Praise Music Used in The Catholic Church

[10thCrusader]

This is a weird question for the traditional Catholic forum. In fact, it is a strawman. I bet Worship and Praise music is never used in conjuction with the Extraordinary Form of the Mass. So who cares? Else where, such decisions are left to the authority that is locally present and aware of the needs of the parish where the Mass is. For something like a Charismatic Mass, then it might be more impropriate than Gregorian Chant.

I attend the Extraordinary Form of the Mass exclusively, and the music there is Gregorian chant and Renaissance polyphony with some Baroque Latin hymns thrown in from time to time.

We have an English hymn at the closing, but it’s generally the most traditional thing we can dredge out of the most traditional hymnal in the church (always something from the 19th century or earlier).

Here is an example of the music at our church:
youtube.com/watch?v=d6S1GEh_xOw

I defy anything found in OCP to beat that (and the sound quality on the recording isn’t that good).

The only question I would ask about the music I have observed sung in the OF, why do they keep the most theologically problematic, compositionally awful, and lyrically trivial ditties for the communion hymn? What is wrong with something like* At the Lamb’s High Feast* or Let All mortal Flesh Keep Silence?

And if you want to get adventurous, even the children at the Latin Mass can sing Adoro Te Devote.

 

[10thCrusader]

I’ve always found it odd that music composed between 1000 and 1700 years after the Death of Christ is treated to be the only acceptable music for Catholic worship. As for GIA and Marty Haugen: They have some good ones. I’m a big fan of “up from the waters” and “Stand firm”. personal opinion.

But I think this highlights a different issue: Why do Catholics have so little place for praise? Maybe the eucharist and praise are incompatible. So why don’t we have wednesday, or saturday afternoon, or sunday afternoon praise services?

Even though I attend the EF Mass and don’t want anything sung at Mass post-19th century, I actually think this would be a great idea. As a convert, the Regular Baptist roots from my father’s side introduced me to some wonderful hymns (“When the Roll is called Up yonder”, “The God of the Mountain”, etc.) that might be wholly inappropriate for Mass, but might be great for a joyful get-together of hymn-singing.

Of course if it’s a bunch of stuff from OCP, I’d probably pass. They’re probably OK for some people, but to me they just sound like something you’d hear on Barney & Friends…

 

[agapewolf]

People are mixing and matching genres here and they are separate things.

the Schutte/hagen/haas/jesuit music is NOT in any way praise and worship music

Praise and worship is not Christian rock. there might be a few songs crossover, but mostly they are completely different musical styles.

Praise and worship musically has more aspects similar to chant than the 4 part hymns such as Holy God we praise thy name. Long tones, simple, scriptural, and repetitive.

 

[buc_fan33]

I’ve been wanting to respond to this thread for quite some time, but have held off until now. So, here goes…

First, let me say that I don’t personally like Gregorian chant all that much. Personally, far from moving me to pray and contemplation, it tends to put me to sleep. I don’t mean that as a critique against anyone who does like it. That’s fine. But, it’s just not my personal cup of tea.

Second, I do enjoy contemporary Christian music that you would hear on KLOVE, for example. Some of these artists include Chris Tomlin, Newsboys, Third Day, Mercy Me, David Crowder Band, and Matt Maher, just to name a few.

But, here’s the problem I have. Many people want to decry the latter as being profane, non-Biblical, and not conducive to fostering prayer and worship. However, this does not seem to match with experience. I’ve also seen critiques that these are Protestant hymns. I’d like to address each of these concerns.

1. The music is profane. This does not seem to me to be a fair assessment. Let me just take one song that comes to mind, Christ is Risen by Matt Maher. The lyrics of the refrain go like this:

Christ is risen from the dead, trampling over death by death,
Come awake, come awake, come and rise up from the grave.

Now, this is not strictly speaking Biblical, but it is a paraphrase on 1 Corinthians 15. It also, if I recall correctly, is taken from a Byzantine anaphora. So, what, exactly, is profane about this? These lyrics are a far cry from AC/DC, Metallica, or Journey, which I think we all can agree is secular and profane music.

In fact, I used Jason Gray’s song, Remind me Who I Am, as the starting point for a homily I gave at the beginning of Lent last year. The point of the homily being that Lent, like the theme of the song, is intended to remind us who we are as baptized sons and daughters of our Heavenly Father.

1. The music is Protestant. True. Some of it is. For what it’s worth, Matt Maher is a devout Catholic. But, that’s beside the point. He’s about the only one on the contemporary Christian scene. The point I want to make, and this would apply by extension to many hymns that are sung, for instance from the Adoremus hymnal, which is my personal favorite as far as hymnals go, is that just because something is Protestant does not de facto and by definition make it bad. Remember, whatever is true in Protestantism is by definition Catholic.

