Pope Wants Sunday As Day of Rest Starting in 2011

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Note the ZENIT Web news link below:

zenit.org/article-30476?l=english

I’m not against families taking time for rest and worship, but I do have a problem with the theological underpinnings that the Pope uses to justify ceasing from secular work on Sunday. He points back to Genesis 2, which is where God created the Sabbath on the 7th day. Sunday is the 1st day, and has never had any command attache to it to rest or worship on the 1st day, but the Pope seems take the Sabbath command to cease from work on the 7th day, and applies it to the 1st day.
 
  1. I didn’t read that in the article…and don’t know where you’re getting it from
  2. So your saying you would not want to honor and reflect the resurrection of Christ on the day he was risen? This ties in perfectly with the new covenant created through Christ. If you know anything about early Christian history, the new Christians DID understand that the Sabbath was the Sabbath. That’s why scripture was read on Saturdays during the early Church.
 
  1. I didn’t read that in the article…and don’t know where you’re getting it from
  2. So your saying you would not want to honor and reflect the resurrection of Christ on the day he was risen? This ties in perfectly with the new covenant created through Christ. If you know anything about early Christian history, the new Christians DID understand that the Sabbath was the Sabbath. That’s why scripture was read on Saturdays during the early Church.
My point is that Genesis 2 refers to the Seventh Day Sabbath, not Sunday. And yet that is where the Pope tries to infer that Sunday should be kept as such, namely, a work free day, in fact that is what the Catholic Bishops are trying to get through in EU, having Sunday be a work free day.
 
My point is that Genesis 2 refers to the Seventh Day Sabbath, not Sunday. And yet that is where the Pope tries to infer that Sunday should be kept as such, namely, a work free day, in fact that is what the Catholic Bishops are trying to get through in EU, having Sunday be a work free day.
From the article:
“Work and celebration are intimately connected in the life of families: they condition choices, influence relations between married couples and between parents and children, affect the relation of families with society and with the Church. Holy Scripture (cf. Genesis 1-2) tells us that the family, work and the feast day are gifts and blessings of God to help us to live a fully human existence. Daily experience attests that the authentic development of the person includes the individual, familial, and communal dimension, activities and functional relationships, as well as openness to hope and to the Good without limits.
In our days, unfortunately, the organization of labor, conceived and realized in function of market competition and maximizing profit, and the concept of feast as an occasion for escape and consumption, contribute to the break-up of the family and the community and to the spreading of an individualistic lifestyle. Thus, it is necessary to promote reflection and efforts at reconciling the demands and the periods of work with those of the family and** to recover the true meaning of the feast, especially on Sunday, the weekly Easter, the day of the Lord **and the day of man, the day of the family, of the community and of solidarity.”

The Douay Catechism of 1649
The Third Commandment Expounded
Q. 431. WHAT is the third commandment?
A. Remember that thou keepest holy the sabbath day.
Q. 432. When did the Sabbath begin to be kept?
A. From the very creation of the world; for then God blessed the seventh day, and rested
on it from all His works. Gen. ii. 2.
Q. 433. When was this commandment renewed?
A. In the Old Law; when God gave the commandments to Moses on mount Sinai, written
with His own finger in two tables of stone, Exod. xx. 1, &c. xxxi. 18.
Q. 434. Why was the Jewish Sabbath changed into the Sunday?
A. Because Christ was born upon a Sunday, arose from the dead upon a Sunday, and sent
down the Holy Ghost on a Sunday: works not inferior to the creation of the world.
Q. 435. By whom was it changed?
A. By the Governors of the Church, the Apostles, who also kept it; for St. John was in
spirit on the Lord’s day (which was Sunday.) Apoc. i. 10.

