Practical aspects of wearing a habit

[Poor_Clare_tobe]

*I am sure there will always be communities who wear habits and some that do not.

When I was part of a founding group of third order Franciscans [in the early 80s] we of course had to design a habit. [we had already chosen as part of our constitutions to be a habited community]

We chose a short modified veil and for those of us professed sisters we wore black [but had the option to change to white when some of us worked with children on a hot playground in 100+ degree heat] Our habit was essentially a grey jumper with a white blouse or turtle neck sweater depending on the weather. If on our sunday afternoons off… if we were out as a group we would remove our bib and veil but keep them in the car as we had pagers that might call us back to our shelter or on a domestic violence call so we if that happened we would put our veils back on and our bibs and off we went.

We did not wear street clothes. The material was washable and easy to iron. Again as you can see some on the forums prefer communities with habits some without. Each has their own charism and rules and constitutions. Each attacts women or men based on community or apostolate of way of life.

[The Poor Clare Community I shall be entering also wears a modified habit and veil]

I think that questions such as the ones that started the thread are somewhat natural ones? Whom else does one ask things such as:

Was it difficult to wear? Or uncomfortable? etc. Isn’t it nice to have a forum such as this to explore various aspects of Religious life?

Blessings of Peace and All Good!*

 

[JReducation]

To me, as a religious man who wears a habit, the question about habits is sometimes baffling. The habit is not something that we ever discuss in our community or that we give much thought to. It’s been around for 800 years. We have different colors and cuts, depending on the origins of the obedience to which you belong. But even that is not a big deal to us.

We just had our Chapter of Mats in Assisi. There were 1800 Franciscans from all the obdiences. Of course there were many versions of the Franciscan habit, including religious with no habit. It never really crossed our minds until we saw the pictures.

I began to laugh when I saw the pics. I said to myself, “I wonder if St. Francis would recognize us?” The reason for my question is because none of our habits remotely resemble the original habit worn by St. Francis and our first brothers. Most people would not feel very comfortable with a group of men exhibiting their hairy legs. The original habit was not long enough to cover the brother’s leg. It stopped just about mid-calf. The brothers did not wear pants under it, nor socks and shoes to cover their legs and feet.

It was later that the Church imposed the long tunic for the sake of modesty. Also the original habit was gray, but a shade of gray similar to dirty dishwater. There is still one left on display at the Basilica of St. Francis in Assisi.

The habit that most people recognize as Franciscan was designed by Pope Leo XIII during his pontificate when he restructured the entire Franciscan family, leaving only the Conventual Franciscans, Capuchin Franciscans and Secular Franciscans as they were originally founded by St. Francis. None of them wear the “traditional” Franciscan habit. The “traditional” Franciscan habit is less about 100 years old and the order is 800 years old.

Maybe that’s why it’s not such a big deal to this Franciscan. It is what it is, a habit. I’m comfortable in mine, because it’s very simple. I just throw it over my head and out the door I go. LOOK MA’ NO PANTS!

Br. JR, OSF

 

[albertziggy]

To me, as a religious man who wears a habit, the question about habits is sometimes baffling. The habit is not something that we ever discuss in our community or that we give much thought to. It’s been around for 800 years. We have different colors and cuts, depending on the origins of the obedience to which you belong. But even that is not a big deal to us.

We just had our Chapter of Mats in Assisi. There were 1800 Franciscans from all the obdiences. Of course there were many versions of the Franciscan habit, including religious with no habit. It never really crossed our minds until we saw the pictures.

I began to laugh when I saw the pics. I said to myself, “I wonder if St. Francis would recognize us?” The reason for my question is because none of our habits remotely resemble the original habit worn by St. Francis and our first brothers. Most people would not feel very comfortable with a group of men exhibiting their hairy legs. The original habit was not long enough to cover the brother’s leg. It stopped just about mid-calf. The brothers did not wear pants under it, nor socks and shoes to cover their legs and feet.

It was later that the Church imposed the long tunic for the sake of modesty. Also the original habit was gray, but a shade of gray similar to dirty dishwater. There is still one left on display at the Basilica of St. Francis in Assisi.

