praying to mary. how to explain??

[Brooke]

how do i explain to my friend that it is not wrong to pray to the virgin mary?? he says she died like any other person. how can i pray to her if shes not up there with God… everyone dies and will not be in heaven till jesus comes again to judge us. he says that the only people in heaven are of course God and Jesus and enok, elias, and moses.

help??? how do i explain this?

 

[bpbasilphx]

Actually, one interpretaion of the Biblical data says that Moses did die.

The Church teaches that likewise, the Theotokos did suffer physical death, but shortly after the separation of her soul from her body (traditionally 3 days), it was assumed into heaven and reunited with her soul. There, she lives totally in the Age to Come.

Elijah and Enoch will suffer physical death during the reign of Antichrist.

Veneration of the Theotokos is in the tradition of the Church, and for us, that suffices.

 

[murtad]

how do i explain to my friend that it is not wrong to pray to the virgin mary?? he says she died like any other person. how can i pray to her if shes not up there with God… everyone dies and will not be in heaven till jesus comes again to judge us. he says that the only people in heaven are of course God and Jesus and enok, elias, and moses.

help??? how do i explain this?

St Mary is the first of the saints, and so she is called Queen of Heavenly Saints. So, she is called the first Christian, for as mother of God she bore Christ. She is also first to be canonised a saint by the Holy Synod, and if you read the book of Romans, Chapter 16, Verse 6, interpretation of meaning:

“Pray to Most Holy Ever Virgin Mary, Mother of God, who worked hard among you”

St Mary is not dead but rather we say she fell asleep and she (bodily) ascended to heaven.

 

[Brooke]

St Mary is the first of the saints, and so she is called Queen of Heavenly Saints. So, she is called the first Christian, for as mother of God she bore Christ. She is also first to be canonised a saint by the Holy Synod, and if you read the book of Romans, Chapter 16, Verse 6, interpretation of meaning:

“Pray to Most Holy Ever Virgin Mary, Mother of God, who worked hard among you”

St Mary is not dead but rather we say she fell asleep and she (bodily) ascended to heaven.

thanks that might help. although he is kind of stubborn… he says she is not holy though. and neither is the church… the catholic church. only God and his word, the bible.??

what can i tell him?

 

[Cathhsmom]

First, remember that you can’t make him believe. That is God’s job. So, pray before you do anything else. 2nd, get some good apologetics works on Mary. I know that the Catholic Answers site has some articles from This Rock magazine. I will search them after this and see if I can link them.

Now, I would start with what does he mean by the word “pray”. I say this, because I am a convert and have friends who have asked questions before. You can come to loggerheads easily if you are using the same words, but meaning different things. I had this happen over the word “pray”. I used it as “to ask” and my friend was using it as “worship”. So, when I said that I prayed to the saints, she thought that I worshipped them instead of what I meant which was asking them to pray to God for me. SO, I would start there and make sure that he understands how you use the word.

Next. I would pull up the scripture about how Jesus said God was the God of the living and not the dead. To us, that means that we are all alive with God, since Jesus says that He, God, is the GOd of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob which were all dead at that time as we see it but not as God sees it. I hope that makes sense.

We believe that Mary is alive in Heaven with God. That means that we can ask for her intercessory prayers just as we would ask for anyone we knew down here on Earth to pray for us. Yes, we can and do go directly to God, but just as you ask your family and friends to pray for you in times of need, so, we, too, ask our family in Heaven to pray for us.

 

[Convert66]

Start with the most obvious facts.

1. Jesus was born Jewish.
2. Jesus fulfilled the Law.
3. The 4th commandment says to “honor your Mother and Father . . .”
4. Jesus Christ . . .the same yesterday, today and forever.
5. Seems reasonable enough that Jesus still honors His Mother . . .

“At present we see indistinctly, as in a mirror, but then face to face. At present I know partially; then I shall know fully as I am fully known.” (1 Cor. 13:12).

Who is “we” and when is “now,” and “then” in this verse? It is understood as the Beatific vision. Standing before God “face to face.” Knowing as we are known. Does this apply to Mary, whom Jesus honors? The obvious answer is “yes.” Therefore, because Mary is “in Christ” she has eternal life and “knows as she is known” because she sees God face to face.