Q. 436. How prove you that the Church hath power to command feasts and
holydays?
A. By the very act of changing the sabbath into Sunday, which Protestants allow of; and
therefore they fondly contradict themselves, by keeping Sunday strictly, and breaking
most other feasts commanded by the same Church.
Q. 437. How prove you that?
A. Because by keeping Sunday, they acknowledge the Church’s power to ordain feasts,
and to command them under sin; and by not keeping the rest by her commanded, they
again deny, in fact, the same power.
Q. 438. What other proof have you?
A. Out of John x. 22, where we read that Christ himself was present, and kept the
Dedication of the temple in Jerusalem, a feast ordained by Judas Maccabæus, 1 Macc. iv.
59.
And out of Acts ii. 1, 4, where the Apostles, keeping the feast of Pentecost, “were all
filled with the Holy Ghost.” Neither do Protestants as yet differ from this, though some
have lately prohibited and profaned both it and the holy feast of the Resurrection, and all
the other feasts of the Church.
Q. 439. What commandment have you from God for obedience to the Church in
things of this nature?
A. Out of Acts xv. 41, where we read that “St. Paul went about confirming the Churches,
and commanding them to keep the precepts of the Apostles and the ancients.” And out of
Luke x. 16, “He that heareth you, heareth me; and he that despiseth you (the Church)
despiseth me.”
Q. 440. May temporal princes and the laity make a holy day?
A. With consent and approbation of the Church, they may, otherwise not; because this is
an act of spiritual jurisdiction.
Q. 441. For what end doth the Church ordain holydays?
A. For the increase of piety, and the memory of special benefits received from God.
Q. 442. If keeping the Sunday be a church precept, why is it numbered in the
decalogue, which are the Commandments of God, and the Law of Nature?
A. Because the substance or chief part of it, namely Divine Right, and the Law of Nature;
though the determinating this particular day, Sunday rather than Saturday, be a Church
ordinance and precept.
Q. 443. Did not Christ, when he confirmed the rest, confirm also this
commandment?
A. In as much as it belongeth to the law of nature, he did: but not as it belonged to the
ceremonial law of the Jews, and was affixed to Saturday, therefore, now we are not
bound to keep Saturday.
Q. 444. Why so, I pray you?
A. Because that particular day was a command of the ceremonial law of the Jews, which
was abrogated, and ceased to oblige after the death of Christ.
Q. 445. To what are we obliged by this precept?
A. To spend Sunday in prayer and divine service.
Q. 446. What is the best means to sanctify the Sunday?
A. By hearing mass, confessing our sins, communicating, hearing sermons, and reading
good books.
Q. 447. What is forbidden by this precept?
A. All profane employments, and servile labours, excepting such as are of necessity, as
dressing meat, serving cattle, &c. or such as appertain to piety and works of mercy.
Q. 448. Who break this commandment?
A. Such as without necessity spend any considerable part of the Sunday in servile
labours.
Q. 449. How else is the Sunday profaned?
A. By spending all the morning slothfully in bed, or vainly dressing ourselves; by missing
divine service when we may hear it, or spending a part of the day in drinking, gaming,
dancing, or the like.
 
Dear TruthWave,

I think you may have misunderstood the article and the Pope.

Sunday has been the rest day for Catholics for close on 2000 years. The Pope is well aware that the original sabbath is Saturday, starting at sunset on Friday, he lives in a country where Saturday is called ‘Sabbato’. Sunday is considered a feast day and trumps any penitential observances on that day. So, the Pope wouldn’t have announced that he wants Sunday as a day of rest starting in 2011 because it already is, he is encouraging people to make use of this blessing of rest in a world obsessed with work at the detriment of family life.

I remember the days when governments made it difficult for people to work on Sundays. Most shops except for the most essential services were closed, businesses were closed on that day, post offices, schools etc., were closed. Public transport was curtailed. I remember you could almost fire a canon down the main street of Sydney on a Sunday afternoon and not hit anyone… it was so deserted. The European Union (EU) bishops are just trying to restore what was the case in Europe only about 40/50 years ago when Sunday was a day for the family… but they haven’t a hope in returning to those days.

Perhaps not strictly related to your topic, but discussions on why Sabbath observances have been transferred to Sunday have been discussed a number of times on CAF (try the search engine if you are interested).
 
Sunday should be a day of rest. Our family doesnt do anything on Sunday except pray and read scripture. We cap off the day of rest with the 7pm Mass. 😃
 
My point is that Genesis 2 refers to the Seventh Day Sabbath, not Sunday. And yet that is where the Pope tries to infer that Sunday should be kept as such, namely, a work free day, in fact that is what the Catholic Bishops are trying to get through in EU, having Sunday be a work free day.
TruthWave, do you also obey all 613 laws that are contained in the Torah (including all the dietary laws? When Jesus says; “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me.” (John 14:6, RSV), Jesus was superseding the Law of the Torah. That does not mean that many parts of the Law are useful for teaching and obeying (such as the Ten Commandments). The Church has the Authority (as passed down through the Apostles) to determine what part of the Law that Christians are to follow, as it did back in the ‘Council of Jerusalem’, when the Church determined that gentile Christians coming into the Church did not need to be circumcised, or have to follow all the Jewish dietary Laws (Acts chap. 15). The Church also decided early on that on the ‘first day of the week’ (Sunday) when they gathered to together ‘to break bread’ (celebrating the Eucharist, see Acts 20:7), superseded the Sabbath, as the day when Christians celebrate the Lord’s resurrection, as we have for the past 2000 years.
 
