Poverty in Third Orders

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Archerette74

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I’ve been looking into Third Orders and I see a lot of promises of poverty. I understand what poverty is, but I don’t understand it in the context of Third Orders for Laypersons. 😊

I mean, as a wife and parent, how can one promise poverty? Can somebody please put this in perspective for me? As a lay person, with a vocation of marriage and motherhood, what exactly does poverty mean? And Thank you in advance for helping me to understand this.
 
can’t answer as I am a Benedictine Oblate, we don’t take vows we make a one year commitment, and in any case no promise of poverty. We have secular Franciscans in our prayer group and they don’t make a promise of poverty either, and those are the only two I know enough about. I assume you are inquiring in a general way about lay associates attached to religious orders, not actual TORs, Third Orders Regular, who do take vows and are bound by a rule.
 
Probably your best source of information would be someone in the order you’re discerning. My guess is that they don’t mean poverty in the same way the regular members of the order practice it, but something more like simplicity or avoiding consumerism.
 
Unfortunately I know of not a single person in this rite. I was looking in to the Carmelites when I learned of the Dominicans. The more I learn of them, the more my heart longs to learn more of them. Does that make sense? At any rate, the poverty has me stumped. But I like your wording about consumerism, SuscipeMeDomine. Thank you!

PuzzleAnnie, I don’t even really know about TORs versus lay people. As a layperson maybe that vow of poverty I read about wouldn’t be anything I would have to make. I just really need to learn more.

I sent away for information regarding the Dominicans months ago but never recieved anything. 😦 Maybe I need to look into that again. I sure wish there was somebody around here that I knew of who was associated with that order. It would make things so much easier.

If anybody knows of some reliable sites on the Dominicans I would be thrilled if you could post them here. Thanks!
 
if you search on the spirituality forum under the various orders, or seculars, you will find threads with forum residents who are secular Carmelites, Benedictine Oblates, Dominican Tertiaries, Secular Franciscans, Opus Dei members, and others. if you serach on just the order name you should get a lot of hits.
 
You didn’t say from whom you requested information; however, I would try contacting a chapter or pro-chapter. Here is a website that has chapter listings by region/state for the Lay Dominicans, with contact information for each chapter and pro-chapter. 3op.org/index.php

I, too, am considering whether I am called to be a Lay Dominican. The way I understand the vow of poverty is like this: Poverty is necessary and need not be austere. Vow of poverty for Laity would not be unrealistic for one with a familiy. The Beatitudes show the way for poverty of the heart. Being poor may not mean that one knows the spirit of poverty. One must trust God. He will provide. Give to the needy, help your neighbor, ask for one’s daily bread and try to turn from a materialistic way of life. Give oneself to the Holy Trinity. domlaitydenver.org/dominicanLife.html

Hope this helps!
 
KiraSana said:
You didn’t say from whom you requested information; however, I would try contacting a chapter or pro-chapter. Here is a website that has chapter listings by region/state for the Lay Dominicans, with contact information for each chapter and pro-chapter. 3op.org/index.php

I, too, am considering whether I am called to be a Lay Dominican. The way I understand the vow of poverty is like this: Poverty is necessary and need not be austere. Vow of poverty for Laity would not be unrealistic for one with a familiy. The Beatitudes show the way for poverty of the heart. Being poor may not mean that one knows the spirit of poverty. One must trust God. He will provide. Give to the needy, help your neighbor, ask for one’s daily bread and try to turn from a materialistic way of life. Give oneself to the Holy Trinity. domlaitydenver.org/dominicanLife.html

Hope this helps!
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My parents are Secular Franciscans, and I am in formation to become one myself. I think the above post does pretty well at explaining it. Certainly lay Franciscans and members of the other secular orders don’t live utter poverty as the religious do.

From our perspective it a certain amount of self-denial regarding possessions and money is definitely in order, though. It’s about NOT going for the newer/bigger/shinier/more expensive car/house/clothes/computer, about giving as generously as reasonable provision for needs (rather than wants) allows, things like that.
 
I’m afraid to tell you that our Franciscan Friars, though having taken vows, receive far too many gifts to be truly poor. It is a vow that they take however, they have a roof over their head, 3 hots and a cot, and even enjoy much of the ammenities that many of us do. However, my wife and I lived a Franciscan life style even before converting to Catholicism. It’s the spirit of poverty that you are adhering to, not true material poverty, especially for those with children who need access to martial things the learn. You promise is not theirs until they own it. A Secular Franciscan -SFO - in truth lives the spirit of poverty. Some have professional jobs. In some ways they would act much like Opus Dei…give more, help more, pray more, etc. I am going to my friends permantent commitment on February 3, 2008. My wife and I have been considering doing this too. But we are new and taking things a step at a time first preparing our oldest for the seminary and me for the diaconate. So we kind of have our hands full. I love Carmelites, Benedictines, Dominicans and Franciscans.

