Prayer Question

[Brazzy]

When we pray and ask for certain things in our life, we are supposed to ask for it in a way that is similar to “please let this happen IF IT IS YOUR WILL”. But, with that being said if it is already the will for it to happen then why even pray??? Sorry…this is just mind boggling to me lately.

 

[Trishie]

God wishes to give us many things, but respects our free wil to ask and accept. While some things…like our lives, are granted without our asking, some are not unless we ask, according to God’s knowledge of the best for us or others.

“There is no need to worry; but if there is anything you need, pray for it, asking God for it with prayer and thanksgiving, and that peace of God, which is so much greater than we can understand, will guard your hearts and your thoughts, in Christ Jesus.” [Philippians 4:6-7]

Jesus promises, “Ask and it will be given to you; search, and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For the one who asks always receives; the one who searches, always finds; the one who knocks will always have the door opened to him. Is there a man among you who would hand his son a stone when he asked for bread? Or hand him a snake when he asks for a fish? … How much more will your Father in heaven give good things to those who ask Him!” [Matthew 7:7-11] “Your Father knows what you need even before you ask Him.” [Matthew 6:9]

“If you have hope this will make you cheerful. Do not give up if trials come; and keep on praying.” [Romans 12:12] “We are quite confident that if we ask Him for anything, and it is in accordance with His will, He will hear us; and knowing that whatever we ask, He hears us, we know that we have already been granted what we asked of Him.” [John 5:14-15] “If any one of you is in trouble, he should pray; if anyone is feeling happy, he should sing a psalm.” [James 5:13] “Pray constantly; and for all things give thanks to God.” [Thessalonians 4:18] “Grant, Lord, the prayer of Your servants…so that all the earth’s inhabitants may acknowledge that You are the Lord, the everlasting God.” [Ecclesiasticus 36:16-17]

Prayer is grace
God, we receive Your grace to pray as unmerited gift. We know or interpret You through human concepts; however, by humbly yielding our selves and our logic to faith, we allow You freedom of utterance in us. Even so, we may only experience Your presence and word in silence as we invite You to speak and move within us as we actively and prayerfully live the gospel.

If in our disappointment at Your seeming silence we experience wavering faith, with courage we pray, “Speak Yourself and live Your life in me, my God. Make thanksgiving, and glorify Yourself continually in me, in all my supposed strengths, as in my sinfulness and inability. Find Yourself to me. Find me to Your truth. Unknowing, uncomprehending though I am, please let me be drawn into the infinite possibilities of Your life and love. Not my will, but Your will be done!”

 

[reen12]

quote: Brazzy

When we pray and ask for certain things in our life, we are supposed to ask for it in a way that is similar to “please let this happen IF IT IS YOUR WILL”. But, with that being said if it is already the will for it to happen then why even pray??? Sorry…this is just mind boggling to me lately

The same thought has boggled my mind for fifty years.
It’s the same question, I just phrase it differently.
Hopefully, our fellow posters may offer cogent thought
on the matter.

I phrase it like this:
God is omniscient and omnipotent. He sees all, and He is
all powerful.
Why do I need to call His attention to a situation, wherein
someone is hurting, or troubled? Doesn’t He* know*? http://bestsmileys.com/nono/9.gif

Is He trying to tell me that He won’t lift a finger - until
limited human beings ask Him to?
Does a human child need to ask His father to provide him food?

I can understand thanking Him for my daily bread.
But asking Him for food that I need, to continue to exist?
How much sense does that make? Doesn’t He know?
He designed human beings to require food to live.

And what of those who are starving - despite their prayers,
while one who is well fed, acknowledges Him not?
I’ve carried these, and similar questions, for 50 years.

If He knows of each sparrow that falls to the earth, how come
He does not know [or does not care?] - for those starving across the world?

reen12

 

[Trishie]

more prayer about prayer, kind of trying to give you the idea of what I mean. I write stuff to sort things out, so who know if it will help you…?

Jesus, Saint Therese of Lisieux encouraged a novice who regretted her distractions during prayer. “I also have many, but as soon as I am aware of them, I pray for those persons the thought of whom is diverting my attention, and in this way they reap benefit from my distractions…I accept all for the love of God, even the wildest fancies that cross my mind”. When I experience distractions, please let thought of any person or issue become prayer in me for them.

You invite us to pray according to our best understanding of prayer. You are gentle and patient, and do not wish to discourage us, but You sometimes correct us by denying specific prayers and hopes. You deepen these lessons through the events of our lives and our interactions with others. Please nurture our true needs, so that they do not translate as need for recognition and acclaim, for accumulation of possessions, or for exclusively human companionship and love.

Let prayer lead us from sin and draw us to Your Spirit of love. Sin cannot prevail in us without our tacit or deliberate cooperation. Nor can events or other persons adversely affect our souls unless we permit. It is our physical and mental appetites, and even our spiritual ambitions, that betray us to sin. Eve sinned, not because she was tempted, but because she chose to disregard You in order to please her own appetites—equally, so do we.

