Power struggle with my fiancé

[Xantippe]

He considers quality time to be more important than that 3rd job. He backed that up by saying she should trust him to provide. So why not take him at his word? Why not trust him on this? If she can’t trust those words of his, they have far bigger issues than she is letting on.

Why can’t he demonstrate it to her on paper that things are going to be fine? If things are fine, it should be easy to explain.

He’s presumably never been responsible for anybody other than himself, so he might genuinely not understand what their future household’s financial needs are. Also, it’s not out of the question that the OP and her future husband could find themselves parents very soon which would 1) decrease their earning ability and 2) increase their financial needs.

 

[agnes_therese]

But as to your other points, what if they really do need the money? They are students and they’re getting married soon. The odds are that they are short of funds or are going to be short of funds.

She said they don’t need the money. I’ll bet that right now, he feels like she considers the third job to be more important than time with him. And for her to call that “ridiculous” and “controlling” makes me think he may be right.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

I am staggered by how little time you have together. There may be valid reasons to keep the photography job, but I’m quite sure there aren’t valid reasons to work three jobs.

We work to live, not live to work.

Please pick up Joseph Pieper’s book “Leisure”, and read it. In your spare time.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

But as to your other points, what if they really do need the money? They are students and they’re getting married soon. The odds are that they are short of funds or are going to be short of funds.

I don’t have any idea why students working a combination of 5 jobs would be short on funds.

I have 5 kids, and I’m going to grad school, getting paid a pittance. My wife works 10 hours a week as a nurse. And we’re doing fine. I guess I don’t understand how two singles couldn’t be doing fine financially, if they had as many jobs as I have children.

 

[Lorelei12]

Your fiancé wants to make sure that you spend enough time together. It really sounds like you aren’t making that a priority, at least not right now. I think your offer to quit after you’re married was good, and that he responded poorly to your compromise, though.

When you say he “demands” that you quit this job, do you mean that he really is saying “quit or else” or rather “I would really like you to quit because I want to be able to spend more time with you”? This guy loves you enough to want to spend the rest of his life with you- of course he wants to make sure you have time together. With how busy you both are, this is going to become even more important once you are married. He is probably worried that it will never change.

I think if you can sit down with him and really have a conversation about it, without getting defensive or accusing him of being controlling, he might have a better time explaining what his real concerns are, and it might help you to understand a little better. From what you have described, I don’t see his behavior so much as controlling, as much as concerned for your relationship and marriage. And that is a good thing.

 

[Xantippe]

She said they don’t need the money. I’ll bet that right now, he feels like she considers the third job to be more important than time with him. And for her to call that “ridiculous” and “controlling” makes me think he may be right.

Well, he’s asleep during much of the time she’s working on the photography job, which is probably where “ridiculous” and “controlling” comes in.

 

[PaulinVA]

I have been married for 30 years, and if you are entering into marriage and view the relationship as something either of you need to keep control of, you will fail.

Marriage is about being selfless. It’s about putting the other first. Neither party in this scenario is doing that.

 

[Xantippe]

I don’t have any idea why students working a combination of 5 jobs would be short on funds.

I have 5 kids, and I’m going to grad school, getting paid a pittance. My wife works 10 hours a week as a nurse. And we’re doing fine. I guess I don’t understand how two singles couldn’t be doing fine financially, if they had as many jobs as I have children.

The key word in your post is “nurse.” Having one job that pays a decent hourly rate makes a huge difference.

We are living in the age of the cruddy part-time job, so yeah, I can see how two singles might not have enough funds with five jobs total, if they are all entry-level jobs. After my grad school, I worked 3 and 4 jobs while waiting for my husband to finish his degree. I wasn’t studying at the same time, thank goodness, but it did take several so-so jobs to achieve the equivalent of one good job. When I was a kid, my dad always had at least 3 things going, and often 4. Currently, as an empty nester, he 1) teaches community college 2) ranches 3) has a store with my mom and 4) is working on a project with my aunt and uncle and 5) if he could find the time, there’s another book he should write. Likewise, my sister and brother-in-law run a cafe, run a tour business, and a gift-shop, just acquired a small ranch, all on top of BIL’s corporate consulting. For the more entrepreneurial, high energy, go-getter types, that’s stimulating and fun.

Five jobs for two people is not a lot if each fiance is working only 40 hours and their hourly rate of pay is low. OP, you’re not working more than 40 hours a week, are you?