The habit that most people recognize as Franciscan was designed by Pope Leo XIII during his pontificate when he restructured the entire Franciscan family, leaving only the Conventual Franciscans, Capuchin Franciscans and Secular Franciscans as they were originally founded by St. Francis. None of them wear the “traditional” Franciscan habit. The “traditional” Franciscan habit is less about 100 years old and the order is 800 years old.

Maybe that’s why it’s not such a big deal to this Franciscan. It is what it is, a habit. I’m comfortable in mine, because it’s very simple. I just throw it over my head and out the door I go. LOOK MA’ NO PANTS!

Br. JR, OSF

Thanks, Br. JR for giving us the historical background of the Franciscan habit. I guess for most Secular Franciscans nowadays, this does not have much significance, as we only have the Tau suspended around our necks.

albertziggy

 

[JReducation]

Thanks, Br. JR for giving us the historical background of the Franciscan habit. I guess for most Secular Franciscans nowadays, this does not have much significance, as we only have the Tau suspended around our necks.

albertziggy

I know. Our community was founded by three SFOs. We love the SFO very much. It’s our mother. There was an SFO habit. It was very similar to what we wear, but without a capuche. The SFO has been the mother to many Franciscan congregations. They are a great order. I would like to see them return to some kind of dress code.

There is a tendency in some secular orders to get stuck at Vatican II. The focus of the reform of secular orders was to ensure that the Gospel was taken into the secular world through secular means by secular men and women, not to secularize the orders. Some people have trouble with the difference. This is true about many secular orders, not just the SFO. Nonetheless, they are great orders and have made important contributions to the Church. As I said, we owe them our origins.

Br. JR, OSF

 

[albertziggy]

I know. Our community was founded by three SFOs. We love the SFO very much. It’s our mother. There was an SFO habit. It was very similar to what we wear, but without a capuche. The SFO has been the mother to many Franciscan congregations. They are a great order. I would like to see them return to some kind of dress code.

There is a tendency in some secular orders to get stuck at Vatican II. The focus of the reform of secular orders was to ensure that the Gospel was taken into the secular world through secular means by secular men and women, not to secularize the orders. Some people have trouble with the difference. This is true about many secular orders, not just the SFO. Nonetheless, they are great orders and have made important contributions to the Church. As I said, we owe them our origins.

Br. JR, OSF

I agree. I wish we could have some kind of dress code. When we go to a gathering, we do not have a physical identity to speak of. Even our Tau’s get lost in the clothes we wear.
I am thinking of introducing that idea in my area, but I am doing it slowly. Some people who were ‘stuck with Vatican II’ seem hostile to the idea at the moment. I am hoping the newer generation will be a lot kinder with the idea though (even to the extent of bringing the old habit back again). I am for that!

What’s more, looking at the secular orders from a distance, they seem as different as a Big Mac is from the Burger King! It is only when you go deeper into the Rules that you see some uniqueness say, a Secular Franciscan from a lay Dominican.

albertziggy

 

[JReducation]

I agree. I wish we could have some kind of dress code. When we go to a gathering, we do not have a physical identity to speak of. Even our Tau’s get lost in the clothes we wear.
I am thinking of introducing that idea in my area, but I am doing it slowly. Some people who were ‘stuck with Vatican II’ seem hostile to the idea at the moment. I am hoping the newer generation will be a lot kinder with the idea though (even to the extent of bringing the old habit back again). I am for that!

What’s more, looking at the secular orders from a distance, they seem as different as a Big Mac is from the Burger King! It is only when you go deeper into the Rules that you see some uniqueness say, a Secular Franciscan from a lay Dominican.

albertziggy

I don’t know about the other religious families, but you can’t reintroduce the traditional habit into the Secular Franciscan Order, because it is forbidden by the Constitutions. However, there is no rule about an individual having a dress code for himself or herself.

What happened to many orders, not just the secular orders, was that in the process of returning to the roots, they tried to go back into history. That was not the idea. The idea was to go back to the mission, vision, and charism of the founders and live it in today’s world.

Because many orders did not have habits when they were founded and later adopted them, many people thought that this meant to abandon them. This was not the direction of Perfectae Caritatis at all.

The direction was to recover those elements that I have already said and build on them. The habits were to be modified to allow the religious to spend more time living the charism of the founder and less time on the externals. There was no mention of eliminating them.