Take, for instance, Chris Tomlin’s song, Whom Shall I Fear, which is very popular right now. I’ve included a link to the lyrics, and I would invite anyone to find anything heretical in them.

elyrics.net/read/c/chris-tomlin-lyrics/whom-shall-i-fear-lyrics.html

1. Third and finally, I want to address the complaint that is often made that these contemporary songs do not foster prayer or reverence, and thus are not fit for worship.

I think we know something by its fruit. I am a big fan of Steubenville youth conferences. I’ve gone five years in a row as a chaperone. I have seen thousands of young men and women be won for Christ at these conferences. Obviously, this is not primarily because of the music which these conferences employ. But, I would suggest that the music does not hurt. On any event, for what it’s worth, the bishops of these dioceses allow it, and many of these bishops, for instance, Archbishop Charles Chaput, can be called anything but liturgical Iiberals.

I can tell you that as a priest, without a doubt the most powerful, well-examined confessions I hear are at Steubenville conferences. These conferences are contributing to thousands of priestly and religious vocations throughout the United States and Canada. Yet, we want to squash that in, what appears to me, to be a game we play to try to prove who is the most conservative, who is the most traditional, who is the most orthodox.

In my parish, I will welcome any music that leads people closer to a personal encounter with the Person of Jesus Christ. If that means using Gregorian chant at Mass because that genre of music helps some of my parishioners go deeper in prayer, then by all means, lets use it. If Matt Maher or Hillsong can bring the youth of my parish deeper in relationship with Christ then their music is welcome as well.

I think it’s good to strive for the ideal, but we have to be realistic as well. Steubenville conferences sell out in hours and bring in tens of thousands of youth. Mass is not entertainment, but sometimes people need to be entertained in order to first be won for Christ. Lets not forget that.

 

[agapewolf]

I’ve been wanting to respond to this thread for quite some time, but have held off until now. So, here goes…

First, let me say that I don’t personally like Gregorian chant all that much. Personally, far from moving me to pray and contemplation, it tends to put me to sleep. I don’t mean that as a critique against anyone who does like it. That’s fine. But, it’s just not my personal cup of tea.

Second, I do enjoy contemporary Christian music that you would hear on KLOVE, for example. Some of these artists include Chris Tomlin, Newsboys, Third Day, Mercy Me, David Crowder Band, and Matt Maher, just to name a few.

But, here’s the problem I have. Many people want to decry the latter as being profane, non-Biblical, and not conducive to fostering prayer and worship. However, this does not seem to match with experience. I’ve also seen critiques that these are Protestant hymns. I’d like to address each of these concerns.

1. The music is profane. This does not seem to me to be a fair assessment. Let me just take one song that comes to mind, Christ is Risen by Matt Maher. The lyrics of the refrain go like this:

Christ is risen from the dead, trampling over death by death,
Come awake, come awake, come and rise up from the grave.

Now, this is not strictly speaking Biblical, but it is a paraphrase on 1 Corinthians 15. It also, if I recall correctly, is taken from a Byzantine anaphora. So, what, exactly, is profane about this? These lyrics are a far cry from AC/DC, Metallica, or Journey, which I think we all can agree is secular and profane music.

In fact, I used Jason Gray’s song, Remind me Who I Am, as the starting point for a homily I gave at the beginning of Lent last year. The point of the homily being that Lent, like the theme of the song, is intended to remind us who we are as baptized sons and daughters of our Heavenly Father.

1. The music is Protestant. True. Some of it is. For what it’s worth, Matt Maher is a devout Catholic. But, that’s beside the point. He’s about the only one on the contemporary Christian scene. The point I want to make, and this would apply by extension to many hymns that are sung, for instance from the Adoremus hymnal, which is my personal favorite as far as hymnals go, is that just because something is Protestant does not de facto and by definition make it bad. Remember, whatever is true in Protestantism is by definition Catholic.

Take, for instance, Chris Tomlin’s song, Whom Shall I Fear, which is very popular right now. I’ve included a link to the lyrics, and I would invite anyone to find anything heretical in them.

elyrics.net/read/c/chris-tomlin-lyrics/whom-shall-i-fear-lyrics.html

1. Third and finally, I want to address the complaint that is often made that these contemporary songs do not foster prayer or reverence, and thus are not fit for worship.