Personally, I think this is an excellent idea! 👍 How about we enact a new law forcing all businesses to close on Sunday except for emergency services? 👍👍 I mean sure, keep the pharmacy part of pharmacies open, the emergency rooms, hospitals, fire departments, police departments, ambulance services, and whatever else emergency services need to stay open but keep all non-necessary businesses closed! Sunday is supposed to be a day of worship, family, and love, not shopping and commercialism!
 
Personally, I think this is an excellent idea! 👍 How about we enact a new law forcing all businesses to close on Sunday except for emergency services? 👍👍 I mean sure, keep the pharmacy part of pharmacies open, the emergency rooms, hospitals, fire departments, police departments, ambulance services, and whatever else emergency services need to stay open but keep all non-necessary businesses closed! Sunday is supposed to be a day of worship, family, and love, not shopping and commercialism!
And what would you tell Muslims (Friday being their holy day) and observant Jews (being Saturday)? This was tried in my part of the country - the Puritan Blue Laws, and they couldn’t survive modern legal challenges. If we can’t get the Ten Commandments posted in a public place, we’re not going to be able to force businesses to close.
 
Dear TruthWave,

I think you may have misunderstood the article and the Pope.

Sunday has been the rest day for Catholics for close on 2000 years. The Pope is well aware that the original sabbath is Saturday, starting at sunset on Friday, he lives in a country where Saturday is called ‘Sabbato’. Sunday is considered a feast day and trumps any penitential observances on that day. So, the Pope wouldn’t have announced that he wants Sunday as a day of rest starting in 2011 because it already is, he is encouraging people to make use of this blessing of rest in a world obsessed with work at the detriment of family life.

I remember the days when governments made it difficult for people to work on Sundays. Most shops except for the most essential services were closed, businesses were closed on that day, post offices, schools etc., were closed. Public transport was curtailed. I remember you could almost fire a canon down the main street of Sydney on a Sunday afternoon and not hit anyone… it was so deserted. The European Union (EU) bishops are just trying to restore what was the case in Europe only about 40/50 years ago when Sunday was a day for the family… but they haven’t a hope in returning to those days.

Perhaps not strictly related to your topic, but discussions on why Sabbath observances have been transferred to Sunday have been discussed a number of times on CAF (try the search engine if you are interested).
I know the Pope and his army of Jesuits are very well read and highly educated, and I did not misunderstand the Pope’s article. My point is that it is not theologically logical to take the command to rest on the 7th day and and apply that to the 1st day. When the Pope referred back to Genesis 2, that was obviously talking about the 7th day Sabbath not Sunday. What the Pope that the EU Bishops are lobbying for is to make Sunday a legal day of rest in the EU and next will be the world. Seventh Day Adventists have long predicted this would happen in the future, and now the future is here! I do give Catholics credit for being at least honest when it comes to admitting that Sunday was based on the tradition of the church, and not on a Bible command, while Evangelicals as a whole try to do away with the 10 Commandments in their entirety in an attempt to do away with the Sabbath.
 
How about all catholics do just that! Why do you find it necessary to drag all other people into it? Those that want to avoid over-commercialization be the example in your own parish. Why does the government, of and for all the people, have to do your bidding? Would you want the government to force you to follow another religions principles?

St. Paul wrote that “some observe a day and others do not” leaving the sanctifying of the Lord in our own hearts.

After Mass, don’t go out to eat or if you forget something on Thanksgiving don’t go out to a 24/7 store to get it or don’t have a Super Bowl party or …

We don’t need more government in our lives especially when we can just be more disciplined. We must sanctify the Lord in our hearts and by example show the light of truth. Trying to legislate a religious position, even if a wise one, does not change hearts for the better. When hearts are changed, then wise religious principles will be followed.
 
I know the Pope and his army of Jesuits are very well read and highly educated, and I did not misunderstand the Pope’s article. My point is that it is not theologically logical to take the command to rest on the 7th day and and apply that to the 1st day. When the Pope referred back to Genesis 2, that was obviously talking about the 7th day Sabbath not Sunday. What the Pope that the EU Bishops are lobbying for is to make Sunday a legal day of rest in the EU and next will be the world. Seventh Day Adventists have long predicted this would happen in the future, and now the future is here! I do give Catholics credit for being at least honest when it comes to admitting that Sunday was based on the tradition of the church, and not on a Bible command, while Evangelicals as a whole try to do away with the 10 Commandments in their entirety in an attempt to do away with the Sabbath.
Where do you think the Bible comes from? It comes from the oral tradition passed on by Jesus to his Apostles and then from the Apostles to their successors when it starts getting written down. The Church was here before the New Testament came into existence. The written New Testament developed out of the oral tradition.
 
