Pope Declares-Non Catholics Do Not Possess the Full Truth

[guanophore]

Rom 14:10
But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

Rom 14:11
For it is written, [As] I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

Rom 14:12
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

Do you think the Pope saying that non-Catholics do not have the fullness of faith, he is “judging” others?

 

[guanophore]

Hi
Is the above quote from Jesus’ mouth? I don’t thinks so.

Thanks

I think I am going to faint, Paarsurrey said something I agree with.

 

[RevDrNorth]

Do you think the Pope saying that non-Catholics do not have the fullness of faith, he is “judging” others?

I don’t know about the poster who posted the scripture…but I think Benedict is just flat wrong. From what I have read if any church can claim to be the church of the Apostles it is the Eastern Orthodox Church. The Pope became the first Protestant and went into schism against the church and then the RCC gave birth to other sects. So the RCC does not have the fullness of the faith either and just because he says XYZ does not make it so. Anymore than having Cardinal Humberto (?) disturb the Divine Liturgy to slap the Papal Bull of excommunication on the altar. How sacreligious Shamefull. What was that supposed to be a mob like take over??? Hey…it was an early version of the Sopranos. But God preserved His Church through muslim invasions, Crusaders attacks, murder and teh sacking of Constantinople, Communism and the gates of Hell did not prevail against that church (which is the Eastern Orthodox and scripture fits the trials it endured).

Rev North (non Roman Catholic and not EO either)

 

[guanophore]

i believe jesus is god. if you really get down to it, what more is there to say? because i do not believe in little every thing our church stands for, it does not make me a non catholic. sorry. As paul said, faith is the key. As i have said before, what is god looking for in his children? perfection or trust and love? i suggest trust and love. he is not into “do do this” do not that ****. He wants trust love and faith.

That is exactly what it means, lavazza. If you don’t accept the authority and instruction of the Church, you are not Catholic. Period.

i got a question? why is it that for every 10 hail mary’s in the rosary, we have only one our father? i think i should be the other way around, myself, just a thought.

Prayer beads are ancient, lavazza. You can use any kind of string you want. They were originally adopted by the monks to pray the 150 psalms. If you wish to pray the Lord’s prayer, more power to you.

 

[Man]

I don’t know about the poster who posted the scripture…but I think Benedict is just flat wrong. From what I have read if any church can claim to be the church of the Apostles it is the Eastern Orthodox Church. The Pope became the first Protestant and went into schism against the church and then the RCC gave birth to other sects. So the RCC does not have the fullness of the faith either and just because he says XYZ does not make it so. Anymore than having Cardinal Humberto (?) disturb the Divine Liturgy to slap the Papal Bull of excommunication on the altar. How sacreligious Shamefull. What was that supposed to be a mob like take over??? Hey…it was an early version of the Sopranos. But God preserved His Church through muslim invasions, Crusaders attacks, murder and teh sacking of Constantinople, Communism and the gates of Hell did not prevail against that church (which is the Eastern Orthodox and scripture fits the trials it endured).

Rev North (non Roman Catholic and not EO either)

Clearly not a reverend of any order of people I know of. The Eastern Orthodox schism was a reaction to the Bishop of Rome’s abuse of his God given (EO say “honorary”) power.

Whatever church you belong to or lead contains little of the Sacramental values of today’s EO and RCC which is to say, the proper Church of 2000 years ago.

And the RCC’s actions as a result its perception that the EO was not properly honoring the Bishop of Rome (that and Second Nicea). If you read Pope St. Clement of Rome you’ll quickly realize why this is the case, and it is not as you see it.

 

[RevDrNorth]

Clearly not a reverend of any order of people I know of. The Eastern Orthodox schism was a reaction to the Bishop of Rome’s abuse of his God given (EO say “honorary”) power.

Whatever church you belong to or lead contains little of the Sacramental values of today’s EO and RCC which is to say, the proper Church of 2000 years ago.

And the RCC’s actions as a result its perception that the EO was not properly honoring the Bishop of Rome (that and Second Nicea). If you read Pope St. Clement of Rome you’ll quickly realize why this is the case, and it is not as you see it.

You have no sense of humor

Actually, some of those quotes I got from Eastern Orthodox books (except the Sopranos thing and my statement that Benedict is flat wrong…which he is if he thinks the RCC is the one true church). It is just another perspective. History looks different from the EO side of things. As I belong to neither church I find it interesting (the back and forth).

