Pope John XII and Papal Infallibility

[Truthstalker]

John XII was probably the worst pope. I wonder if he wrote anything that would bear on the doctrine of papal infallibility, in fact, whether he actually wrote anything. I have been unable to find anything he wrote - the most I can find about him is about his conduct, which I do not want to be the subject of this thread. What he did is readily discoverable with a quick internet search.

In particular, did he use papal perogatives to advance his own cause via official pronouncement? Did he make any doctrinal statements of the sort that normally would be regarded as official Catholic teaching? And if so, what did he say, and is it in accord with Catholic teaching? Whether he did or did not would be significant in evaluating Catholic claims concerning the guidance and protection of the Holy Spirit over the Church and its manner.

If the Catholics are correct, all that is needed is a demonstration that he made no pronouncements. He was so busy with his, um, activities that perhaps he didn’t bother. If, however, he wrote something as pope that seems to reflect his personal behavior, that would also be significant. I don’t know that he had any impact on the doctrine of the church. And that, too, would be significant.

 

[LilyM]

John XII was probably the worst pope. I wonder if he wrote anything that would bear on the doctrine of papal infallibility, in fact, whether he actually wrote anything. I have been unable to find anything he wrote - the most I can find about him is about his conduct, which I do not want to be the subject of this thread. What he did is readily discoverable with a quick internet search.

In particular, did he use papal perogatives to advance his own cause via official pronouncement? Did he make any doctrinal statements of the sort that normally would be regarded as official Catholic teaching? And if so, what did he say, and is it in accord with Catholic teaching? Whether he did or did not would be significant in evaluating Catholic claims concerning the guidance and protection of the Holy Spirit over the Church and its manner.

If the Catholics are correct, all that is needed is a demonstration that he made no pronouncements. He was so busy with his, um, activities that perhaps he didn’t bother. If, however, he wrote something as pope that seems to reflect his personal behavior, that would also be significant. I don’t know that he had any impact on the doctrine of the church. And that, too, would be significant.

Well, you’re asking us to prove a negative, which is incredibly difficult if not impossible so many hundreds of years after he lived. But I know of absolutely no pronouncements bearing on doctrine or dogma, faith or morals, or indeed of any note at all, that were made by that particular Pope.

 

[Contarini]

John XII was probably the worst pope. I wonder if he wrote anything that would bear on the doctrine of papal infallibility, in fact, whether he actually wrote anything.

I think Lily’s right–it’s unfair to ask Catholics to prove a negative. I’m pretty sure that John XII made no theological impact on the Church, but I could be wrong.

Edwin

 

[jbuck919]

I hope that none of our members loses sleep over the phenomenon of evil popes. One of the very worst was Benedict IX, whose family apparently bought him the papacy when he was 19 and who went on to a “reign” that could be said to rival that of Caligula before he was driven out of Rome. Then there is the infamous Borgia pope Alexander VI, who wrote openly to his correspondents about feigning faith and being pope only for the power and wealth that it held.

Let’s be thankful that the Counter-Reformation did what it was supposed to do, and under the direction of very saintly men who might not have beem around at all given the circumstances. Since that time, which now spans four and a half centuries, we have had nothing but at least ordinarily good and technically blameless men (and very often more than that) as popes.

 

[TOME]

I have to say this thread did catch my interest and I did a little reading about Pope John XII. I do admit I googled information on John XII plus I did go to my own small library.

From all I read this pope did not write or proclaim anything that was contrary to any of the Church’s doctrines of Faith and Morals. It seems he was more preoccupied with temporal power and sexual gratification than theology or his Petrine Ministry’s responsibilities. When the synod of bishops was gathered to dipose him the charges brought against him delt on his personal behavior and its ill effects but there was not condemnation of his writings as pope (no for that matter he wasn’t condemned as being a satanist as some historians would like to have us believe).

In more than one source I read, the authors included in their writings that John XII’s papalacy in a bizarre (my word) and in a negative way, illustrates how Christ’s promse to Peter and to the Church that the Church would always be guided by the Holy Spirit, and that the Church is “Holy” not because of the people who make up the Church but by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Truthstalker]

I think in this case it is easy to prove a negative. Had he written something, it would have been spectacular, such as declaring all the good looking women his wives, or the papacy hereditary, or some such. That he did not take advantage of the opportunity - that, possibly, it did not occur to him - is an indication to me of the grace of God at work in the papacy operating in a preventitve way.

That is something to think about. If, in the case of John XII, God prevented a doctrinal error from occuring, when it would have been obvious to all, then what of the case of a more godly man? This lends credence to the doctrine of papal infallibility, which is in itself a negative doctrine.

 

[stinkcat_14]

My hunch is that if John XII had actually written anything that is even close to heretical, the anti-catholics would be telling all about it. That is just my hunch though.

 

[RobNY]

I think in this case it is easy to prove a negative. Had he written something, it would have been spectacular, such as declaring all the good looking women his wives, or the papacy hereditary, or some such.

Sorry TS, but that quote just made my day. Thanks.

-Rob

P.S.-- as for your idea, it is interesting. And, what stinkcat_14 says also rings true to me.