I think we know something by its fruit. I am a big fan of Steubenville youth conferences. I’ve gone five years in a row as a chaperone. I have seen thousands of young men and women be won for Christ at these conferences. Obviously, this is not primarily because of the music which these conferences employ. But, I would suggest that the music does not hurt. On any event, for what it’s worth, the bishops of these dioceses allow it, and many of these bishops, for instance, Archbishop Charles Chaput, can be called anything but liturgical Iiberals.

I can tell you that as a priest, without a doubt the most powerful, well-examined confessions I hear are at Steubenville conferences. These conferences are contributing to thousands of priestly and religious vocations throughout the United States and Canada. Yet, we want to squash that in, what appears to me, to be a game we play to try to prove who is the most conservative, who is the most traditional, who is the most orthodox.

In my parish, I will welcome any music that leads people closer to a personal encounter with the Person of Jesus Christ. If that means using Gregorian chant at Mass because that genre of music helps some of my parishioners go deeper in prayer, then by all means, lets use it. If Matt Maher or Hillsong can bring the youth of my parish deeper in relationship with Christ then their music is welcome as well.

I think it’s good to strive for the ideal, but we have to be realistic as well. Steubenville conferences sell out in hours and bring in tens of thousands of youth. Mass is not entertainment, but sometimes people need to be entertained in order to first be won for Christ. Lets not forget that.

Agreed. Every year at the St. Louis Steubenville, we have several bishops. One particular weekend a couple years ago-- we had 4 bishops. FOUR. at one conference. and they come back.

A couple years, Archsbishop Burke came.

 

[buc_fan33]

Agreed. Every year at the St. Louis Steubenville, we have several bishops. One particular weekend a couple years ago-- we had 4 bishops. FOUR. at one conference. and they come back.

A couple years, Archsbishop Burke came.

I’m pretty sure I was at that one. I go to Steubie Mid-America every year. This year, we’re hoping to take around 400 youth from our small, rural Midwestern diocese.

 

[agapewolf]

I’m pretty sure I was at that one. I go to Steubie Mid-America every year. This year, we’re hoping to take around 400 youth from our small, rural Midwestern diocese.

I play piano.

 

[buc_fan33]

I play piano.

For the band? Dude! You guys rock! Adam Bitter is fantastic! I love how you always open up Saturday evening with Living on a Prayer, and Don’t Stop Believing. It really gets the youth fired up and engaged before adoration.

 

[agapewolf]

For the band? Dude! You guys rock! Adam Bitter is fantastic! I love how you always open up Saturday evening with Living on a Prayer, and Don’t Stop Believing. It really gets the youth fired up and engaged before adoration.

I’m a dudette. But thank you!

 

[10thCrusader]

I think it’s good to strive for the ideal, but we have to be realistic as well. Steubenville conferences sell out in hours and bring in tens of thousands of youth. Mass is not entertainment, but sometimes people need to be entertained in order to first be won for Christ. Lets not forget that.

I thought they just came to see Scott Hahn. That’s why most of the people I know went to Steubenville. Maybe the music is just his warm-up band.

 

[buc_fan33]

I thought they just came to see Scott Hahn. That’s why most of the people I know went to Steubenville. Maybe the music is just his warm-up band.

Personally, I’ve never been to a conference where Dr. Hahn has given one of the keynotes. I don’t think youth ministry is really his thing. I have heard him speak frequently at FOCUS conferences, however.

 

[buc_fan33]

I’m a dudette. But thank you!

Yes! I remember now! Still, your band rocks. The Mid-America conference is not geographically the closest conference for us. But, we come to it in large part because of your band. The location is also very nice, but you guys are outstanding!

 

[Cat]

I’ve been wanting to respond to this thread for quite some time, but have held off until now. So, here goes…

First, let me say that I don’t personally like Gregorian chant all that much. Personally, far from moving me to pray and contemplation, it tends to put me to sleep. I don’t mean that as a critique against anyone who does like it. That’s fine. But, it’s just not my personal cup of tea.

Second, I do enjoy contemporary Christian music that you would hear on KLOVE, for example. Some of these artists include Chris Tomlin, Newsboys, Third Day, Mercy Me, David Crowder Band, and Matt Maher, just to name a few.

But, here’s the problem I have. Many people want to decry the latter as being profane, non-Biblical, and not conducive to fostering prayer and worship. However, this does not seem to match with experience. I’ve also seen critiques that these are Protestant hymns. I’d like to address each of these concerns.

1. The music is profane. This does not seem to me to be a fair assessment. Let me just take one song that comes to mind, Christ is Risen by Matt Maher. The lyrics of the refrain go like this:

Christ is risen from the dead, trampling over death by death,
Come awake, come awake, come and rise up from the grave.