Man wrote "Clearly not a reverend of any order of people I know of…Whatever church you belong to or lead contains little of the Sacramental values of today’s EO and RCC which is to say, the proper Church of 2000 years ago". Ooooo…burn…(as teenagers say). :bigyikes:

I am sincerely sorry if I ruffled your feathers. :bowdown: After all…you are da Man

Rev North

 

[anthony022071]

The schism had much to do with the “filioque” issue. See the thread on that.

 

[anthony022071]

The Eastern Orthodox schism was a reaction to the Bishop of Rome’s abuse of his God given (EO say “honorary”) power.

The schism had much to do with the “filioque”. See the thread on that.

 

[Man]

The schism had much to do with the “filioque”. See the thread on that.

The filioque, a description of the understanding of God, is designed (reworded) to prevent heresy. Specifically the denial of Jesus as fully man, or Jesus as fully God.

It depends on the interpretation…

“From the Son as from the Father.*”

What if I say it like that?

This is, by the grace of God, my work. I do not insist that the interpretation is correct, you are free to disagree.

May the Lord smile upon you.

 

[Man]

You have no sense of humor

Actually, some of those quotes I got from Eastern Orthodox books (except the Sopranos thing and my statement that Benedict is flat wrong…which he is if he thinks the RCC is the one true church). It is just another perspective. History looks different from the EO side of things. As I belong to neither church I find it interesting (the back and forth).

Man wrote "Clearly not a reverend of any order of people I know of…Whatever church you belong to or lead contains little of the Sacramental values of today’s EO and RCC which is to say, the proper Church of 2000 years ago". Ooooo…burn…(as teenagers say). :bigyikes:

I am sincerely sorry if I ruffled your feathers. :bowdown: After all…you are da Man

Rev North

Well, I apologize if being a servant of the truth makes you believe that I am without mirth.

Why are you even here if God didn’t bless the Holy Father with a certainty of power in position. It simply “is,” and it’s simply obvious. You’ve studied history right?

May God more you with His Grace.

David

 

[anthony022071]

The filioque, a description of the understanding of God, is designed (reworded) to prevent heresy. Specifically the denial of Jesus as fully man, or Jesus as fully God.

It was inserted because of the denial by Arians in Spain that the Son has no eternal connection with the Holy Spirit.

 

[Roger_Wissinger]

Do you think the Pope saying that non-Catholics do not have the fullness of faith, he is “judging” others?

Again, this is nothing new what the pope said. This has been around for years. I don’t know why he released it now along with going back to the Latin Mass. Which I think is awesome. Anyway, no, he’s not judging others but he’s going by the teachings of the Catholic Church which what I’m about to say you won’t like. The Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ. READ HISTORY. Read anything about the early church fathers. The first christians were Catholic and they say they were Catholic. “The Fathers of the Church” by Mike Aquilina is good for starters. Saint Clement of Rome, Saint Ignatius, Saint Polycarp, Saint Irenaeus have writtings about being christians . Remember, the bible also says the Christ taught more than whats in the bible and these teachings came from traditions(Word from mouth). Anyway, I’m getting off track which it’s easy to do. Being a ex-Baptist and turning Catholic and understand where your coming from. Just have a open mind and you’ll understand us Catholics. Which came first, the church or the bible. God bless

 

[lavazza]

good point, it all comes down to who has the POWER. It is just like politics.

 

[guanophore]

If you want to believe you descend into purgatory and are not RISEN WITH the Lord, that’s your choice.

Purgatory is only for the redeemed. Your comment reflects a lack of understanding about the doctrine of purgatory.

God’s Word says we’re risen WITH the Lord… period. There is no long way to Heaven.

This is not the gospel taught by the Apostles, or from the NT. The NT shows that it is a narrow way to heaven, full of sufferings and afflictions, a race that must be completed. Yes, we die with him and rise again from baptism, but the work is not “finished”. Now that we are joined with the finished work of Jesus on the cross, we are to “work out our salvation with fear and trembling”.

There  is only ONE way and that's by Jesus Christ. If you believe you go anywhere but up after you die you're not going to Heaven.