Presumably, the photography job pays the best hourly rate of all of her jobs, so if she could quit a job, it might even pencil out for her to quit the retail job instead, as long as there was photography work year-round (which I suspect there isn’t). I’m sure it hurts a lot to quit the job that pays the best (or nearly the best) and offers a lot of satisfaction.

If the shoe were on the other foot, and it was her fiance who wanted to work a photography job, I think people would be a lot more understanding.

 

[Xantippe]

Here’s some stuff to discuss with your fiance if you haven’t already (the yours are plural–talk about his and yours):

1. Your debt level
2. Your school costs
3. Your credit (look up both of your credit)
4. Your bank balances
5. Your income
6. Start-up costs for your new life together (do you need a new bed, etc? will you be moving?)
7. A hypothetical budget for your first month together

Those are all important, but #7 is the big one. Discuss #1-7 thoroughly and I think you will find yourself discovering how much you both need to work.

Also, discuss the hypothetical (but not at all improbable) case that you might have a baby your first year of marriage. How would you manage that financially and logistically?

Mostly–talk and keep talking about money. It’s no good for either of you to say “don’t you trust me?” with regard to money. Put all of the cards on the table. Ideally, do a monthly budget meeting every month before the month begins and you start spending money.

Good luck!

 

[Prodigal_Son]

The key word in your post is “nurse.” Having one job that pays a decent hourly rate makes a huge difference.

We are living in the age of the cruddy part-time job, so yeah, I can see how two singles might not have enough funds with five jobs total, if they are all entry-level jobs. After my grad school, I worked 3 and 4 jobs while waiting for my husband to finish his degree. I wasn’t studying at the same time, thank goodness, but it did take several so-so jobs to achieve the equivalent of one good job. When I was a kid, my dad always had at least 3 things going, and often 4. Currently, as an empty nester, he 1) teaches community college 2) ranches 3) has a store with my mom and 4) is working on a project with my aunt and uncle and 5) if he could find the time, there’s another book he should write. Likewise, my sister and brother-in-law run a cafe, run a tour business, and a gift-shop, just acquired a small ranch, all on top of BIL’s corporate consulting. For the more entrepreneurial, high energy, go-getter types, that’s stimulating and fun.

Five jobs for two people is not a lot if each fiance is working only 40 hours and their hourly rate of pay is low. OP, you’re not working more than 40 hours a week, are you?

Presumably, the photography job pays the best hourly rate of all of her jobs, so if she could quit a job, it might even pencil out for her to quit the retail job instead, as long as there was photography work year-round (which I suspect there isn’t). I’m sure it hurts a lot to quit the job that pays the best (or nearly the best) and offers a lot of satisfaction.

Well, two things: (1) The OP said they weren’t hurting for money. (2) If they’re making around minimum wage, they’d be taking in approximately $1500 every two weeks. Which is more than my family makes, but it isn’t much – and we qualify for food stamps, so that take some pressure off.

I’ll agree that now, when I look at how little people on minimum wage actually make, it seems quite low. We don’t know how much the various jobs the OP is talking about pay, however.

In my book, financial stability and clear communication are the two important factors here. But I do think any economy which requires both spouses to work full time jobs is terribly unjust.

If the shoe were on the other foot, and it was her fiance who wanted to work a photography job, I think people would be a lot more understanding.

Really? I don’t think so. I think less than 5 hours a week together, as a couple (this is what I’m extrapolating, from the OP), is simply unacceptable.

 

[agapewolf]

Here’s a thought–if the OP is planning to be a teacher, she may wish to find some summer employment for herself. If she were to do photography gigs like the ones she’s doing, that could work out very nicely, as weddings generally happen during those summer months.

No, they don’t. Almost evenly spread through the year, with the exception of maybe February and Lent.

 

[Xantippe]

No, they don’t. Almost evenly spread through the year, with the exception of maybe February and Lent.

If that’s true for her area, that opens up the possibility that she might possibly be able to quit her retail job and just work her aide job and her photography gig.

 

[Allegra]

No, they don’t. Almost evenly spread through the year, with the exception of maybe February and Lent.

That probably depends a lot on the climate of the place where you live. Nearly every wedding I’ve attending has been in early summer or autumn. Autumn is more popular with the general population, but I’m a teacher and I have many friends who are teachers and choose the early summer for that reason.

 

[Xantippe]

In my book, financial stability and clear communication are the two important factors here. But I do think any economy which requires both spouses to work full time jobs is terribly unjust.