God, please help us to be truly honest with ourselves so that we do not act out of hidden selfishness or neurosis. By such honesty, give us the discernment of genuine gospel motives.
Save us thereby from foolish or selfish choices that disadvantage others and ourselves. If we withhold any part of our life from You, we may obstruct graces that You desire to bestow for service of others. We thus cloud the brilliance of Your glory in us, and prepare a purgatory for ourselves, when death—had we cooperated fully in willing perseverance and in joyful, creative faith—would have brought us instantly before Your face. Let us welcome Your gifts as we wholeheartedly pray and serve.

 

[Trishie]

After this I pull my head in, but I have given a lot of thought to the kind of question you seem to be asking…which is more or less, what’s the use of prayer if everything is decided anyway. It isn’t actually. There’s an offer from God, and there is an accepting…but not only many times are we asked to pray in Scripture, Mary at Cana appeared to change Jesus’ intention by her faith. Best wishes, Trishie

Prayer as God’s family
God, when we pray, we implicitly offer the image and love of God in those for whom we pray. The innate prayer of Your image in us gained immense value in the incarnation and sacrifice of Jesus.

Through communion in Jesus’ life, we also share in the tremendous reservoir of grace of His Mystical Body. Each person in the Mystical Body has unique complementary gifts that increase the sanctity and interaction of the whole Body. The prayer, penance, and service of each member of the Mystical Body throughout time contribute to the vitality and grace of the whole.

Because we are created with free will, we can remain spiritually separate from You and our fellow-beings, thus impeding the flow of grace to others, whose salvation may partly depend upon our intercession or witness. By unrepented failure to share ourselves lovingly with others, we may condemn ourselves to eternal separation from You our Creator, and from the heavenly family who longingly await us.

We are blessed in those who serve others in charitable deeds. We are blessed in all who accept suffering as their apostolate in unity with Jesus, to atone for humankind’s sins and to intercede for salvation of souls. We are blessed in all who devote their lives in prayer, for this apostolate swells Your grace within the Church with tremendous but concealed power.

Your prayer within each of Your people is a tiny stream that flows into the ocean of Yourself. If we refuse to participate in Your cooperative plan of salvation then we dry up as stagnant pools in the desert of separation. The tragedy of this separation is individual, but its mourning belongs to all. If we truly understood this, how fervently we would intercede for each other!

You intend that we offer prayer in each thought, word, and act of our lives. Whether we pray deeply or grope in confusion for Your will, or we confidently proclaim private desires, or pray sorrowfully—we must always seek to pray. In doing so, we must acknowledge with Jesus, that, “Not my will, but Your divine will be done.”

Confusion occurs because we are motivated by self-will. We may choose to abandon hope, or to compromise, or to reaffirm our faith in You despite lack of consolation or of apparent response. If we do not trust in Your mercy and promises, our faith and hope weaken. We may even abandon You, temporarily or permanently, believing You to be faithless, uncaring, or non-existent. Save us from such despair.

Your best kindness may be in refusing a wish that might endanger one’s own or another’s development or salvation. Therefore, in apparently unanswered prayers there is astonishing hope! If we accept Your apparent silence and inaction patiently, then faith deepens. When we allow Your own prayer and design in us to unfold, in time (or in eternity) we will discover that Your answers in our lives and in others’ for whom we pray, are far beyond what we could dream to ask!

If we allow You to make the fullness of Your prayer in us, You will gradually transform us. In Your sight if not in our own or any others’, we will become the pure precious persons whom You desire each to become. We then are in harmony with Your creative purpose, faithfully serving Your divine plan of salvation within the Mystical Body. Grant that, in praise, humility and trust, we may so allow You. Thank You, God, for the prayer You place in our hearts as You call us to gospel service throughout our lives.

 

[reen12]

This beseeching God, in prayer = if it’s His will, He says yes.
If not His will, He says no…

Is this worthy of Godhead? ------. “Maybe yes, maybe no.”
“But don’t forget to ask.”

It’s OK for sparrows, but it’s perfectly off the wall,
for human beings to have to “notify” Godhead
that a problem exists, that needs addressing.

I guess that’s what it comes down to. I have never - and I do
mean never - understood why God needs to be begged to do
what any compassionate human would do, if possible, to
relieve suffering.

And if it is asked: “Who are you to question God,”
my reply would be “I have little tolerance for the illogical, in life.”
I did not request to be born, into the human condition.
Now that I’m here, I’m taught of a deity that requires to
be notified when another human being is suffering or needs
some kind of help. Human beings step forward, while God
does not? “Ask, and you shall receive.” Uh…we will?
But You said that if it is Your will, You will act.
Double messaging, from deity. :juggle:
To point this out, in circles theologic, is akin to saying
“The Emperor has no clothes.”

This is not logical. That omnipotence and omniscience
requires to be informed. Why stand on ceremony?
Either relieve human suffering, or not. You made the world.
You made human beings. So what’s the problem?
Either act to relieve - or not act to relieve.

You, as God, are, ultimately,* solely* responsible - for all that happens in life, for You chose to create humankind, knowing that the “fall” was to come. Either fish, or cut bait. Either intervene, or not intervene.
It’s Your circus. You’re the ringmaster. :coffeeread:

reen12

 

[MarieVeronica]

IF IT IS YOUR WILL".

