Pope to Reintroduce Latin into the Novus Ordo and Move the "Sign of Peace"

[Dauphin]

According to the Italian weekly Panorama, the Pope intends to replace the vernacular consecration with the original Latin. This will restore the correct “pro multis” (for many) formula to the consecration and place a “verbal veil” over the Sacred Mystery. This seems to be one way in which “mutual enrichment” is taking place between the EF and OF. The Pope is also considering moving the sign of peace to the offertory in order to facilitate proper recollection before Communion:

From Fr. Z:

"Benedict changes the Mass again – a study of the new liturgy entrusted to the Congregation for Divine Worship

The Rite of Mass could change. According to some leaks, Benedict XVI has give the Congregation for Divine Worship the task of studying some modifications in the liturgy. In particular, it is said the Pope intends to reinstate the Latin for the formula of the Eucharistic consecration in Mass in the vernacular, i.e., the one celebrated in different national languages. [This means that in Masses in English, Italian etc., when the priest would get to the two fold consecration, he would switch to LATIN.] The same thing could happen for the [sacramental] formulas of baptism, confirmation, confession and the other sacraments. In addition the sign of peace among the faithful during Mass, which today takes place before the distribution of the Eucharist, could be moved forward (as in the Ambrosian rite) to the offertory in order so as not to disturb the recollection before Communion. **[This is something *Papa **Ratzinger wrote about in one of his books, I forget which.]"

wdtprs.com/blog/2008/07/vernacular-masses-but-with-latin-consecration/

 

[AJV]

How appropriate today is the feast of St. Thomas! Cynical me will believe it when I see it.

I have to admit that I’d hate the sign of peace to be moved elsewhere. It would only emphasize the discontinuity with our liturgical heritage and as well end the unique additional interpretation that the Sign brings in the Roman liturgy. That said, I don’t have the problem that many encounter (which is probably reason no.1) since the custom in my parish involves bowing rather than shaking hands.

 

[brigid12]

Since most priests in this diocese (according to what the Bishop has said) and probably on this coast don’t know Latin - I don’t see this being implemented for quite a long time. I would expect this to be implemented about the time that there are a multiplicity of TLMs here. None of the Bishops on the West Coast that I’ve heard or read about want anything even slightly traditional (granted there are some that I don’t know about at all in that regards). From what I’ve seen we don’t seem to have very many “JPII” priests either. That said, at least our Bishop has agreed to having an FSSP priest here - he had said he wouldn’t agree to that. I don’t know what this priest will be allowed to do, but he has been allowed into the diocese to an indult TLM at present.

 

[thistle]

According to the Italian weekly Panorama, the Pope intends to replace the vernacular consecration with the original Latin. This will restore the correct “pro multis” (for many) formula to the consecration and place a “verbal veil” over the Sacred Mystery. This seems to be one way in which “mutual enrichment” is taking place between the EF and OF. The Pope is also considering moving the sign of peace to the offertory in order to facilitate proper recollection before Communion:

From Fr. Z:

"Benedict changes the Mass again – a study of the new liturgy entrusted to the Congregation for Divine Worship

The Rite of Mass could change. According to some leaks, Benedict XVI has give the Congregation for Divine Worship the task of studying some modifications in the liturgy. In particular, it is said the Pope intends to reinstate the Latin for the formula of the Eucharistic consecration in Mass in the vernacular, i.e., the one celebrated in different national languages. [This means that in Masses in English, Italian etc., when the priest would get to the two fold consecration, he would switch to LATIN.] The same thing could happen for the [sacramental] formulas of baptism, confirmation, confession and the other sacraments. In addition the sign of peace among the faithful during Mass, which today takes place before the distribution of the Eucharist, could be moved forward (as in the Ambrosian rite) to the offertory in order so as not to disturb the recollection before Communion. **[This is something *Papa **Ratzinger wrote about in one of his books, I forget which.]"

wdtprs.com/blog/2008/07/vernacular-masses-but-with-latin-consecration/

The NO is already available in Latin.

 

[cspb56]

An interesting fact. In this country liturgists have been trying for over 20 years to get Rome move the sign of peace as outlined by the Pope. Another interesting fact. Most would call these very same liturgists liberal.

 

[Lepanto]

An interesting fact. In this country liturgists have been trying for over 20 years to get Rome move the sign of peace as outlined by the Pope. Another interesting fact. Most would call these very same liturgists liberal.

MAYBE so, but what were their motives?

I see all of this as just more directives that most priests will ignore, like the instruction from two years ago that only the ordained can purify the sacred vessels.

 

[Brendan]

The NO is already available in Latin.

Yes, but what is being talked about is removing the indult for the consecration to be in the vernacular.

So the Words of Institution would be in Latin at every Mass, in every country.

 

[Dauphin]

MAYBE so, but what were their motives?

I see all of this as just more directives that most priests will ignore, like the instruction from two years ago that only the ordained can purify the sacred vessels.

I don’t think that this is the sort of change which could be easily resisted. If the Pope issues a new version of the Missal, the vast majority of the Church would conform to what it prescribes.

 

[PatienceAndLove]

As a Catholic youngin, I would LOVE for the Consecration to be in Latin and for the Sign of Peace to move (never made sense where it is, IMHO).
But then again, I would love to see EMHCs done away with, altar rails reintroduced, less P&W during Mass (maybe even moved to a special P&W time before Mass), and only altar boys.

