You too brother! I appreciate that, it means a lot to me!You know I like you tGette, and respect you as a fellow in Christ. However, I thank the Lord that He is keeping Mary from knowing some of the things that are said in devotion to her.
Aside from your polemics, what is your definition of the dead in Christ?Because Protestants have rejected the authority of The Church. If they hadn’t, we’d all be in agreement on it.
Just because we don’t believe in your interpretation of the text doesn’t mean we are confused, or that there is a ‘misunderstanding’.
The latter. We are directed to ask of the Father, in the name of Jesus.You too brother! I appreciate that, it means a lot to me!
I have to go, God Willing I will be back, but a question to ponder:
If what you say is true…
Anytime we ask for Saints and/or Mary to intercede for us…
Is our Lord hearing them as regular prayers and still answering them?
Or is he ignoring them because they are not directed to Him?
In the Peace of Christ!
Is it Mary that will save my poor soul?It is nice to see some of our separated brothers and sisters are interested enough in Marian Prayers to actually read some! Praise God! Yeppers, they can pray to Jesus all they want to and ignore all the Saints in Heaven! I won’t criticize one bit, but I will say for this Christian, I’ll accept the Queen of Heaven as my own Queen, the Mother of God as my own Mother, and the Consoler of the sorrowing as my own Consoler!
O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to you!
O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to you!
O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to you!
Peace,
Gail
P.S. Hey there Justasking - watch out for that Litany - if you dare to pray it, Someone may save your poor soul!
Okay, are you seriously claiming that Mary can save souls?Dear Justasking - only if you LET HER! That’s why we call her among other things, the Mother of Mercy.
Peace,
Gail
Mary cannot directly save souls. Her son can. Many of the prayers about Mary points to her only Son, Jesus Christ.Okay, are you seriously claiming that Mary can save souls?
You said you weren’t here to debate. Your original question was answered yet now you pose a new one. The Church is Christ perpetuated, right? (Eph 1:22-23) Paul also didn’t always go “directly to Jesus” (Rm 15:30). I already told you how at the wedding at Cana the servants didn’t go directly to Jesus. If you think Jesus’ ear isn’t turned toward His mother’s prayers, you are quite welcome to not ask her for intercession.But why go to Mary when we can go directly to Jesus? I can’t think of a better way to grow closer to Jesus than going directly to him in prayer.
If Mary, Saints, and Angels are indeed ignorant to our prayers and Jesus hears only prayers offered on his behalf:The latter. We are directed to ask of the Father, in the name of Jesus.
We cannot assign truth (in the case of intercessory prayer) to a group simply because it has large numbers and has managed to survive. Islam has more adherents now than Rome, and has been around for 1400 years. That doesn’t mean I think God hears a thing they say. Catholics, of course, do pray to Christ alone, too, and if they have faith those prayers are heard.If Mary, Saints, and Angels are indeed ignorant to our prayers and Jesus hears only prayers offered on his behalf:
The thought this gives me is then why has the Catholic Church been so successful if a lot of people’s prayers are wasted like this?
Or are these “intercessory” prayers heard because ultimately they are all being asked in the Name of Jesus.
I know no matter what, that I mention our Lord anytime I am asking for intercession.
I was just about to make an edit to touch on this point.We cannot assign truth (in the case of intercessory prayer) to a group simply because it has large numbers and has managed to survive. Islam has more adherents now than Rome, and has been around for 1400 years. That doesn’t mean I think God hears a thing they say. Catholics, of course, do pray to Christ alone, too, and if they have faith those prayers are heard.
That’s because you’re nice and your threads are nice LOLI was just about to make an edit to touch on this point.
Size definitely does not make anything legitimate.
What about Angels?
Probably derailing the topic, but what is the Protestant (well…Lutheran) belief on the role of Angels? I had this thread started a while back…maybe I’ll post in it again. People seem to be pretty scant in posting when I start a thread.
I forgot to mention; we also do believe in guardian angels. Angels are on duty constantly to attend to God’s children and are aware of things in our lives. Sample passages would be these: Genesis 19:10,16, 28:12, 1 Kings 19:5,7; 2 Kings 6:17; Psalm 34:7, 91:11,12; Daniel 6:22; Luke 15:7,10; Hebrews 1:14.What about Angels?
Probably derailing the topic, but what is the Protestant (well…Lutheran) belief on the role of Angels? I had this thread started a while back…maybe I’ll post in it again. People seem to be pretty scant in posting when I start a thread.
I am going to post this quote in the other thread too.I forgot to mention; we also do believe in guardian angels. Angels are on duty constantly to attend to God’s children and are aware of things in our lives. Sample passages would be these: Genesis 19:10,16, 28:12, 1 Kings 19:5,7; 2 Kings 6:17; Psalm 34:7, 91:11,12; Daniel 6:22; Luke 15:7,10; Hebrews 1:14.
What we are not able to say with certainty is if each one of us has a specific guardian angel assigned to us or whether one specific angel is designated our guardian angel all our life. Perhaps we have many angels serving us at the same time. The Bible doesn’t provide that kind of detailed information, nor is it necessary.
Luke 16:22 refers to the work of angels in bringing the believer to heaven after death. This is similar to the work of angels as described in Matthew 13:41, where they will also weed out unbelievers and separate them from believers.
No…angels are directed by God and are sent to minister to us. They don’t respond to our prayers but they do respond to God’s direction in answer to our prayers to God; they also do many things for us without us even being aware of it or even asking for it.I am going to post this quote in the other thread too.
Given what you say here though, if Angels are that aware of things going on, why can we not ask them to pray for us?
PRAISE GOD!No…angels are directed by God and are sent to minister to us. They don’t respond to our prayers but they do respond to God’s direction in answer to our prayers to God; they also do many things for us without us even being aware of it or even asking for it.
I know of a story that I read about M. Angelica, when she was a child, being picked up out of the way of a moving vehicle.
I also know of a story a pastor friend of mine told. When his wife was pregnant, she walked across the street to drop something in a mailbox and on her way back wasn’t paying attention when she crossed and was almost struck by a truck. She states she felt something grab her collar and pull her up on the sidewalk and even the driver, in the police report, said she stepped into the street and suddenly yanked back almost as if she was pushed or pulled back out of her control.
I would think if you became fully united with God you would, no? There are certainly examples of the dead hearing the petitions of those on earth in Scripture…However, I don’t believe I will “know” what is happening to my loved ones or that I will be omniscient and be able to “hear” their prayers. There is no evidence of this in Scripture.