Pot Permissible...?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Metaron
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
M

Metaron

Guest
I heard that, if you are a Catholic and live in an area of the world where recreational use of marijuana is allowed, that, as long as you use it with moderation (just as with alchohol) it is perfectly allowable by Church teaching and is neither a venial or mortal sin. Is this true, and has a Pope or the Magisterium ever issued anything dealing with this or similar topics?
 
Can’t see why it would be wrong in strict moderation, as it’s not as bad as alcohol. Obviously it’s wrong where it’s against the law (as you stated). Doubt there’s been any proclamations, though with Italy and Spain’s more liberal drug stances may have happened
 
JMBNH said:
Can’t see why it would be wrong in strict moderation, as it’s not as bad as alcohol. Obviously it’s wrong where it’s against the law (as you stated). Doubt there’s been any proclamations, though with Italy and Spain’s more liberal drug stances may have happened
Click to expand...
Hm. Interesting. I was curious, since I heard that claim made by a younger Catholic (much to the consernation of the older Catholics present.) It’s an oddball issue, but it proves that you can’t just restrict the Roman Catholic Magisterium and teaching to conservativism, because conservativism isn’t infallible. Only Church teaching is.
 
That is also my understanding. If it is legal in that jurisdiction, moderate use would be acceptable in the way of the other “soft vices” (e.g. tobacco and alcohol).

I’m actually for the legalization of commercial hemp production in the USA, just keep the sale of the flower illegal (processed or not) to eliminate the primary gateway drug risk (that you can only get it from drug dealers) but turn a blind eye to kids picking their own from the edge of the hemp fiber patch.
 
When my husband was attending RCIA there was a section on morality and choices. “Strongly Believe”, “Fairly Sure” “Can’t Make Up My Mind”, “Seriously Doubt It” or “No. Don’t Belive It” to such questions as “Divorce is forbidden by God” “Abortion is a violation of the commandment ‘You shall not kill’” and “Smoking pot is a sin”. All questions were answered silently on paper. Then you were paired up with another member in the room (sponsors, teachers, catechumens, etc.) to discuss your answers. I got paired up with the teacher, Sister Mary. When we got to that question I shared the fact that I had serious doubts about it being a sin. I struggled back and forth with my various reasonings and theories. Understand, I am trying to express my views on marijuana to a 75 year old Irish nun with the kindest heart but the quickest “wrath”…you know…“Old School” Sister. Sister then told me that she saw no reason why a person could not enjoy an occasional “joint”,(I swear!! A 75 yr old nun said joint!). She explained that as long as something like pot or alcohol is used in moderation and not at the expense of families, lives, jobs, etc. (just like most things in life) then there couldn’t be any harm. I, personally, kind of feel the same way. I know many people who hold down great jobs, raise terrific kids, have fantastic sense of God and family (Catholic and non-Catholic, alike) and they just happen to smoke some marijuana now and then. We even tossed these verses around: Genesis 1:29-30(NAB) “God also said: “See, I give you every seed-bearing plant all over the earth and every tree that has seed-bearing fruit on it to be your food; and to all the animals of the land, all the birds of the air, and all the living creatures that crawl on the ground, I give all the green plants for food.” And so it happened.” I just thought I would share my experience.

Peace :byzsoc:
 
Yeah, unless “Refer Madness” is to be believed, pot in moderation could be just something fun you do with your buddies once a week.
 
Reefer Madness was a crazy movie, wasn’t it? I mean, I have heard of people acting in that manner after ingesting chemical substances such as LSD or PCP but NEVER, in my life, have I ever heard of anyone acting that nutty after smoking pot. I’m really anxious to see what other members have to say on the issue. I am particularly interested in the RC point of view.
 
Metaron said:
you can’t just restrict the Roman Catholic Magisterium and teaching to conservativism, because conservativism isn’t infallible. Only Church teaching is.
Click to expand...
That way leads you to the fundamentalist/Baptist/Puritanical thinking.

Like the no alcohol, physical contact between genders, smoking, gambling or dancing rules.

Seems absurd to me especially the first two given that Jesus drank wine and that the standard Christian greeting at the Peace Be With You part of Mass was kissing on the lips (no joke).
 
Ray_Scheel said:
That is also my understanding. If it is legal in that jurisdiction, moderate use would be acceptable in the way of the other “soft vices” (e.g. tobacco and alcohol).

I’m actually for the legalization of commercial hemp production in the USA, just keep the sale of the flower illegal (processed or not) to eliminate the primary gateway drug risk (that you can only get it from drug dealers) but turn a blind eye to kids picking their own from the edge of the hemp fiber patch.
Click to expand...
Ha, gateway drug risk. That’s funny; actually the government and prevention programs are brainwashing people into believing that marijuana is a gateway. Recent studies have shown no such thing exists.
 
Metaron said:
I heard that, if you are a Catholic and live in an area of the world where recreational use of marijuana is allowed, that, as long as you use it with moderation (just as with alchohol) it is perfectly allowable by Church teaching and is neither a venial or mortal sin. Is this true, and has a Pope or the Magisterium ever issued anything dealing with this or similar topics?
Click to expand...
Why on earth would you think that because something is legal in an area or country that participating in that thing would not be a sin?
Abortion is legal in many countries but it is a grave sin! Contraception is legal in many countries but it is a grave sin.
All drugs taken for anything other than medicinal purposes and prescribed by a doctor for such purpose is a grave sin.
 
thistle said:
…All drugs taken for anything other than medicinal purposes and prescribed by a doctor for such purpose is a grave sin.
Click to expand...
So are you saying drinking coffee or tea, or eating chocolate is a grave sin?
 
gmags2003 said:
Ha, gateway drug risk. That’s funny; actually the government and prevention programs are brainwashing people into believing that marijuana is a gateway. Recent studies have shown no such thing exists.
Click to expand...
I agree that effect is overblown in the US drug war propaganda, but if the only way to get MJ is through a drug dealer, and most dealers trade in more than one product, there is at least a significant potential of cross selling. Take the dealers out of the picture and what risk there is is going to fade to almost nothing aside from those individuals who are susceptible to substance abuse anyway.
 
