Pottery OK for consecration?

[mmadsen4]

I went to a neighboring parish due to mass schedules and witnessed both species of the blessed sacrament being consecrated in earthen pottery…a chunky and rather plain variety. The plate resembled a pie plate. I’ve never seen this before. I’ve always seen precious metal chalice and I don’t know the correct terms for the pieces for the eucharist…is it paten?

One time I think I saw a fine crystal chalice used.

Is pottery an acceptable vessel for this use in the mass?

And can a tabernacle be behind an iron gate? The gate is unlocked, and the bars are very wide it is visible, but doesn’t seem to meet the rules for prominence.

My own church also has electric drums…which just make me cringe.

 

[scylla]

No it isn’t, why don’t you seek for a way to donate a nice new one in precious metal as we should be using.

That is a good “nice” way to help things get a little back on track.

God Bless
Scylla

 

[benedictgal]

Redepmtionis Sacramentum says that it is an abuse to use anything other than precious metals for the chalice and paten. However, the outside may be pottery, but the inside must be made of gold or silver.

 

[John_Lilburne]

Redepmtionis Sacramentum says that it is an abuse to use anything other than precious metals for the chalice and paten. However, the outside may be pottery, but the inside must be made of gold or silver.

No, the 2004 Instruction Redemptionis Sacramentum does not say the outside may be pottery. It has in n. 117:
“Reprobated, therefore, is any practice of using for the celebration of Mass common vessels, or others lacking in quality, or devoid of all artistic merit or which are mere containers, as also other vessels made from glass, earthenware, clay, or other materials that break easily.”

The 2002 General Instruction of the Roman Missal has:
“330. As regards chalices and other vessels that are intended to serve as receptacles for the Blood of the Lord, they are to have bowls of nonabsorbent material. The base, on the other hand, may be made of other solid and worthy materials.”

But clay is clearly not regarded as one of these “solid and worthy materials”. It is regarded as a material that breaks easily.

 

[Cristiano]

I would say that in terms of pastoral concerns pottery could be used if it were the only way to celebrate the Mass. It does not invalidate the Mass.

Beyond that I think ( I am not being very charitable) that a lot of times there is just a lot of arrogance in the decision of not procuring and using the appropriate vessels.

 

[bluerose]

My BIL was visitng just a couple of weeks ago (he’s a Legionary of Christ priest) and obtained permission for the local pastor to use the church for his private Masses (as an aside, he offered to give public Masses since the parish priest was on vacation, but he was politely turned down )

Anyway, he was appalled to see that the vessels were all of pottery… that included the cruets used for the wine and water. Now granted the local population is probably 95% Native American, but these vessels weren’t priceless works of art or anything you couldn’t buy at the local pottery shop for about $20-$30 (not that that would have made much difference… they still would have been breakable.)

What really upset my BIL, however, was that he found a simple but beautiful gold and silver chalice and paten, plus two crystal cruets, stashed away in a cupboard in the sacristy. The chalice and paten were so tarnished that it took him the better part of an hour to polish them to the point where they were deemed “worthy of the Lord”. He left them on the shelf next to the pottery vessels. We attended Mass there yesterday (my BIL left a week ago) and saw they were using the pottery vessels again. Oh, well.

 

[benedictgal]

No, the 2004 Instruction Redemptionis Sacramentum does not say the outside may be pottery. It has in n. 117:
“Reprobated, therefore, is any practice of using for the celebration of Mass common vessels, or others lacking in quality, or devoid of all artistic merit or which are mere containers, as also other vessels made from glass, earthenware, clay, or other materials that break easily.”

The 2002 General Instruction of the Roman Missal has:
“330. As regards chalices and other vessels that are intended to serve as receptacles for the Blood of the Lord, they are to have bowls of nonabsorbent material. The base, on the other hand, may be made of other solid and worthy materials.”

But clay is clearly not regarded as one of these “solid and worthy materials”. It is regarded as a material that breaks easily.

I stand corrected. That’s what happens when you lend your only copy of RS to a priest friend who has not returned it to you. Mea culpa.

Oddly enough, at our cathedral, there is a chalice made of wood, but the inside bowl is made of gold. Ditto for the paten.

Now, I believe that the only time that glass was allowed was during the Mexican persecutions of the 1910s through 1930s. Blessed Miguel Pro apparently celebrated Mass with a glass chalice. Immediately after Mass, the chalice was broken and reverently disposed. I take it that this had to do more with dire and grave emergency (with impending death if the police or the other authorities had caught them) than anything else. The priests at his seminary had to bury the sacred objects to keep the anti-clerical Mexican regime from getting hold of them.

 

[Cavaille-Coll]

Several years ago, I was serving at a daily Mass in my parish. The main chalice used by the priest was a magnificent, gold-plated “St. Remy” chalice, made in Spain and encrusted with real rubies. There were also two crystal, long-stemmed goblets on the credence table for use by the EEM’s on Sundays. These were the type that could be purchased at any Big Lots-type store for a couple of dollars as a “red wine glass.” As I was reaching for the lavabo bowl during Mass, my hand brushed one of the empty glasses and it slipped behind the credence table and shattered. Nobody said a word, but the following week there were two, new chromed-pewter cups on the table.

Some parishes use pottery because it makes them feel in sync with the Third World, which by their estimation cannot afford costly altar wares. Yet, in my own experience in Mexico, even the poorest parishes will invest in a gold-plated metal chalice. The plating may not be very thick, and the jewels might be only rhinestones, but it has a dignified appearance to glorify the Lord’s Body and Blood within. They would not consider pottery a worthy material.