 

[Dauphin]

As a Catholic youngin, I would LOVE for the Consecration to be in Latin and for the Sign of Peace to move (never made sense where it is, IMHO).
But then again, I would love to see EMHCs done away with, altar rails reintroduced, less P&W during Mass (maybe even moved to a special P&W time before Mass), and only altar boys.

Amen to that from another youngin.

 

[Fuerza]

Since most priests in this diocese (according to what the Bishop has said) and probably on this coast don’t know Latin - I don’t see this being implemented for quite a long time. I would expect this to be implemented about the time that there are a multiplicity of TLMs here. None of the Bishops on the West Coast that I’ve heard or read about want anything even slightly traditional (granted there are some that I don’t know about at all in that regards). From what I’ve seen we don’t seem to have very many “JPII” priests either. That said, at least our Bishop has agreed to having an FSSP priest here - he had said he wouldn’t agree to that. I don’t know what this priest will be allowed to do, but he has been allowed into the diocese to an indult TLM at present.

I don’t think it will be a problem. A single Latin prayer would not be difficult to learn. Even the most linguistically challenged priest could learn it in one day.

 

[benedictgal]

Believe it or not, the issue of the transfer of the Sign of Peace is the one thing on which the Holy Father and the Neocats agree. This was the one concession that the Holy Father made to the Neocats (who had been celebrating a very bizarre form of the Mass until Pope Benedict took them to the liturgical woodshed in December 2005).

Now, as far as the issue of the Consecration is concerned, the use of Latin has always been in force for the OF. In fact, Latin is the default while the vernacular is the option. Thus, I wouldn’t necessarily say that Pope Benedict is “re-introducing” Latin; rather, he is signalling the fact that it should be used, period.

 

[vee8]

As a Catholic youngin, I would LOVE for the Consecration to be in Latin and for the Sign of Peace to move (never made sense where it is, IMHO).
But then again, I would love to see EMHCs done away with, altar rails reintroduced, less P&W during Mass (maybe even moved to a special P&W time before Mass), and only altar boys.

from another youngin and dont forget the increase in incense use
We should be proud of our history our liturgical heritage and censing things is one of those simple beautiful things that got tossed by the wayside while we have the best smelling incense in the world. .

 

[beckers]

As a Catholic youngin, I would LOVE for the Consecration to be in Latin and for the Sign of Peace to move (never made sense where it is, IMHO).
But then again, I would love to see EMHCs done away with, altar rails reintroduced, less P&W during Mass (maybe even moved to a special P&W time before Mass), and only altar boys.

Another youngin.

I don’t understand were the sign of peace is. It should be before the Eurcharist prayer not in the middle of it. I like how the Anglican Use mass does it.

 

[PatienceAndLove]

Another youngin.

I don’t understand were the sign of peace is. It should be before the Eurcharist prayer not in the middle of it. I like how the Anglican Use mass does it.

TOTALLY!
I CANNOT wait to be a parishoner at Our Lady of Atonement (6 and a half months and counting!)

 

[Brendan]

I don’t think it will be a problem. A single Latin prayer would not be difficult to learn. Even the most linguistically challenged priest could learn it in one day.

I can send my 9 year old over to teach him,

 

[Ahlman]

Someone pointed out that switching language to latin just for the institution narrative may give the impression that these are some kind of magic words that has to be spoken in a very precise way in an ancient language in order to be effective. In fact, the expression “hocus pocus” origins from “hoc est”. But the eucharist isn’t magic, it’s worship. So to be consistent, if one part of the Canon should be in latin, everything should, from “Dominus vobiscum” to “Amen”.

 

[Karl_M]

Cynical me will believe it when I see it.

That’s a somewhat ironic thing to say on the Feast of St. Thomas the Apostle, but at any rate, I’d love to see this.

I’ve long felt that there is nothing wrong with the vernacular, but that the Eucharistic Prayer should be in Latin (and the Sanctus and the Agnus Dei).

I really, really, really hope they do this and that they don’t dilly-dally. Just say all priests have to know the Eucharistic Prayer (and the other parts I mentioned) in Latin by Lent 2009.

That’s more than enough time to learn just that little bit.

 

[Digitonomy]

Someone pointed out that switching language to latin just for the institution narrative may give the impression that these are some kind of magic words that has to be spoken in a very precise way in an ancient language in order to be effective. In fact, the expression “hocus pocus” origins from “hoc est”.

I think that’s a fair point, and a related issue is that understanding the words is an important part of catechesis for many Catholics, who are otherwise pretty ignorant about their faith. I hope that if Latin becomes the norm for all or part of the Liturgy of the Eucharist, that the vernacular is also regularly used instead, at least several times a year.

 

[ethelzguy]

I think that’s a fair point, and a related issue is that understanding the words is an important part of catechesis for many Catholics, who are otherwise pretty ignorant about their faith. I hope that if Latin becomes the norm for all or part of the Liturgy of the Eucharist, that the vernacular is also regularly used instead, at least several times a year.

Excellent post. What many fail to realize, it that the Sunday Mass is pretty much THE interface between the Church and many Catholics. Inserting foreign languages may well drive a wedge for some.

It would seem that most of the Latin proponents are either folks who grew up with it, or others who are VERY deep into their faith…and there is a tendency for them to assume that everyone should be like them.

But that isn’t the case. Everyone isn’t like them. And, that sort of mindset leads to elitism, which by definition is exclusionary…in direct conflict with Jesus’ exhortation to bring all to him.