Now, this is not strictly speaking Biblical, but it is a paraphrase on 1 Corinthians 15. It also, if I recall correctly, is taken from a Byzantine anaphora. So, what, exactly, is profane about this? These lyrics are a far cry from AC/DC, Metallica, or Journey, which I think we all can agree is secular and profane music.

In fact, I used Jason Gray’s song, Remind me Who I Am, as the starting point for a homily I gave at the beginning of Lent last year. The point of the homily being that Lent, like the theme of the song, is intended to remind us who we are as baptized sons and daughters of our Heavenly Father.

1. The music is Protestant. True. Some of it is. For what it’s worth, Matt Maher is a devout Catholic. But, that’s beside the point. He’s about the only one on the contemporary Christian scene. The point I want to make, and this would apply by extension to many hymns that are sung, for instance from the Adoremus hymnal, which is my personal favorite as far as hymnals go, is that just because something is Protestant does not de facto and by definition make it bad. Remember, whatever is true in Protestantism is by definition Catholic.

Take, for instance, Chris Tomlin’s song, Whom Shall I Fear, which is very popular right now. I’ve included a link to the lyrics, and I would invite anyone to find anything heretical in them.

elyrics.net/read/c/chris-tomlin-lyrics/whom-shall-i-fear-lyrics.html

1. Third and finally, I want to address the complaint that is often made that these contemporary songs do not foster prayer or reverence, and thus are not fit for worship.

I think we know something by its fruit. I am a big fan of Steubenville youth conferences. I’ve gone five years in a row as a chaperone. I have seen thousands of young men and women be won for Christ at these conferences. Obviously, this is not primarily because of the music which these conferences employ. But, I would suggest that the music does not hurt. On any event, for what it’s worth, the bishops of these dioceses allow it, and many of these bishops, for instance, Archbishop Charles Chaput, can be called anything but liturgical Iiberals.

I can tell you that as a priest, without a doubt the most powerful, well-examined confessions I hear are at Steubenville conferences. These conferences are contributing to thousands of priestly and religious vocations throughout the United States and Canada. Yet, we want to squash that in, what appears to me, to be a game we play to try to prove who is the most conservative, who is the most traditional, who is the most orthodox.

In my parish, I will welcome any music that leads people closer to a personal encounter with the Person of Jesus Christ. If that means using Gregorian chant at Mass because that genre of music helps some of my parishioners go deeper in prayer, then by all means, lets use it. If Matt Maher or Hillsong can bring the youth of my parish deeper in relationship with Christ then their music is welcome as well.

I think it’s good to strive for the ideal, but we have to be realistic as well. Steubenville conferences sell out in hours and bring in tens of thousands of youth. Mass is not entertainment, but sometimes people need to be entertained in order to first be won for Christ. Lets not forget that.

What a GREAT post! Thank you!

This post expresses beautifully the attitude that most Catholics in my circle seem to have, including all my friends who regularly attend the TLM in our city.

The only place I ever see a critical attitude towards the St. Louis Jesuit music, OCP music, or CCM in general is here on CAF. I honestly think this critical attitude is quite rare, and that the CAF members who foster it are in a very very tiny minority of American Catholics.

A large group of teens from our parish attends Steubenville, too. It sounds super. I wish they would do a boomer version of the Steubenville for old teenagers like me and my husband who are lost in the 1980s when it comes to Christian music! I would feel awkward attending the teen conferences, since my knees creak and my neck sags. But if I were surrounded by a bunch of fellow boomers…

 

[agapewolf]

I thought they just came to see Scott Hahn. That’s why most of the people I know went to Steubenville. Maybe the music is just his warm-up band.

Scott Hahn does not speak at the youth conferences. And we are not the “warm up band” the house band leads music throughout the whole conference including adoration and mass.

 

[EphelDuath]

IFirst, let me say that I don’t personally like Gregorian chant all that much. Personally, far from moving me to pray and contemplation, it tends to put me to sleep. I don’t mean that as a critique against anyone who does like it. That’s fine. But, it’s just not my personal cup of tea.

With all due respect, the purpose of liturgical music isn’t to entertain, it’s to foster an atmosphere of reverence. Even if you find chant to be boring, surely you can admit that you know you’re in the presence of the Mana from Heaven when it is sung.

 

[clem456]

With all due respect, the purpose of liturgical music isn’t to entertain, it’s to foster an atmosphere of reverence. Even if you find chant to be boring, surely you can admit that you know you’re in the presence of the Mana from Heaven when it is sung.

Who said that the purpose of liturgical music is to entertain? It seems you assumed the worst possible motivation in what Father wrote, and you’re also he implying he doesn’t discern the body and blood of Jesus. :tsktsk:.