Pope John XXIII

[belgianwaffles9]

It wasn’t so much that he “implemented” these vestments; he simply continued wearing the clothes that all previous Popes had worn. Pope Paul VI was the first pontiff to change the vestments and regalia of the Papacy, and John Paul II contiued what he started.

The** last two Popes** have not been so traditional in their dress and liturgical preferences but Pope Benedict is renewing the traditional norms of vestments and liturgy.

I tend to think that **the last two Popes **were the odd ones out in terms of vestment style, when you compare them to the previous Popes. Benedict XVI is far more conscious of continuity and he is bringing back many of the ancient vestments traditionally worn by the Popes such as the Papal slippers.

your comment seems to forget that John Paul I even existed…

 

[Dempsey1919]

your comment seems to forget that John Paul I even existed…

Of course I haven’t forgotten Pope John Paul I, but he only reigned for 33 days! It’s impossible to know what he would have been like. That’s why I can’t pass comment, and that’s why I never mentioned him in my previous post.

 

[JuanCarlos]

Isn’t it sad that we often miss someone’s holiness for its own sake and appreciate it in as much as it serves our agenda and our understanding of what the Church should be?

Yes, very.

 

[Tsuwano]

Good Pope John was probably one of the greatest shepherds the Church has ever been blessed with. I’m not sure much more can be said. He was a true witness to the love of Christ.

 

[William_II]

Has anyone seen the YouTube footage of Pope John XXIII’s coronation?

 

[William_II]

Anyone?

 

[JuanCarlos]

Yes, I have. youtube also has the coronation of Pius XII

 

[John_Higgins]

Love him. He’s my favorite. My Next favorite is John Paul I . Try to find the book that was created from his letters. He was Albino Luciani.

John

 

[Genesis315]

My Next favorite is John Paul I . Try to find the book that was created from his letters. He was Albino Luciani.

I was able to only flip through it once, but from what I read it was very interesting (in a good way!)

 

[John_Higgins]

The book is Illustrissimi, and is mostly listed as authored by Albino Luciani. It is a compilation of columns he wrote when he was Patriarch of Venice.

John

 

[ConvertChris]

Blessed John XXIII is one of my favourite Popes. He was a great, wise, and holy man. Although many may be suprised by this, John XXIII was traditional in his thinking and spirituality; he was not the liberal that some extremists try to say he was.

It is indeed a great desecration to Blessed John’s memory that lapsed Catholics in the secular media, like that awful Susan Jacoby woman, seem to think that he was their Pope.

It would take pages to even deal with the obvious reasons that this is not the case, but the most striking to me is the idea that he would agree with someone stopping being a Catholic because they disagreed with the Church over an issue such as women priests.

Ridiculous.:knight2:

Blessed John XXIII, pray for us.

 

[Nino]

well to me he was the worst Pope of the 20th century outside of the last one JP11…I recall being in the holy name societ and Knights of Columbus giving and participating in anti-communist programs.when out of the blue we hear from Rome a new policy…having meetings and chatting with known communists is fine…no more open war against them…and so this pope was the first to welcome to the Vatican a well known and un-repentent red…that killed our programs of alerting the public to the dangers of falling for the asopian language of these evil individuals. Even the film.Heart of a Priest.started getting cancellations from Catholic organizations.Heart of a priest told the sad yet inspiring story of FR.John Houle SJ who was captured and spent years in a chinese concentration camp.the simple film ended with a strange package delivered to his cell and he found hidden in the box the proper utensils and items needed to say mass!!! The filmstrip with his narration ended with him reciting the mass in Latin.it always brought tears to the members watching and listening to it.I noticed right away the secular press started quoting everything that this pope said …he was pictured as a humble,sweet ,kindly man who even spoke to the gardener in the papal gardens…see the previous pope ,PiusX11 had to be pictured as the opposite and was…by the time the demon inspired…'The Deputy" Play opened up on broadway the smear was in…I and a large group of Jewish war vets were there that nite to protest this smear of the church and Pius…His role in Vat.11 was instrumental in opening the windows and letting the holiest of places get wind-swept.

