"Pope Michael" on Dutch TV

[deaconswife]

I agree with LabChick, these “popes” might benefit from a psychiatric evaluation. *The Three Christs of Ypsilanti *is a excellent book for anyone wanting to gain a little more insight on people who suffer from religious delusions. I used to work in a state run psychiatric hospital in New England. We had several Jesuses and Blessed Mothers who we had to keep separated due to them becoming quite violent in the presence of another Jesus or Mary. So much for the Queen and Prince of Peace.

 

[Irish_Melkite]

LabChick:

I know their antics might be funny, but does anyone know if these men are schizophrenic? During my psychiatric rotation in med school, I had the chance to converse with a woman who believed she was the rightful heir to the British thrown. People confuse schizophrenia with the dubious “multiple personality disorder.” I don’t think there is anything funny about mental illness, though some may disagree.

You might try reading The Three Christs of Ypsilanti, by Milton Rokeach. It’s about three men, each believing his is Jesus Christ, and what happens when a psychiatrist has them confront each other.

LabChick,

I think that there is a definite difference between one believing that he or she is a particular historical person and one believing that he or she has the right to assume the trappings and authority of an office. Frankly, I’m not convinced that the latter is any different than one proclaiming himself to be the leader of a nation, the president of a company, or any similar postion of import in an organization. Not to say that some of these individuals may not have delusions of grandeur, but I think to wholesale ascribe the existence of a psychiatric diagnosis to any non-mainstream papal claimant is a stretch. If they subscribe to a belief that the Church has gone astray (which any number of tradition-bound Catholics here and on similar boards seem to believe), and believe that they can save it, the logical next step may be to assume a role which would seemingly allow them to do so. I don’t see anyone suggesting that every person who styles himself “bishop”, absent the imposition of episcopal orders, is similarly psychiatrically challenged - yet, the analogy is exact, it’s merely a question of the degree of authority presumed. Some folks simply have higher aspirations than others

Many years,

Neil

 

[Kevan]

asquared:

what a great idea for a reality TV show - pope survivor, put all the pretenders on a desert island, pose apologetics questions, canon law dilemmas, causes for canonization, see who gives the best answers, and the audience votes each week for who gets booted off the island. survivor gets an honorary job with the swiss guards.

Losers get turned over to the Holy Office until they recant.

 

[deogratias]

Kevan:

Losers get turned over to the Holy Office until they recant.

But have one appearance on the EWTN late night show the day after losing.

 

[LabChick]

Irish Melkite:

Not to say that some of these individuals may not have delusions of grandeur, but I think to wholesale ascribe the existence of a psychiatric diagnosis to any non-mainstream papal claimant is a stretch.

My psychiatry rotations weren’t that long ago. “Delusions of grandeur,” as you call them, are one symptom of psychosis. The difference is that, in some people, the “delusions” are synonymous with reality. These people truly believe that they are Jesus Christ, the rightful Pope, the Queen, etc., just as I believe that I am Jill M-------, assistant chief of surgery. This thread reminded me of Rokeach’s book. You should read it. I think it would definately clear up any confusion you have.

 

[flameburns623]

Anyone–ANYONE–who wished the title of Pope can purchase same from the Universal Life Church. You’ll even get an attractive certificate, suitable for framng, for your trouble.

 

[Mandi]

Irish Melkite:

If they subscribe to a belief that the Church has gone astray (which any number of tradition-bound Catholics here and on similar boards seem to believe), and believe that they can save it, the logical next step may be to assume a role which would seemingly allow them to do so.

This is correct! David Bawden does not believe he is JPII. What they have done, like others who claim to be pope is twisted Church Doctrine to justify electing a “new pope”. Please remember that David Bawden and others did not just one day wake up and claim to be pope - they were elected by others. These are little pocket groups of Catholics that view the situation with The Church as in such dire straits that emergency action was needed … that being the election of a new pope!

To get a grasp on this situation, I would recommend looking at the group in Quebec who have elected a pope. Sorry I can’t remember the name of the group or the name of the so called pope. But it is an extremely large group, compared to others, with a large following and community - traditional nuns, schools, seminaries, priests and all.

We can joke about this all we like, but it is definiately part of a larger problem!

 

[mercygate]

LabChick:

I know their antics might be funny, but does anyone know if these men are schizophrenic? During my psychiatric rotation in med school, I had the chance to converse with a woman who believed she was the rightful heir to the British thrown. People confuse schizophrenia with the dubious “multiple personality disorder.” I don’t think there is anything funny about mental illness, though some may disagree.

You might try reading The Three Christs of Ypsilanti, by Milton Rokeach. It’s about three men, each believing his is Jesus Christ, and what happens when a psychiatrist has them confront each other.

When they confronted each other, did they just erect a rationale of why the others were false? And did it include a conspiracy theory?

I think if these guys all got into the same room, each would simply deny the authenticity of the others; their very existence depends on denial of everything except themselves. ??? no?

The one that really saddens is the Capuchin Priest.

 

[Cherubino]

I met a fellow in Connecticut about 17 years ago who told me in no uncertain terms that he was the Archduke of New York and the Viceroy of Pennsylvania.

So I asked him why he was living in Connecticut. “I’m in exlile,” he replied, “until Elizabeth II resumes her rightful place as Queen of these Colonies.” True story, I swear!

To my knowledge, though, no attorneys were harmed during his administration and the peasants were eternally grateful that he never won any elections.

 

[puzzleannie]

where is Catherine of Sienna when you need her? I heard a guy on TV last night who thinks he is going to become President, and he actually has people calling themselves Catholic who believe him. talk about delusional