Does this help?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Poor_Clare_tobe]

To me, as a religious man who wears a habit, the question about habits is sometimes baffling. The habit is not something that we ever discuss in our community or that we give much thought to. It’s been around for 800 years. We have different colors and cuts, depending on the origins of the obedience to which you belong. But even that is not a big deal to us.

We just had our Chapter of Mats in Assisi. There were 1800 Franciscans from all the obdiences. Of course there were many versions of the Franciscan habit, including religious with no habit. It never really crossed our minds until we saw the pictures.

I began to laugh when I saw the pics. I said to myself, “I wonder if St. Francis would recognize us?” The reason for my question is because none of our habits remotely resemble the original habit worn by St. Francis and our first brothers. Most people would not feel very comfortable with a group of men exhibiting their hairy legs. The original habit was not long enough to cover the brother’s leg. It stopped just about mid-calf. The brothers did not wear pants under it, nor socks and shoes to cover their legs and feet.

It was later that the Church imposed the long tunic for the sake of modesty. Also the original habit was gray, but a shade of gray similar to dirty dishwater. There is still one left on display at the Basilica of St. Francis in Assisi.

The habit that most people recognize as Franciscan was designed by Pope Leo XIII during his pontificate when he restructured the entire Franciscan family, leaving only the Conventual Franciscans, Capuchin Franciscans and Secular Franciscans as they were originally founded by St. Francis. None of them wear the “traditional” Franciscan habit. The “traditional” Franciscan habit is less about 100 years old and the order is 800 years old.

Maybe that’s why it’s not such a big deal to this Franciscan. It is what it is, a habit. I’m comfortable in mine, because it’s very simple. I just throw it over my head and out the door I go. LOOK MA’ NO PANTS!

Br. JR, OSF

Thank You JR…
It is always an education when you come on line to share some Franciscan history. Perhaps if you time and health permits you might share some of the events from “the chapter of mats”
Blessings of peace and all good!

 

[albertziggy]

I don’t know about the other religious families, but you can’t reintroduce the traditional habit into the Secular Franciscan Order, because it is forbidden by the Constitutions. However, there is no rule about an individual having a dress code for himself or herself.

What happened to many orders, not just the secular orders, was that in the process of returning to the roots, they tried to go back into history. That was not the idea. The idea was to go back to the mission, vision, and charism of the founders and live it in today’s world.

Because many orders did not have habits when they were founded and later adopted them, many people thought that this meant to abandon them. This was not the direction of Perfectae Caritatis at all.

The direction was to recover those elements that I have already said and build on them. The habits were to be modified to allow the religious to spend more time living the charism of the founder and less time on the externals. There was no mention of eliminating them.

Does this help?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Hi Br. JR

Thank you very much for your reply. It helped a lot. I agree with you on all points. We still have a lot to go recover the elements you mentioned, as the ‘dust has yet to settle’. I am sure that the new generation will bring the newer springtime to our Order. As for the habit, it is just a tiny item in all the elements. (I guess on of the bigger items is convincing ourselves that we are an Order not just a parish organization, and our members should treat it as it should be, then the ‘dress code issue’ will be one of the results.)

Regards,

albertziggy

 

[JReducation]

This morning I had a very experience regarding the habit. I went to a parish to give a talk to a women’s cell group. As I was staning waiting for the meeting to begin, I suddenly heard a woman’s voice call my name from behind me.

As I turned, the woman said, “You’re Brother JR, aren’t you?” To which I responded in the affirmative.

She said, “You don’t remember me, but you taught my brothers and me when we were in high school. You were also our principal.” Then she reminded me of the school and their names. I recalled the names. This was in 1980.

She continued, “I have always remembered you, because I always remember you walking down the hall in your gray habit. You never knew it, but to us high school students, seeing a brother walking down the hall in the Franciscan habit gave us a sense of warmth and joy that we have never forgetten. Thanks to that experience, my brothers and I are still Catholic.”

I was very happy to see her and happy that my presence in the school had done some good, without ever saying a word.

I guess there is a practical reason for wearing a habit.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Provigil]

Dear Ruslan:

With regards to wearing a religiouas habit, I can’t speak for the nun’s, but when I was a Franciscan Brother, we had to wear those wool habits even when we taught. For me it was miserable because I cannot tolerlate any hot. But it was a sacrifices.