"Beloved, we are God’s children now; what we shall be has not yet been revealed. We do know that when it is revealed (—ed. in the Beatific vision) we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he really is. (1 John 3:2 emphasis added)

The dead in Christ are raised in Him also. They are alive in Him. As such, since He is God they are partakers of the Divine Nature in it’s fulness, because they are in Him. They know, as they are known. They see as they are seen. They hear as they are heard. And they are interceding for us their brethren, just like Jesus intercedes for us to the Father. We ask " in Jesus’ name" of the Father. They ask “in Christ,” for they can not be separated from the love of God which is “in Christ Jesus.”

Something to chew on, anyway. I hope it helps.

All my best . . .

 

[StrawberryJam]

I don’t know if this helps or not, but I have been to a few protestant funerals. And, vividly I remember many people saying, “I just know she is smiling now” and other things, that implied the person was somehow in heaven and with Jesus watching them.

I would go to a protestant funeral if I were you. I can’t say all of them do this, but I have seen it done many times now in different denominations.

So, if Aunt Beth is in heaven, why not Mary?

 

[rev_kevin]

how do i explain to my friend that it is not wrong to pray to the virgin mary?? he says she died like any other person. how can i pray to her if shes not up there with God… everyone dies and will not be in heaven till jesus comes again to judge us. he says that the only people in heaven are of course God and Jesus and enok, elias, and moses.

help??? how do i explain this?

Personally, I don’t believe in praying to anyone except God. No were in the Bible does it say to pray to anyone eles. Not Mary , John or any saints. When His disciples asked how do we pray Jesus said you should pray like this, Our Father {not our Mary, not our John, not our saints} I don’t need a middle man to talk to God for me.Mary,John or the saints have no power only God has the power to answer your prayers. Matthew 6:5-15 Jesus teaches about prayer. No were does he say to pray to anyone eles except God, or Our Father. When Jesus died didn’t he open the gates of Heaven and whipe away original sin.
The rightious will go to heaven in a blink of an eye and th e rest will be judged. God will judge those who he didn’t take up to heaven, those who didnt believe in him and are left here on earth for th erapture.

I’m sure people here have friends who are of different faiths, I’m just wondering if it affects your friendship? Years and years ago a good friend of mine was soon to be married in a Methodist church and our differing religions drove us barely apart.

I’m asking about the local church that you belong to. The mega churches are too big for my taste. The tiny churches with fewer than 100 people seem too small. There are about 3000 members of my parish. Every week a few more than 1000 attend one of the services. It’s a good size for my taste.

What about you? How big is your church (synagogue or temple)? What size do you prefer?

 

[Steave]

You are ohh so wrong sir.

When Jacob Was wrestling with God, and finally cezied he saw angels taking up prayers to heaven. It was implied then that Angels did this.

Secondly in the book of revalation the 24 elders hold gold bowls that have the prayers of the saints to them offering them to God.

There is some merrit in asking a saint to pray for you.

The phrase “Praying to” is really liberally used and kinda not the best way of saying it. It would be better said “Talking to” “asking to” pray for us.

Finally in wrapping up my BIBLICAL reasons why we can “Ask saints to pray for us” In the book of James it says, the prayers of a rightous man are better.

                     You shouldnt be so sure of your own belifes sir, listen read yourself, dont listen to people who are lost.

              God Bless all for he is worthy of all our praise

 

[Steave]

Personally, I don’t believe in praying to anyone except God. No were in the Bible does it say to pray to anyone eles. Not Mary , John or any saints. When His disciples asked how do we pray Jesus said you should pray like this, Our Father {not our Mary, not our John, not our saints} I don’t need a middle man to talk to God for me.Mary,John or the saints have no power only God has the power to answer your prayers. Matthew 6:5-15 Jesus teaches about prayer. No were does he say to pray to anyone eles except God, or Our Father. When Jesus died didn’t he open the gates of Heaven and whipe away original sin.
The rightious will go to heaven in a blink of an eye and th e rest will be judged. God will judge those who he didn’t take up to heaven, those who didnt believe in him and are left here on earth for th erapture.

And your talking to me about the bible? How is this biblical lol.

 

[Steave]

Its Leftbehindable
Pax friend

 

[refulgence]

Personally, I don’t believe in praying to anyone except God.

Instead of thinking of it as praying “to” Mary, thinking of it as praying “with” Mary.