I do think there is a difference between a glass of wine and a toke on a joint. You can have a drink without getting inebriated, but nobody takes a toke on a joint without at least intending to get high.

People can and do have the glass of wine because they like the way it tastes. A mild inebriation would be a side-effect that could, in moderation, be seen as a plus. I don’t think that a very mild intoxication - one that doesn’t effect your judgement - is a bad thing. If it helps you unwind a bit or socially relax, it may be beneficial. But, it’s a very fine line and I’m not sure I can really locate where it becomes problematic. Basically, you only know you’ve crossed that line AFTER you’ve already crossed it.

But, smoking a joint for non-medical reasons is ALWAYS done SOLELY in order to achieve inebriation Well, I guess some people do it because they want to go along with the crowd. But, my point is that pot has only one purpose and that is to alter your brain chemistry.

I’m not sure it’s OK to treat our brains like playgrounds.

I never cared for pot, but I used to take mushrooms on rare occassions. There’s a reason they call it “a trip.” You are literally going on a mental “trip” and eating the mushroom is about the same as buckling yourself into a seat on an airplane. I don’t think it’s right to seek out an experience where reality seems altered. It just doesn’t seem to jibe with the Natural Law.
 
thistle said:
Why on earth would you think that because something is legal in an area or country that participating in that thing would not be a sin?
Click to expand...
Though anything legal and not condemned by the Catholic Church (at least when in strict moderation) is surely not a sin? Though I’m not 100% on the church stance part, so I’d err on the side of caution if on an Amsterdam holiday.
thistle said:
All drugs taken for anything other than medicinal purposes and prescribed by a doctor for such purpose is a grave sin.
Click to expand...
Alcohol (which is a drug) in moderation is actively ENCOURAGED by the Bible:

Sirach 32:27
Wine is very life to human beings if taken in moderation. What is life to one who is without wine? It has been created to make people happy.
 
Ray_Scheel said:
I agree that effect is overblown in the US drug war propaganda, but if the only way to get MJ is through a drug dealer, and most dealers trade in more than one product, there is at least a significant potential of cross selling. Take the dealers out of the picture and what risk there is is going to fade to almost nothing aside from those individuals who are susceptible to substance abuse anyway.
Click to expand...
Before I joined this forum, I had been busted for running a marijuana trafficking ring. From my personal experience, I can say that the only substance involved was marijuana (I refused all other substances) and it was never mixed or adulterated. I can also say that because it is an illegal trade in the US (which I am out of, by the way), it does impair the Christian lifestyle. As much as I disagree with the current laws, it is illegal. On top of that, the people I dealt with were not exactly great rolemodels. I have to say that I am glad I am done with it. I doubt the Catholic Church has made an official statement one way or the other, but I believe that they would not support it where it is illegal. If one lived in a country where it is legal and acceptable, then it may be different. I believe the cultural acceptance of it plays into the belief about it’s moral use. The same goes for many other natural substances like coca leaves and qat. I think we can agree that some synthetic substances are certainly condemned by the Church such as heroin and PCP when used recreationally. The catechism does not address many of the “soft” drugs, though. Unlike an issue such as abortion, I believe one must go with what the secular authorities say, aswell as their local spiritual authorities.

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius:cool:
 
I don’t see a problem with moderate use. Can it be worse than some of the legal sedatives for those with serious anxiety issues?

Personally, if it were legal, I wouldn’t do it.

In terms of a gateway drug, tobacco is the one they suspect and have suspected for years.
 
Gateways are man-made. People, it isn’t the drug that is the gateway! Like somebody said in a previous post, if there is a dealer who mixes the drugs or whatever…that is the dealer’s fault! You can’t blame marijuana (or tobacco) for anything.
Running a marijuana trafficking ring? I’m sure that would have some effect on the Christian lifestyle. Occasionally smoking a joint or eating shrooms…now I’m not so sure that would have a detrimental effect on one’s religious convictions. God left certain drugs growing naturally upon our planet to help speed up our evolution.
 
Sheeniac said:
I don’t see a problem with moderate use. Can it be worse than some of the legal sedatives for those with serious anxiety issues?
Click to expand...
I agree. If alcohol is permitted than so should marijuana.
Prescription drugs kill more people than heroin and cocaine combined. When is the last time someone died of marijuana…never. Alcohol kills many every year. There is no way marijuana should be illegal if alcohol is legal. And if the Church allows alcohol in moderation than it should allow marijuana too.
 
Joey1976 said:
…Prescription drugs kill more people than heroin and cocaine combined…
Click to expand...
Possibly. And handguns kill more people than hydrogen bombs. This does not mean hydrogen bombs are inherently safer to use than handguns, but that far more handguns exist and are used, or rather misused, than hydrogen bombs.

Likewise the fact that prescription drugs kill more people than heroin and cocaine (if that is a fact) does not prove that heroin and cocaine are inherently safer than prescription medicines, of which there are countless types and combinations, but simply that there are many, many times more people using and sometimes misusing prescription drugs. A more useful gauge to the safety of heroin and cocaine would be to compare:

The ratio of the number of persons killed by prescription drugs to the total number of persons using prescription drugs

to

The ratio of the number of persons killed by heroin or cocaine to the total number of persons using heroin or cocaine.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top