Now with the sisters, I would say 99% do not wear habits, even the cloistered ones.

If they have listened to the Pope when he says to MODIFY your habit, not wear street clothes, they would have looked like a religious amd represented Christ.

I remember I had a friend who was an Ursuline nun and her mother passed away; as the sisters were getting into the car, they all took off their veils.

Our sisters come from Italy and are the only sisters who wear tradition habits; even the Poor CLare Nuns wear street clothing.

Out DRE is a Note Dame SIster; no habitl she lives in an apartmentl and ownes her own car. I personally think this is wrong because where is the community living? She can come anmd go as she pleases I perceive it as NON-Religious living. They could have worn a short veil and a dress. This sister wears pieced earrings, flashy tops, and ALWAYS SLACKS, NEVER A DRESS. If she wants to be on her own, than I would just quit the Order and continue to do the same kind of work.

God bless those sisters who had to wear a starch cardboard on their head, all ears covered. We had the Dominican Sisters of Adrian, Mi, but now they all wear street clothes.

They also have lost RESPECT, I realize the HABIT doesn’t make the person, but than again it is a witness for Christ.

May Almighty God bless you.
PROVIGIL

 

[pamkowal]

I, too, have sometimes thought about the practical and symbolic aspects of wearing a habit. To me, donning a habit (whether it be the formal, floor-length, layered and veiled type) or the modified habit that is knee length with a short, lightweight veil is a lovely outer gesture of commitment to and reminder of one’s inner yearning for God. Although I am not in a religious order, I always wondered where I could get an authentic sewing pattern for a habit like Ingrid Bergman wore in The Bells of St. Mary movie. Anyone have any ideas?

 

[JReducation]

I, too, have sometimes thought about the practical and symbolic aspects of wearing a habit. To me, donning a habit (whether it be the formal, floor-length, layered and veiled type) or the modified habit that is knee length with a short, lightweight veil is a lovely outer gesture of commitment to and reminder of one’s inner yearning for God. Although I am not in a religious order, I always wondered where I could get an authentic sewing pattern for a habit like Ingrid Bergman wore in The Bells of St. Mary movie. Anyone have any ideas?

Ingrid Bergman’s habit in the Bells of St. Mary is a very easy habit to make. It’s a pleated top that goes down to the hips, with a matching pleated skirt to the floor. The guimp is a simple piece of linen cut in semi-circular pattern to form a collar and the coif is a piece of cloth with an opening on the front to poke your face through and you fasten it on the back with ties or velcro. The bandeu is just plastic or linen that wraps around the head like a crown. It has two veils, a white under veil that is short and a long outer veil.

It is also a very difficult habit to maintain unless you like ironing pleats. You have to remember, these old habits often had another layer of skirts under the outer layer. If you see pleats on a habit, they usually come from France or Northern Europe. They were very warm, because of the weather in the homeland.

I’m a brother, but if I were a sister, I’d go for the simpler version like the habit worn by the Franciscan Sisters of the Renewal (CFR).

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[koolmom21]

I left the convent many years ago but I was in a community that you could chose to wear the modified habit or street clothes. One reason for wearing the habit was so men would not think you were available. Even a wedding band would not stop some people from hitting on you. Not all men think to look for a wedding band. They would feel really bad after you tell them you are a nun.They felt like they did something wrong and this made me feel sorry for them. Not to mention that being a nun and not wearing the habit, people would later find out that I was a nun and they would come across like I was spying on them or something. Not in a mean way but like they were embarrassed for something they might have said. I came to the conclusion that all religious should wear some kind of outward sign of their calling.

 

[albertziggy]

I was very happy to see her and happy that my presence in the school had done some good, without ever saying a word.

I guess there is a practical reason for wearing a habit.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Hi Bro Jr.

It is so nice to hear stories like yours. I am just wondering how people like us in the secular orders would make our presence felt and get the right results. Any suggestions? Of course without the habit, there would be a different approach.

One time at the office, a trainee thought I was a ‘Franciscan Friar employee’. He was not obviously aware about the roles of religious and laity. He was totally unaware of the secular orders, so he needed a lot of orientation to get the idea right. It was amusing though.

