Prayers like the Litany of Saints

[BrooklynBoy200]

I was reading my bible, and i saw Jesus said (i don’t have the exact quote right now, i’ll look it up later) something like we shouldn’t say long prayers and prayers with a list of names. I’m saying this from memory so i may have this completely wrong, but i believe it was something like that. Isn’t that exactly what things( i’m not sure if Litanies are considered prayers are not) like the Litany of Saints are? I’m not saying we are all wrong or something like that it is just something i saw and wondered about.

 

[JimO]

I noted that you ask here about praying to the saints and you’ve started another thread asking why we pray to Mary. Have you grown up Roman Catholic and just not familiar with what we believe or is there something else going on here.

 

[Fidelis]

I was reading my bible, and i saw Jesus said (i don’t have the exact quote right now, i’ll look it up later) something like we shouldn’t say long prayers and prayers with a list of names. I’m saying this from memory so i may have this completely wrong, but i believe it was something like that. Isn’t that exactly what things( i’m not sure if Litanies are considered prayers are not) like the Litany of Saints are? I’m not saying we are all wrong or something like that it is just something i saw and wondered about.

You are perhaps thinking of this passage:

5 "When you pray, you shall not be as the hypocrites, for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Most certainly, I tell you, they have received their reward.

6 But you, when you pray, enter into your inner chamber, and having shut your door, pray to your Father who is in secret, and your Father who sees in secret will reward you openly.

7 In praying, don’t use vain repetitions, as the Gentiles do; for they think that they will be heard for their much speaking.

8 Therefore don’t be like them, for your Father knows what things you need, before you ask him. (Matthew 5:5-8)

This is a pretty common charge from non-Catholic Christians who attack Catholic prayers like the Litany of the Saints and the Rosary. But notice that Jesus is not denouncing repetition, per se, only VAIN repetition, i.e., repeating a prayer for no other reason that repeating a prayer is better for getting God to hear you, or as a chant or mantra to release some spiritual power. This is what Jesus was talking about.

If you condemn ALL repetitions, you run into some problems. How many times do you have to repeat a prayer to make it “vain repetition”? Two? Three? What about Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane:

39 He advanced a little and fell prostrate in prayer, saying, “My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from me; yet, not as I will, but as you will.” 40 When he returned to his disciples he found them asleep. He said to Peter, “So you could not keep watch with me for one hour? 41 Watch and pray that you may not undergo the test. The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.” 42 Withdrawing a second time, he prayed again, “My Father, if it is not possible that this cup pass without my drinking it, your will be done!” 43 Then he returned once more and found them asleep, for they could not keep their eyes open.
44 He left them and withdrew again and prayed a third time, saying the same thing again. (Matthew 27:39-44)

How about the saints in heaven, in Revelation 4:8?

The four living creatures, each of them with six wings, 8 were covered with eyes inside and out. Day and night they do not stop exclaiming: “Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God almighty, who was, and who is, and who is to come.”

**Day and night! **Is that repetitive, or what!

Finally, if God hates repetition so much, why did he inspire Psalm 138?:

Praise the LORD, who is so good; God’s love endures forever;
Praise the God of gods; God’s love endures forever;
Praise the Lord of lords; God’s love endures forever;
Who alone has done great wonders, God’s love endures forever;
Who skillfully made the heavens, God’s love endures forever;
Who spread the earth upon the waters, God’s love endures forever;
Who made the great lights, God’s love endures forever;
The sun to rule the day, God’s love endures forever;
The moon and stars to rule the night, God’s love endures forever;
Who struck down the firstborn of Egypt, God’s love endures forever;
And led Israel from their midst, God’s love endures forever;
With mighty hand and outstretched arm, God’s love endures forever;
Who split in two the Red Sea, God’s love endures forever;
And led Israel through, God’s love endures forever;
But swept Pharaoh and his army into the Red Sea, God’s love endures forever;
Who led the people through the desert, God’s love endures forever;
Who struck down great kings, God’s love endures forever;
Slew powerful kings, God’s love endures forever;
Sihon, king of the Amorites, God’s love endures forever;
Og, king of Bashan, God’s love endures forever;
And made their lands a heritage, God’s love endures forever;
A heritage for Israel, God’s servant, God’s love endures forever.
The LORD remembered us in our misery, God’s love endures forever;
Freed us from our foes, God’s love endures forever;
And gives food to all flesh, God’s love endures forever.
Praise the God of heaven, God’s love endures forever.