When you don’t have kids and are young and able-bodied, that’s not necessarily a hardship. In developed countries, isn’t it the norm for young childless marrieds to both work full-time? Not to mention that we’re actually talking about the engagement period as she’s agreed to quit the photography job after the wedding.

It is not weird for an adult unmarried woman to work a lot.

I have a lot of concerns about the “enough” because from personal experience suggests that the income that was adequate pre-kids is not going to be adequate (or even possible) once they start having children. For example, as I mentioned, I was working 3 or 4 jobs while waiting for my husband to finish grad school and get a real job and then I worked a a morning/afternoon job and a night school job once he got his real job in a different area. A couple months into that schedule, I got pregnant. Suddenly, I was queasy half the day and sleepy and exhausted the other half and working the two jobs just wasn’t feasible anymore. I gave notice for the night job and then almost immediately got laid off from my day job (it was a few months after 9/11 and business had dried up). Oops! My $300 a week (or however much I was making at the time) disappeared, way, way, way earlier than anticipated. We really, really could have used the money. Similarly, we never know when a pregnant woman might need to quit entirely because of health issues–severe morning sickness, bedrest, premature birth, etc.

The couple may be making enough to cover their basic expenses now, but nothing I’ve heard so far suggests that they are prepared for a baby or the involuntary total loss of her income. If I knew that they had a 3-6 month emergency fund, that would be different, but that seems unlikely given their age and the fact that they are just starting out and are working very basic jobs.

If they don’t have an emergency fund, that would be a very good use of this “extra” money.

 

[Luvz2travel]

I guess what I’m having trouble understanding is why you would want 3 jobs when you don’t need the money. If it’s to avoid debt and save for the wedding then yes I could understand that. I would want to be spending as much time with my partner as I could. I have 2 jobs and a house that seems like another 2 jobs to be with no me time. If you can I’d just lose the 3rd job.

 

[Kal2012]

So, let me understand, you say his love language is “quality time”, but you aren’t spending quality time together because you want to keep a third job that you don’t need?

Respectfully, this isn’t a power struggle. It’s preview of what marriage is like.

I quit a job because I never saw my boyfriend and we had a better relationship after I quit the job. Totally worth it to me/us.

A few years later, I had a very stressful job that was bringing a lot of unnecessary stress into our marriage because I was bringing a lot of that stress home with me…my husband said “you need to choose between me and the job because I’m not living like this anymore.” It was easy to choose my husband and marriage over a job.

These days, we recently moved to another city about an hour away from our old community. I loved that community. I loved the public schools. I was in a great parish community. I had some beautiful friendships up there. However, husband’s new job would be a long commute everyday and he just wasn’t willing to make it to come home and be “sir grump-a-lot” to his family in the evenings when he saw us. So, we decided that we’d move closer to his work.

We are in a nice area and the people seem nice, but it’s not really where I want to be.

The point is that we do things in our marriages for the good of the “team”. Not what’s good for one person or the other. You make the best decision that fits what each person in the relationship needs from you at present. If your bf needs you to be around more, then figure out away to be around - especially if the money isn’t really needed.

To me, it’s a no-brainer, especially if his love language is “quality time”. You make the time.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

My fiancé and I will be married on October 11th. He is the most loving, intelligent, and hardworking person I know. He brings out the best in me and encourages me to always improve, not because he is dissatisfied with how I am now, but because he wants the absolute best for me.

However, lately we have been having the same argument back and forth with no progress.

He wants me to quit one of my jobs. Currently, I work three jobs and he works two, though we usually work the same number of hours every week. We also both attend school with a full load of classes. He works 11pm-7am Sunday through Thursday at a hotel, and then about five hours at a tutoring job in the evenings. I work 6am-2pm at my retail job Monday through Thursday, then 8am-4pm on at job #2 on Fridays. My second job is as an aide at a school, so I also have training and meetings throughout the month, as well as prep time that I do off the clock. He goes to class in mornings and I go to class in the afternoons.

The past few months, I have also been spending several hours every Saturday working with my friend who is a photographer/videographer. I help him by working as a secondary shooter, by organizing his files, and by helping his events run smoothly. Usually I will get paid $100-150 for every wedding I do, and most weddings take me 7-9 hours including travel time. This is very good money for work that I genuinely enjoy. I have learned a lot about photography and video editing, and I have made a lot of extra money just in the past three months.