By the way, I think members of the religious orders should wear their habits when they are in public. That way, we would not be mistaken as regular religious brothers/priests. I, for one, am often mistaken as a priest.

albertziggy

 

[JReducation]

Hi Bro Jr.

It is so nice to hear stories like yours. I am just wondering how people like us in the secular orders would make our presence felt and get the right results. Any suggestions? Of course without the habit, there would be a different approach.

One time at the office, a trainee thought I was a ‘Franciscan Friar employee’. He was not obviously aware about the roles of religious and laity. He was totally unaware of the secular orders, so he needed a lot of orientation to get the idea right. It was amusing though.

By the way, I think members of the religious orders should wear their habits when they are in public. That way, we would not be mistaken as regular religious brothers/priests. I, for one, am often mistaken as a priest.

albertziggy

There is nothing wrong with being mistaken. The original Brothers and Sisters of Penance wore a habit. The Friars have always worn a habit and there is no difference in the habit of the ordained and the lay brother. They are all brothers. I don’t mean spiritual brothers to each other, but religious brothers.

One thing that people don’t often understand about some religious communities, such as Benedictines and Franciscans is that they are communities of religious brothers; therefore, there is no reason to have two different habits. It’s not practical, because the community was not founded around the priesthood, but around the religious life. Secular priests joined the order to be religious brothers. They left their dioceses because they wanted to walk in the footsteps of Christ under the guidance of Benedict or Francis of Assisi.

In both cases, there was no need for a distinct habit for the clerical brother and the lay brother. There was no practical reason, because those whom the brothers met were to see in them Christ, not a priest or a lay man.

As to the secular orders, let us remember that they are not lay orders. That is a misnomer. They are secular. There is a big difference between secular and lay. Lay is anyone who is not a deacon, priest or bishop. A religious brother, a religious sister, a nun is a lay person.

Secular is anyone who is not a consecrated religious. That can be a person in private vows, a married person, a single person, a deacon, priest or bishop or a hermit. Our Holy Father Pope Benedict is a secular man. He is not a consecrated religious. He is not in perpetual vows and a member of a religious community, nor has he ever been. He has always been a secular priest.

To answer your question, I’ll will send you a PM, because that’s a topic that has nothing to do with habits.

By the way, many secular institutes do have habits. There is no reason that a secular order cannot have a habit. They are canonically established orders with a rule, a profession and vows. The choice not to wear a traditional habit is the choice of the order, not the choice of the Church.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[JACQUE_D]

I thought the sisters wore their habit as a covering, as per St Paul’s letter to the Corinthians. A woman should not prophesy without her head covered. I still cover my head in church, and so does my young daughter. I wish they would wear them more often. aia feel a huge sense of comfort and pride when I see one of our hard working sisters. I am afraid that the sisters who donot cover are not recognisable and are not respected in public as they are deseved. Even our priests who donot wear the collar are passed over and many opportunaties for people aproaching them in public for guidance, are lost.
:tiphat:

 

[JReducation]

I thought the sisters wore their habit as a covering, as per St Paul’s letter to the Corinthians. A woman should not prophesy without her head covered.

Not at all. There are several religious communities that were founded where the sisters never wore veils or head covering. I’m thinking of two groups that come to my mind: 1) Parish Visitors and 2) Missionaries of the Blessed Trinity. These sisters never covered their head. There were others in other countries. These were founded in the USA in the early 1900s.

Sisters and nuns wore veils, because they were the typical dress of the women of their time and place where they were founded. Today it has become a part of the habit. For example, our holy mother Clare did not wear a habit per se. She wore the clothing of the peasant woman of her time. Her veil and head covering was very different from what our Franciscan and Poor Clare sisters and nuns wear today.

Mother Teresa’s Missionaries of Charity wear an Indian apparel, because Mother heard Christ call her to found an Indian society.

Each community wore what the founder felt was appropriate. It had nothing to do with Paul.

I am afraid that the sisters who donot cover are not recognisable and are not respected in public as they are deseved. Even our priests who donot wear the collar are passed over and many opportunaties for people aproaching them in public for guidance, are lost.
:tiphat:

Religious do not seek respect because we are religious. We expect respect because all of us are sons and daughters of the Father. We do not wear our habit in public to be respected, but to proclaim a mystery, the crucifixion of our Lord Jesus Christ.