 

[angillusion]

I graduated in 2000 from Roncalli High School, so I’m pretty fond of him. Mostly, to me, he seemed to be a man full of love that the love of God showed clearly through!

 

[lintpick1]

well to me he was the worst Pope of the 20th century outside of the last one JP11…I recall being in the holy name societ and Knights of Columbus giving and participating in anti-communist programs.when out of the blue we hear from Rome a new policy…having meetings and chatting with known communists is fine…no more open war against them…and so this pope was the first to welcome to the Vatican a well known and un-repentent red…that killed our programs of alerting the public to the dangers of falling for the asopian language of these evil individuals. Even the film.Heart of a Priest.started getting cancellations from Catholic organizations.Heart of a priest told the sad yet inspiring story of FR.John Houle SJ who was captured and spent years in a chinese concentration camp.the simple film ended with a strange package delivered to his cell and he found hidden in the box the proper utensils and items needed to say mass!!! The filmstrip with his narration ended with him reciting the mass in Latin.it always brought tears to the members watching and listening to it.I noticed right away the secular press started quoting everything that this pope said …he was pictured as a humble,sweet ,kindly man who even spoke to the gardener in the papal gardens…see the previous pope ,PiusX11 had to be pictured as the opposite and was…by the time the demon inspired…'The Deputy" Play opened up on broadway the smear was in…I and a large group of Jewish war vets were there that nite to protest this smear of the church and Pius…His role in Vat.11 was instrumental in opening the windows and letting the holiest of places get wind-swept.

I agree. His opening statement at Vatican II is what really ticks me off. I don’t have time to look it up but it goes to the effect of: The Catholic Church no longer condemns heretics, but needs to show mercy to them instead.

He was also the Pope of 1960 who was supposed to release the Third Secret of Fatima but never did. He didn’t even believe in it.

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

I graduated in 2000 from Roncalli High School, so I’m pretty fond of him. Mostly, to me, he seemed to be a man full of love that the love of God showed clearly through!

I pray that the canonization of Blessed John XXIII will soon take place, as he was indeed a living saint among us. Holy, unpretentious and genuinely loving of his fellow man.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B

 

[Dempsey1919]

well to me he was the worst Pope of the 20th century outside of the last one JP11…I recall being in the holy name societ and Knights of Columbus giving and participating in anti-communist programs.when out of the blue we hear from Rome a new policy…having meetings and chatting with known communists is fine…no more open war against them…and so this pope was the first to welcome to the Vatican a well known and un-repentent red…that killed our programs of alerting the public to the dangers of falling for the asopian language of these evil individuals. Even the film.Heart of a Priest.started getting cancellations from Catholic organizations.Heart of a priest told the sad yet inspiring story of FR.John Houle SJ who was captured and spent years in a chinese concentration camp.the simple film ended with a strange package delivered to his cell and he found hidden in the box the proper utensils and items needed to say mass!!! The filmstrip with his narration ended with him reciting the mass in Latin.it always brought tears to the members watching and listening to it.I noticed right away the secular press started quoting everything that this pope said …he was pictured as a humble,sweet ,kindly man who even spoke to the gardener in the papal gardens…see the previous pope ,PiusX11 had to be pictured as the opposite and was…by the time the demon inspired…'The Deputy" Play opened up on broadway the smear was in…I and a large group of Jewish war vets were there that nite to protest this smear of the church and Pius…His role in Vat.11 was instrumental in opening the windows and letting the holiest of places get wind-swept.

You shouldn’t speak ill of the dead, especially when you are talking about a Pope who has been infallably beatified by the Church.

