comments?

Extremely pointless, I fear.​

Dropping inflammatory language: well and good. That’s been done, years ago. So it at least can’t be a reason for complaint now.

Now, OTOH, the language has been softened without removing the really offensive element in the prayer: the desire that the Jews should be converted to Christ. And as that is still present - as it should be - the change is pointless; it is polite, but is still perceived as demeaning.

I think the prayers for schismatics, heretics, enemies of the Church, persecutors, Jews, & heathens are as timely & necessary as ever. People still do these things; we still live with these temptations. Sin hasn’t vanished - it’s as lethal to every one of us on earth as ever. We can still be damned. There should more prayers like that - not fewer. And we should have the Rogation Days back.

What is self-defeating is the sort of half-measure that would rather like the Jews (& others) to be converted, & expresses this desire in the Liturgy, but does so as though not convinced that it really matters. As far as most secularists are concerned, all forms of Christianity are equally Fundamentalist & brainless - so we might as well earn their contempt by being outspoken, as by sounding as though we don’t believe our own doctrines. A weedy semi-pagan religion that speaks out of both sides of its mouth and puts diplomacy above faith does no-one any favours.

A half-and-half religion that dilutes its faith & its prayers to appease those who don’t like it is asking for trouble. And the dilution can only be seen be comparing what now it says & does & prays, with how & what it formerly did. There are already people who want us to revise the Bible to take out the un-PC bits - changing the Liturgy like this plays into their hands. If the Liturgy has to be changed, let it become less PC in some text not objected to for every text that people do complain of