Hi Brazzy I think you’re on the right track, with this. Don’t let it boggle your mind. To say to God… “THY Will be done, in all things, Lord” is probably one of the best (if not THE best) prayers you can pray, with sincerity. Why? Because you’re placing your total trust in His Will. You’re repeating the prayer of Our dear Lord, in the Garden of Gethsemani…

“Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass away from Me; yet not as I will, but as Thou willest.” (Matthew 26:39)

“Abba, Father, all things are possible to Thee. Remove this cup from Me; yet not what I will, but what Thou willest.” (Mark 14:36)

“Father, if Thou are willing, remove this cup from Me; yet not My will but Thine be done.” (Luke 22:42)

It is such an important prayer (and lesson for us), that it is recorded in three of the four Gospels. Hope this helps. God bless.

 

[Augustine]

But, with that being said if it is already the will for it to happen then why even pray???

In order to prepare yourself by the grace of God to accept His will and to use His gifts for the building of His kingdom.

Besides, if you were planning to give a gift to a child, had even already bought it, and the child came to you to say that what the he wished for more than anything in his life was exactly that gift that you had bought, wouldn’t you give it to him immediately? Wouldn’t God be capable of the same love towards His children?

 

[bpbasilphx]

One of the reasons we pray is for OURSELVES to draw closer to God, and hence to be more sensitive to HIS perfect will.

 

[Conservative]

Good question, Brazzy -
But we are told, “Ask, and you shall receive. Seek, and you shall find. Knock, and it shall be opened to you.” I’ve also once heard that those words don’t necessarily mean “you shall receive” exactly what you’re asking for. I don’t know.

God already knows everything that will happen. He knows what He will grant, allow or deny. Perhaps, it has to do with our own worthiness or non-worthiness. But He waits and watches for us to come to Him. Who can speak for God’s ways? If it is His Will that something not be granted, I guess that’s hardest for us all - to wonder why pray if God’s plan will be other than what we’re asking. Why ask “Santa” (yes, I know there’s no real “Santa”), as a child at Christmas, for something you’re sure you’ll get - and it doesn’t show up under the tree? Does it mean you were bad? Not necessarily. But your parents may have good reason.

I’m left with no solid answer for you, except that asking God - is the only way. Accepting His Answer (if it’s “No”) may be the hardest solution.

 

[John_Hiner]

When we pray and ask for certain things in our life, we are supposed to ask for it in a way that is similar to “please let this happen IF IT IS YOUR WILL”. But, with that being said if it is already the will for it to happen then why even pray??? Sorry…this is just mind boggling to me lately.

Laudatur Iesus Christus.

Dear Brazzy:

Imagine this: I assume that everyone wants a clean house. In fact, I know you and know specifically that you like to have a clean house. So, I want your house to be clean, you want your house to be clean, why don’t I just clean it?

How would you react if I just walked into your house and started cleaning?

Would my waiting for you to invite me in be a meaningless formality, or would it be an expression of my respect for your privacy and dignity?

Does this help?

Pax Christi tecum.

John Hiner

 

[John_Hiner]

The same thought has boggled my mind for fifty years.
It’s the same question, I just phrase it differently.
Hopefully, our fellow posters may offer cogent thought
on the matter.

I phrase it like this:
God is omniscient and omnipotent. He sees all, and He is
all powerful.
Why do I need to call His attention to a situation, wherein
someone is hurting, or troubled? Doesn’t He* know*?

Is He trying to tell me that He won’t lift a finger - until
limited human beings ask Him to?
Does a human child need to ask His father to provide him food?

I can understand thanking Him for my daily bread.
But asking Him for food that I need, to continue to exist?
How much sense does that make? Doesn’t He know?
He designed human beings to require food to live.

And what of those who are starving - despite their prayers,
while one who is well fed, acknowledges Him not?
I’ve carried these, and similar questions, for 50 years.

If He knows of each sparrow that falls to the earth, how come
He does not know [or does not care?] - for those starving across the world?

reen12

Laudatur Iesus Christus.

Dear Reen12:

This question, especially when concerning food, care, or comfort for human beings, seems circular.

God has given some specific commands: feed the hungry, heal the sick, comfort the suffering. One might ask, if a servant of God, one who is apt to pray, seeks to “advise God of problems” the servant has noticed, but the problems are in these categories, then why are they being referred back to God, as though the commands have not been given?

This calls to mind St. James’s apparent frustration: “If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what does it profit? So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead,” (James (RSV) 2:15-17).

The word “omnipotent” has a simple meaning, “possessing all power.” One way to understand this is that even the small amount of power that each person has belongs to God. He has told us how to use the portion of His power with which we have been entrusted. If we decline to use it as ordered, can we charge Him with dereliction?

He has invited us to help Him to do what He has chosen to do. He makes the grain swell, the herds multiply, the soil rich; we are charged with gathering and distributing. If the food exists, as it does, but it is not distributed, we should be ashamed to complain that we have failed Him by failing to do the work assigned to us.

Spiritus Sapientiae nobiscum.

John Hiner