There are also times when we may want to go through the streets and be anonymous. Like every human being, there are times when we need to be alone and need silence. It can be very good to walk the streets or the country lane and be alone with your thoughts. At those times, you do not want people to approach you. A habit is a flag that singles you out and there may be a time, when you need to be alone with God, even in the middle of a crowd.

This is a very delicate balance that priests and religious men and women have to deal with on a daily basis.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Sancta_Rosa]

In terms of practical clothing I’ve found that wearing a long near ankle length denim jumper that buttons up the front over the top of a blue polo necked Tee shirt with long sleeves makes a perfect ‘habit’ for me as I go about my daily tasks. When working in the garden or at a little woodwork or household repairs a plain cotton or canvas pinafore apron helps to protect my clothes. Even before I heeded the call to devote my life to prayer for those who are suffering and are at the point of death I covered my head and dressed modestly according to Corinthians 1.11. I wear a Tiechel scarf over a cotton coif and I find this to be entirely practical.
Up until now I’ve been able to find my clothing needs at the local church shops because I’ve made a private vow not to buy any brand new clothing except for underpants and socks, but recently I was able to buy some very good quality plain blue double sheets at a Salvation Army store and I intend to sew myself something very simple and modest to serve me as a Spring and Summer months garment.
As an ex-social worker who used to work with the mentally ill I smoked like a chimney and it was dressing modestly in my ‘habit’ that enabled me to give up tobacco. By putting on my plain and simple modest garments I believe that I was saying, ‘I’m yours Lord+’, and smoking just simply couldn’t be a part of that.
I live in a small rural town and I’m always dressed plain and simple with my Crucifix around my neck and my Rosary about my person somewhere. Folk around here know I’m committed to serving Christ+ and strangers in town never seem to have any difficulty recognising it either when they see me. I don’t believe in being ‘off-duty’ nor would I shed my Tiechel and coif during my waking hours. People often approach me to ask for prayers or simply because they need to speak to someone about something that’s troubling them.
And yes I do find traditional Religious habits fascinating and I as much as anyone marvel at the meanings behind the colours and what each part symbolises & etc, but I could not wear one. The sheer cost of the material and all the incredible hand tailoring alone puts me off. Denim or cotton or canvas is the new black as far as I’m concerned when it comes to cothing.

 

[Sancta_Rosa]

Well I received my newly made pale sky blue simple hermit’s habit in time to wear it to Mass for the first time this Sunday. It’s very plain, made from the cheapest and most durable fabric I could find and very much like the female Dominican habit with a cowl over the shoulders. I have a hood on my habit because I am a hermit, but I still wear a simple coif and a tiechel scarf to cover my hair as usual.
Fasting from midnight certainly prevents awful breakfast stains from being attracted to all that pale sky blue before going to Mass, but I found myself becoming slightly paranoid that I was going to brush up against something grubby before I left my little cottage to walk up to the parish church.
Ah, walking in all that ankle length pale blue over a damp, muddy in places and mossy path; - now there’s an art. Did I mention that I walk with a stick as well? Fortunately a couple of years of long skirt wearing while discerning had put me in good practice for keeping my pristine hem clear of muck. Deo Gratias, I didn’t miss my step or get tangled in my tunic, or have anybody step on my hem while I was under the church roof. And best of all I was able to slip away quietly back to my little cottage after Mass without anybody passing comment in my hearing about my changed mode of dress.
Today finds me back in second hand denim as I scrape out the fireplace and dump the ashes, do the washing and hang it out, bring firewood up and stack it at the back door; - and all those other Monday household tasks that are a part of my routine. While working I found myself wondering how those Religious who wore either white or pale coloured habits managed to keep them clean!

 

[seremina]

Sancta Rosa,

I’d appreciate a little guidance. What fabrics are good for what seasons? I don’t know this information, I’m afraid. I’ve always judged by weight, not by fabric. But for habit-shopping, I clearly need to shop by fabric. So would you write up a little chart for me? I can copy it onto e-paper or paper.

You mention long-sleeved polo shirts. Are those better as undershirts for jumpers? I’m having a LOT of trouble finding modest, plain, no-text shirts that aren’t hoodies. Hoodies aren’t so bad, but I’ve never seen a summer one.