I can appreciate that you may not agree with some statements on this thread, but I think you should show respect for the memory of Blessed John. He guided the Church into turbulent times and you can’t hold him responsible for the liberal changes within Church and society at that time. It is well known that Blessed John XXIII was a traditionally minded pope. He was not responsible for the destructive “spirit of Vatican II.” Blessed John convened the Council with good intentions; and others are responsible for the changes carried out in it’s name.

 

[JuanCarlos]

You shouldn’t speak ill of the dead, especially when you are talking about a Pope who has been infallably beatified by the Church.

I can appreciate that you may not agree with some statements on this thread, but I think you should show respect for the memory of Blessed John. He guided the Church into turbulent times and you can’t hold him responsible for the liberal changes within Church and society at that time. It is well known that Blessed John XXIII was a traditionally minded pope. He was not responsible for the destructive “spirit of Vatican II.” Blessed John convened the Council with good intentions; and others are responsible for the changes carried out in it’s name.

Just to clarify, beatifying is not infallible, only canonization.

 

[Dempsey1919]

Just to clarify, beatifying is not infallible, only canonization.

Are Catholics free to reject the beatification of a person?

Has a beatification ever been overturned?

Surely, the Church will only beatify an individual under the promptings of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit would not make mistakes regarding beatification.

If beatification is not infallable, what is it?

 

[catharina]

I agree. His opening statement at Vatican II is what really ticks me off. I don’t have time to look it up but it goes to the effect of: The Catholic Church no longer condemns heretics, but needs to show mercy to them instead.

He was also the Pope of 1960 who was supposed to release the Third Secret of Fatima but never did. He didn’t even believe in it.

Wow. Remarkable.

You are really ‘ticked off’ by Pope John III’s opening statement at the Second Vatican Council - but oops #1! you don’t know what he said and oops #2! you haven’t time to look it up?

It took about fifteen seconds for me to “look it up” and what you’ve casually misquoted actually said this: "At his address at the opening of the Second Vatican Council, he criticized the “prophets of doom” who “in these modern times see nothing but prevarication and ruin.” Pope John XXIII set a tone for the Council when he said, “The Church has always opposed… errors. Nowadays, however, the Spouse of Christ prefers to make use of the medicine of mercy rather than that of severity.”

(above bolded taken from Franciscan site, American Catholic) americancatholic.org/Features/SaintOfDay/default.asp?id=1165)

That is: The Church needs to use “the medicine of mercy rather than that of severity.” Would you prefer that God and the Church treat you with severity or with mercy. All people ask God for mercy, the last I heard (in the 62 years I’ve been Catholic).

re Fatima and 1960:

No Pope was ever “supposed to” release the final secret of Fatima. Past a certain time, the Popes were free to do so, if they so decided. You might want to re-examine your FACTS before you condemn a POPE. (Just a thought.)

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

Wow. Remarkable.

You are really ‘ticked off’ by Pope John III’s opening statement at the Second Vatican Council - but oops #1! you don’t know what he said and oops #2! you haven’t time to look it up?

It took about fifteen seconds for me to “look it up” and what you’ve casually misquoted actually said this: "At his address at the opening of the Second Vatican Council, he criticized the “prophets of doom” who “in these modern times see nothing but prevarication and ruin.” Pope John XXIII set a tone for the Council when he said, “The Church has always opposed… errors. Nowadays, however, the Spouse of Christ prefers to make use of the medicine of mercy rather than that of severity.”

(above bolded taken from Franciscan site, American Catholic) americancatholic.org/Features/SaintOfDay/default.asp?id=1165)

That is: The Church needs to use “the medicine of mercy rather than that of severity.” Would you prefer that God and the Church treat you with severity or with mercy. All people ask God for mercy, the last I heard (in the 62 years I’ve been Catholic).

re Fatima and 1960:

No Pope was ever “supposed to” release the final secret of Fatima. Past a certain time, the Popes were free to do so, if they so decided. You might want to re-examine your FACTS before you condemn a POPE. (Just a thought.)

Excellent response.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B