FYI: Fr. Vincent Serpa is a Dominican Friar. Might want to ask him on CAF.
 
I’m a married Lay Passionist, and I live the “poverty, chastity and obedience” in the context of marriage.

Poverty–the rule of our cloistered nuns says that, in effect, that the children of the Sacred Passion should live detached from all created wealth. So what does this mean for me? I put the needs of the other three family members before me. I ask the questions of whether or not I really need something before buying. If something has not been in use in the household for x number of months, either sell it or give it to charity. What do the welfare moms do to stretch their dollars? They look for sales, and buy in bulk. Read “Myth of the Welfare Queen.”

Chastity–that should be a no-brainer. Chastity in thought, word, and deed. Being the best spouse you can be in all areas of the marriage. Marriage is 90 percent team problem-solving, and 10 percent “other” (if you know what I mean).

Obedience–Again, this is in the context of marriage and child-rearing. Hubby gives a command–make this phone call, or run this errand–do so for the greater glory of God. The only words coming out of one’s mouth should be clarification of the task, if necessary, and reporting back. Of course, I insist on obedience from my kids, but I’m also obedient to their needs. I might be their superior, but I’ll only be a superior mother if their needs are met. They learn to take care of others though my taking care of them.

The tongue is the greatest offender we have, and one of the greatest penances we can do is keeping it quiet in adverse circumstances. Hubby was swearing up a storm at the traffic one day, and it was detracting from his driving. I told him to put that energy into driving, so that we could be safer. When I was in college, I was a Lay Dominican. A book we were given had a list of penances we could do. Since our college seemed to get a lot of rain, and everyone complained about it, I decided just to keep my mouth shut, and offer the inconvenience for the other students.

HTH.

Blessings,
Cloisters
 
Archerette74 said:
I’ve been looking into Third Orders and I see a lot of promises of poverty. I understand what poverty is, but I don’t understand it in the context of Third Orders for Laypersons. 😊

I mean, as a wife and parent, how can one promise poverty? Can somebody please put this in perspective for me? As a lay person, with a vocation of marriage and motherhood, what exactly does poverty mean? And Thank you in advance for helping me to understand this.
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Just a thought… But in a real way, living out in the world, avoiding levels of consumerism could be what is intended.

When you are at the store you can ask yourself “Do I need this? Really need this?”

Same with preparing meals at home, seeking inexpensive entertainment (watching a DVD is cheaper than the movies with $9.00 popcorn), re-considering certain luxuries (Do you need 900 chanels on your cable? I don’t!) etc.

This is just my speculation. Consult the order you are looking at for their explanation.
 
I am a new Lay Dominican, and I have to say that living a life of poverty is probably one of the most challenging things for me… I’ve always been a bit of a prodigal person, and am still struggling not to be. :o

I strive to be a good steward, never to be wasteful. I try to be grateful for what I have, instead of longing for more and newer and better, etc. I try never to take anything for granted or to take more than I need–especially when it comes to food. I try to give money to charity organizations and to any needy individual I may come across. I try to enjoy and take pleasure in things that don’t cost money–family and friends, nature, church events, exercising, etc. And I pray! I ask God to help me be more temperate, more generous, more grateful.

The Dominicans are a very realistic, practical, and compassionate bunch–I’m sure the other orders and religious groups are the same way too. They only ask what is reasonable and what provides for the welfare of their members. So you really don’t need to worry or to be wary! They are also really good at helping discern with you whether you are called to the Order and to lay religious life in general. You will have people all along the way to discuss and help you with any concerns or difficulties. In my Lay Dominican chapter, we are always talking about how to best live out our religious lives and promises.

How I got started was just by sending an email via the Lay Dominican site for my province. I got responses from the province’s Lay Dominican vocations director and from the moderator of the local chapter. They provided me some readings, and invited me to the monthly chapter meeting. I went to the meeting and immediate “felt at home.” As they say, the rest is history!

So please don’t hesitate to just contact people, join meetings, and see what it’s all about! That’s the only way to know if it’s right for you, really. Also feel free to contact me if you want to talk further! 🙂 God be with you.
 
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