We are still supposed to dedicate one day of the week to God and our families; a day of rest from work. That day was moved from Saturday to Sunday. There are many Biblical references that indicate the Jewish Sabbath (old covenant) is no longer binding, and the new day of worship (new covenant) is Sunday. The old covenant ended with the death of Christ. (Note: covenants end with death, and the death of Christ represented all people, just as Christ died for the sins of all people.) Jesus also met with his followers on Sunday(s).

This does not mean you cannot attend church (worship) on Saturday. Saturday worship is not unbiblical. Some people attend Mass every day. The problem lies when a person declares that Saturday (not Sunday) is the proper day of worship, even though Christ and the early Church said differently.
Jesus rose from the dead on the first day of the week (Matt. 28:1-7; Mark 16:2, 9; Luke 24:1; John 20:1).
Jesus appeared to the disciples on the first day of the week (John 20:19).
Jesus appeared inside the room to the eleven disciples eight days after the first day of the week. The Jewish way of measuring days meant that it was again Sunday
(John 20:26).
The Holy Spirit came on Pentecost, the first day of the week (Lev. 23:16; Acts 2:1).
The first sermon was preached by Peter on the first day of the week (Acts 2:14).
Three thousand converts joined the church on the first day of the week (Acts 2:41).
The three thousand were baptized on the first day of the week (Acts 2:41).
The Christians assembled broke bread on the first day of the week.
The Christians also heard a message from Paul on the first day of the week (Acts 20:7). Note: the reference is until midnight which is not the Jewish method of measuring days, but the Roman system.
Paul instructed the churches to put aside contributions on the first day of the week
(1 Cor. 16:2).
Jesus gave the apostle John the vision of Revelation on the first day of the week
(Rev. 1:10).
 
I know the Pope and his army of Jesuits are very well read and highly educated, and I did not misunderstand the Pope’s article. My point is that it is not theologically logical to take the command to rest on the 7th day and and apply that to the 1st day. When the Pope referred back to Genesis 2, that was obviously talking about the 7th day Sabbath not Sunday.
:yawn: Same old, same old with you SDAs. :rolleyes:

There’s plenty of scripture that shows why the Lord’s day for Christians is Sunday and not Saturday, not the least of which is that we are no longer Jews, and haven’t been for 2,000 years. SDA are pretty much the modern judaizers.

But hey, let’s just take a look at the scriptures that will show you are dead wrong.

Matthew 28:[1] Now after the sabbath, toward the dawn of the first day of the week, Mary Mag’dalene and the other Mary went to see the sepulchre.

Mark 16:[2] And very early on the first day of the week they went to the tomb when the sun had risen.

and [9] Now when he rose early on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, from whom he had cast out seven demons.

Luke 24:[1] But on the first day of the week, at early dawn, they went to the tomb, taking the spices which they had prepared.

John 20:[1] Now on the first day of the week Mary Mag’dalene came to the tomb early, while it was still dark, and saw that the stone had been taken away from the tomb.

and 19] On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being shut where the disciples were, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.”

What is it that Christians celebrate on the Lord’s day and Jews do not? That’s right, the resurrection of Our Lord Jesus Christ, not the Jewish sabbath.
What the Pope that the EU Bishops are lobbying for is to make Sunday a legal day of rest in the EU and next will be the world. Seventh Day Adventists have long predicted this would happen in the future, and now the future is here!
Typical anti-Catholic SDA propaganda. Nothing new there. The bad news is that no one is “lobbying” any such thing in the EU or anywhere else, though you SDAs dearly wish we would. It is a teaching, and nothing more and no one anywhere has even hinted that we seek any such laws, though as I said before, the SDAs desperately wish we would, so their false prophecies might appear to have some validity. It hasn’t happened and it’s not gonna happen, so you guys wasted your effort trying to make that Zenit article work for you.

While we’re on the subject of SDA false prophets and their prophecies…How many times now have you guys predicted the day and time of Christ’s return and been dead wrong?

Is it 2…or 3 times now?

Let’s take a look at what the Word of God actually says about such false prophets and their prophecies, shall we?

Deuteronomy 18:21] And if you say in your heart, `How may we know the word which the LORD has not spoken?’ –
22] when a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word which the LORD has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously, you need not be afraid of him.