Yes, there is only one way to heaven, Jesus Christ. And it is by HIs Word that we know nothing unclean will enter heaven. You misunderstand that purgatory is an “anywhere”. It is not. It is the state in which the elect are purified so that they can enter the holy of holies.

 

[guanophore]

good point, it all comes down to who has the POWER. It is just like politics.

Well, not JUST like politics. But Jesus came from the FAther with all power and authority. He commissioned His Apostles with that same power, and commanded them to preach and make disciples. There have been times when secular and even evil forces have impinged upon the Church, but Jesus has kept HIs promise to preserve her in all truth.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

good point, it all comes down to who has the POWER. It is just like politics.

Once again, lavazza, your misinterpration and misunderstanding of Catholicism is almost enough to leave one breathless. How any Catholic with ‘16 years of Catholic education’ and the putative maturity of some 28 years post that education can parrot the most ‘fringe’ of Protestant circles yet fiercely cling to “I’m Catholic, I just have the ‘right’ to disagree with anything I chose” and not see that this is as Protestant a stance as that of Luther, Henry VIII, Wesley, Knox, Mary Baker Eddy et. al is astonishing.

If you are Catholic, it appears to be only the ‘culture’ aspect that you embrace --the idea of being as you claim “an Italian Catholic from Boston” with the vestigial desire to claim solidarity with the cultural past yet not ‘have to’ in any way partake of the Catholic responsibilities for authentic practice of said faith according to Catholic teaching.

I venture to say that your father and grandfather (mother and grandmother) and all ‘before’ would never have recognized your position of dissent, defiance and disobedience --without acknowledgement of same–as being “Catholic”.

Sure, we all sin. Maybe your grandfather was guilty of personal sin. . .but instead of excusing it as “my responsibility to disagree with teachings I don’t hold to but I’m still a good Catholic” he would have known, and struggled with, the knowledge of the sin. He would have at the least acknowledged that he was sinning against the Church’s teachings by defying them!!!

Today it appears many soi-disant Catholics want to have their cake and eat it too–they want all the ‘cachet’ of being part of their cultural heritage group, yet none of the responsibilities of living ‘by the rules’. Pick and choose, demand that the church ‘change’, outright defiance–hey, it is all about ‘me’ and the church is darned lucky I still ‘support it’ by calling myself Catholic. . .

So sad.

 

[Roger_Wissinger]

good point, it all comes down to who has the POWER. It is just like politics.

Well I don’t know about that. I want to think I have the power in Christ. All I know is my faith in Christ has never been stronger. I did not realize what I was missing until I came to his church. There’s one thing of feeling him but to intellectually know him, its AWSOME. I do love my brother and sisters of other faiths. Being a Baptist helped me to be a better Catholic. By the way, I dislike politics.

 

[Church_Militant]

good point, it all comes down to who has the POWER. It is just like politics.

Phooey! This is not at all like politics…it’s a spiritual reality expressed in the Word of God and supported by 2,000 years of Christian history.

The authority of the Church is plainly stated in the New Testament and the errant interpretations of n-Cs are (in reality) nothing more than rationalizations of their rebellious roots.

They cannot accept the Eucharistic Real Presence because to do so without the apostolic succession of ordinations means they cannot deliver on something that the New Testament very strongly tells us is a conduit of the super abundant grace towards our ultimate salvation.

They cannot accept auricular confession and Christ’s commission to forgive and retain sins for essentially that same reason, and the same can be said of virtually every other sacramental aspect of the Christian faith.

IMV, basically, what you really have in n-C communities is doctrines and theology shaped by the expediency of their positions instead of upon the Word of God or any reference to the writings of the early church.

It’s pretty sad really…but the CDF document is right on the mark and I’m glad to see it.

 

[Man]

good point, it all comes down to who has the POWER. It is just like politics.

No, it’s about who indulges the mankind. People don’t like the Catholic Church or the Eastern Orthodox for that matter, because their church indulges them more. They’re prouder or smarter or more prophetic or richer or lets them do more sinful things which are unhealthy for the society.

 

[Church_Militant]

No, it’s about who indulges the mankind. People don’t like the Catholic Church or the Eastern Orthodox for that matter, because their church

indulges them more. They’re prouder or smarter or more prophetic or richer or lets them do more sinful things which are unhealthy for the society.You mean n-C churches?