Pretty darn repetitious of God, I’d say!

 

[BrooklynBoy200]

I noted that you ask here about praying to the saints and you’ve started another thread asking why we pray to Mary. Have you grown up Roman Catholic and just not familiar with what we believe or is there something else going on here.

I know about praying to Mary and the saints and all, i was just noticing that we had many fancy titles for Mary. My family isn’t very religious. We go to church and everything, but it’s mostly been just the basic principles, like there is God, there is Jesus, and sin is bad, stuff like that. I’ve been researching and i’ve learned much of it on my own now though. Most of my extended family is protestant so i couldn’t ask them either. I’m sure i’ll learn a lot more now that i’ve found the forums though. And thankyou Fidelis, that is the passage i was thinking of, and i understand now.
And i’m sorry if it seemed like i was attacking catholic prayers, i just got a little worried when i saw that passage, i don’t really have anybody to give me the explanations.

 

[mtk76]

Brooklyn,
If I was you (and I was in a very similiar spot once) I would focus on the question of authority and by that I mean what has the authority we Catholics believe it is The Church and protestants believe it is the Bible. Well read the New Testament and you will see mentioned that it is the Church that is the pillar of Truth and also the Church that is protected against the gates of hades. Jesus founded a Church not a Bible and that Church is the Catholic Church. The Bible is very important and is venerated by the Church (and also the New Testament was cannonized (decided which books were in and which were nto) by The Church. On a side note I believe it would be useful for you to read Catholicism and Fundamentalism as from your questioning it appears this may answer a lot of your questions.

Peace
Mark

 

[Victorious]

If you condemn ALL repetitions, you run into some problems.

I’ll say! How many of you married men think you could get away with telling your wife you love her only once?

 

[RCCDefender]

I’ll say! How many of you married men think you could get away with telling your wife you love her only once?

Hehehe!! There sure would be a lot of hubby’s sleeping on the couch for a long time…

 

[Victorious]

This is a pretty common charge from non-Catholic Christians who attack Catholic prayers like the Litany of the Saints and the Rosary. But notice that Jesus is not denouncing repetition, per se, only VAIN repetition, i.e., repeating a prayer for no other reason that repeating a prayer is better for getting God to hear you, or as a chant or mantra to release some spiritual power. This is what Jesus was talking about.

The only disadvantage to sitting down to a meal with my Protestant friends is when they say grace: by the time they’re done, the food is cold. And I have one friend who has probably set a world’s record for the most uses of the phrase “Father God” within 30 seconds. (Can I get a witness?)

These are some of the same people who complain about the Rosary being rambling and repetitious.

 

[Rebecca_New]

I just had a friend who is a protestant ask me about this very topic and I did not know how to answer her. This woman is in her 90’s and is such a dedicated Christian. She said, "well, I guess we say the Our Father over and over again. Then she stated that the Our Father is usually said incorrectly-people pause after Thy Will be done(pause) on Earth as it is in Heaven. It should be "Thy Will be done on Earth (pause) as it is in Heaven.

 

[Integritus]

How about when Jesus three consecutive times asked Peter if he loved Him? [John 21:15-19]

“Peter do you love me?” Peter: “Yes Lord, you know I love you”
“Peter, do you love me?” Peter: “Yes Lord, you know I love you”
“Peter do you love me?” Peter: “Lord, you know everything. You know well that I love you.”

WOW. God in the flesh knows all things before they happen or are said? And yet he still repeatedly wanted to hear Peter say that he loves Him? Sounds like repitition to me. And sounds like it’s okay! God never tires of hearing us say how much we love Him or praise Him.

Keyword of the condemnation by Jesus of “vain repitition” is the “VAIN”, not “repitition”.