You probably don’t wanna read verse 20 of that chapter. :eek:

(Cont’d)
 
I do give Catholics credit for being at least honest when it comes to admitting that Sunday was based on the tradition of the church, and not on a Bible command,
I don’t seem to recall anyone here saying that this change was based solely upon any tradition, and if they did then they would be wrong. Let’s take a look at the Word of God in the New Testament to see if there are any clues as to when they worshiped.

Acts 20:[7] On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the morrow; and he prolonged his speech until midnight.

1st Corinthians 16:[2] On the first day of every week, each of you is to put something aside and store it up, as he may prosper, so that contributions need not be made when I come.

Revelation 1:[10] I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet

Oh no! It seems that the New Testament plainly tells us that the Christians worshiped on Sunday even as it was being written! :eek: That’s not just tradition then…it’s right there in the Word of God, as inspired by the Holy Spirit and penned by the Evangelist Saint Luke and the Apostles Saints Paul and John. St. Paul was a Jewish scholar so if he led services (which is clearly seen from the fact that they had met to break bread [worse still for you SDA], because that is a direct reference to the Eucharist, something you errantly reject.:whistle:) then it certainly is logical to accept that we should too.
while Evangelicals as a whole try to do away with the 10 Commandments in their entirety in an attempt to do away with the Sabbath.
Not our problem. If they do that, and I’m not at all saying that I believe you because I know quite a number of them and was one for many years, and I have never heard that from the preachers I was exposed to. Maybe you should wander over to CARM or one of the other n-C forums and post that to them. Good luck with that. 👋
 
Where do you think the Bible comes from? It comes from the oral tradition passed on by Jesus to his Apostles and then from the Apostles to their successors when it starts getting written down. The Church was here before the New Testament came into existence. The written New Testament developed out of the oral tradition.
Oral tradition doesn’t trump the holy law of God, the 10 Commandments. Since the 10 Commandments were issued by God himself he has not added or subtracted any of the 10. Therefore, we can only conclude that they still stand in force defining what sin is.
 
Personally, I think this is an excellent idea! 👍 How about we enact a new law forcing all businesses to close on Sunday except for emergency services? 👍👍 I mean sure, keep the pharmacy part of pharmacies open, the emergency rooms, hospitals, fire departments, police departments, ambulance services, and whatever else emergency services need to stay open but keep all non-necessary businesses closed! Sunday is supposed to be a day of worship, family, and love, not shopping and commercialism!
The EU Catholic Bishops are trying to do just that as we speak. Note, the Web link:
comece.org/content/site/en/press/pressreleases/newsletter.content/1185.html
 
And what would you tell Muslims (Friday being their holy day) and observant Jews (being Saturday)? This was tried in my part of the country - the Puritan Blue Laws, and they couldn’t survive modern legal challenges. If we can’t get the Ten Commandments posted in a public place, we’re not going to be able to force businesses to close.
In the USA I see stone tablets of the 10 Commandments at Court Houses and in front of churches all over the USA. In fact, there is a stone monument of the 10 Commandments at the local Catholic Church where I live.
 
The EU Catholic Bishops are trying to do just that as we speak. Note, the Web link:
comece.org/content/site/en/press/pressreleases/newsletter.content/1185.html
Too bad that it is simply (name removed by moderator)ut by various religious. It nowhere states that the Catholic Church is pushing it, but simply offering dialog.

As I showed earlier there is more than ample evidence that you are in scriptural error, so then why would it be wrong for us to enter a dialog with government where we inform their thinking according to the Word of God.

Again, you misrepresent information and events to suit your wishful thinking. If you don’t agree then maybe you SDAs should quit cryin’ and go tell the EU what you think.

I notice that you seem to have completely ignored the scriptural evidence I presented in Re: Pope Wants Sunday As Day of Rest Starting in 2011

Why is that?
 
Too bad that it is simply (name removed by moderator)ut by various religious. It nowhere states that the Catholic Church is pushing it, but simply offering dialog.

As I showed earlier there is more than ample evidence that you are in scriptural error, so then why would it be wrong for us to enter a dialog with government where we inform their thinking according to the Word of God.

Again, you misrepresent information and events to suit your wishful thinking. If you don’t agree then maybe you SDAs should quit cryin’ and go tell the EU what you think.

I notice that you seem to have completely ignored the scriptural evidence I presented in Re: Pope Wants Sunday As Day of Rest Starting in 2011

Why is that?
The Catholic Bishops of the EU is one of those churches who have joined hands with the Labor Unions and various Protestant Churches to push this through. Rome has already been successful in getting other Sunday laws passed in other European Countries, for example, Croatia’s Sunday Law: foxnews.com/wires/2008Jul15/0,4670,CroatiaSundayShopping,00.html
 
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