My fiancé really wants me to quit that photography job, though. He says we don’t need the money (which I guess we don’t) and that since Saturday is the only complete day off we have together, it would be selfish for me keep this job. When I said that I liked bringing in extra money, he said that I ought to trust him more to provide.

The first time he mentioned this, I got pretty defensive about it because I really enjoy the work itself and the paycheck that comes with it. Besides, because of his work schedule, he is usually sleeping while I am at weddings, and once he wakes up, he still has to get ready for the day be drive to my house before we can spend any quality time together. We talked a bit more about it, and while I he didn’t convince me that I should give it up entirely, I told him that after we marry on October 11th, I will give it up. I thought that was enough of a compromise and that it would give my boss time to find a replacement while the wedding season slows down. He was not satisfied with this, but refused to engage me on the question further, instead resorting to infuriating remarks like, “Whatever. You can do whatever you want.”

I am so sick of discussing this issue with him but I am really very concerned about his behavior. While I know his “love language” is definitely quality time, I find it a little ridiculous and controlling that he demands I quit this job just so he can see me for a few hours on Saturday. I know that I can be pretty stubborn and overly concerned with money sometimes, as I am an adult child of an alcoholic, but I am really having a hard time seeing his side, especially when I agreed to give up the job after our wedding date.

Do any of you guys have some advice or insight?

I have some thoughts.

1. You used the word power struggle. That is not a good thing. My wife and I can disagree, we can solve problems and we can decide what to concede or hold tight to. But we do not struggle for power. I think your view of a disagreement as a power struggle shows a certain mentality on your part.
2. He may have a little subconscience reservation and wonder how this will play out with you being a wife and mother. Conversely you might be using this as a passive aggressive way to hold on to your Independence.
3. You both need a clear picture of your finances.
4. Why on earth would you not do something simple to please your loved one. My wife and I would easily change something in a hectic schedule if it was asked by the other. My wife is pregnant with our fifth child, works full time as a scientist while I stay at home and is getting her MBA as well. So we know about schedules. And If I told her that I felt she should cut back, she would. If she told me she needed something from me, no question asked it would be done. Why are you in a power struggle over a job you do not need and letting it affect the way you feel about someone you are going to pledge your life and body to? Is there something else going on here?

 

[bstorm]

I have no answer for you, because only you can decide what to do about your job and whether your fiance’ demands are reasonable or not. But, I do believe that your current situation is a preview of things to come and you should consider carefully whether you two are ready to get married at this point or not. Believe me, these types of problems do not get better once you marry.

 

[ela2]

I would nurture the relationship with the person I’m marrying. This is such an exciting time! That should be the priority.

Calling this issue a power struggle is quite strange. You need to ask yourself as well as him quite a bit of questions.

 

[TeachertoBe]

I really appreciate the advice and suggestions you all have given. I do think that part of the reason this argument has dragged on for so long is that it has become about more than the original topic of when and if to leave my photography job. It’s become an argument about my over-concern with money, his need for more time with me, how the situation would play out if I asked him to quit a job, and both of our frustrations with or hectic schedules. When we live together, I imagine it will be much easier, but right now, he still has to go home every day to sleep and shower and do his laundry.

As for our money situation, we both work entry-level jobs. The cost of living in our city is low, possibly low enough that we could only afford to live off just his full time job if we were not in school - but not easily! Besides that, we are incurring student loan debt, and we are working towards the goal of paying off a significant amount the second we graduate - before it has accrued much interest. We have saved a lot of money and hassle by choosing cars we could only afford to buy outright, not having fancy phones, and forgoing internet access and cable at home. We both have excellent credit, but very short credit histories.

I have worked out a monthly budget to where we could survive only on he income from his full-time job, then direct deposit the income from his other job and my jobs into our savings account. We do need more than his first job can provide in order to pay off as much of our student loan debt as possible after graduation.

We have finished paying for our wedding expenses, but we need to have extra to use in case we are surprised by a pregnancy. We also need to be working towards saving an emergency fund. Currently we have enough to live on for about 2 months, but I would prefer to have more.

My fiancé has at this point dropped the issue and said that it is up to me, but I get the feeling that he is very disappointed that I want to continue working on my Saturdays until the wedding. He isn’t being rude about it, but he doesn’t want to discuss the issue further.

It bothers me that he is still peeved by this, because we are not yet married, and I have already made a significant compromise for him. I don’t know if it will be discussed further, and I am not sure that I want to keep talking about it!

Still, I have a decision to make. I would appreciate your advice and prayers while I consider the options.