For example…

When my company announced layoffs, I asked my family to pray that my job would be spared. Asking people to pray for you is very common. Why shouldn’t I also ask Mary, my relatives in heaven, other saints, etc.? That is intercessory prayer.

 

[Dorothy]

Death does not separate members of the Body of Christ. Just as I can ask my friend who lives next door to pray for me, I can also ask Mary and the saints. We are a family, One Body in Christ.

All those who have died have already been judged, and those who are with the Lord are already enjoying His Presence. They will be re-united with their bodies at the final judgment. They are either with the Lord, or not with Him, and are conscious of it now.

 

[grampsc]

thanks that might help. although he is kind of stubborn… he says she is not holy though. and neither is the church… the catholic church. only God and his word, the bible.??

what can i tell him?

God chose Mary and Jesus was within Mary, so it is undeniable that Mary is holy, else would God place his son in an unholy person? That is why we believe Mary as The Immaculate Conception. So briefly ask your friend, if Mary was/is good enought for Jesus, isn’t that good enough for him?

 

[rev_kevin]

And your talking to me about the bible? How is this biblical lol.

I’m just saying there is no were in the bible that says to pray to anyone except to God.
You can pray to whoever you want to pray to. I’m just pointing it out. And I don’t believe you said it had to be Biblical.

 

[rev_kevin]

Instead of thinking of it as praying “to” Mary, thinking of it as praying “with” Mary.

For example…

When my company announced layoffs, I asked my family to pray that my job would be spared. Asking people to pray for you is very common. Why shouldn’t I also ask Mary, my relatives in heaven, other saints, etc.? That is intercessory prayer.

Good point but the question was “praying to mary” I stick with the question. Asking a family member to pray for you is different than praying to them.

 

[rev_kevin]

You are ohh so wrong sir.

When Jacob Was wrestling with God, and finally cezied he saw angels taking up prayers to heaven. It was implied then that Angels did this.

Secondly in the book of revalation the 24 elders hold gold bowls that have the prayers of the saints to them offering them to God.

There is some merrit in asking a saint to pray for you.

The phrase “Praying to” is really liberally used and kinda not the best way of saying it. It would be better said “Talking to” “asking to” pray for us.

Finally in wrapping up my BIBLICAL reasons why we can “Ask saints to pray for us” In the book of James it says, the prayers of a rightous man are better.

                     You shouldnt be so sure of your own belifes sir, listen read yourself, dont listen to people who are lost.

              God Bless all for he is worthy of all our praise

 

[imjustme]

Instead of thinking of it as praying “to” Mary, thinking of it as praying “with” Mary.

For example…

When my company announced layoffs, I asked my family to pray that my job would be spared. Asking people to pray for you is very common. Why shouldn’t I also ask Mary, my relatives in heaven, other saints, etc.? That is intercessory prayer.

Asking a living brother or sister in Christ to pray for you is ok (assuming they are praying to God directly) but we are not to try to communicate with the dead. The bible tells us not to “call up the dead” for it is an abomination to the Lord.

“When you come into the land which the Lord your God is giving you, you shall not learn to follow the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or** one who calls up the dead**. For all who do these things are an abomination to the Lord, and because of these abominations the Lord your God drives them out from before you.” (Deuteronomy 18:9)

When Jesus was asked how to pray, He said “pray this way…” and gave a perfect outline of how to pray. It begins with calling out to “Our father…”

 

[PJM]

=Brooke -how do i explain to my friend that it is not wrong to pray to the virgin mary?? he says she died like any other person. how can i pray to her if shes not up there with God… everyone dies and will not be in heaven till jesus comes again to judge us. he says that the only people in heaven are of course God and Jesus and enok, elias, and moses.

help??? how do i explain this?

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The “Hail Mary Prayer and the Bible”

James 5: “The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects”

2 Thess. 2: 1 “To this end we always pray for you, that our God may make you worthy of his call, and may fulfill every good resolve and work of faith by his power, 12 so that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and you in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ. “

2 Cor. 9: 14 “while they long for you and pray for you, because of the surpassing grace of God in you.
“Hail Mary Full of grace”

Luke 22: [Jesus speaking] 39 “And he came out, and went, as was his custom, to the Mount of Olives; and the disciples followed him. 40 And when he came to the place he said to them, “Pray that you may not enter into temptation.”

Luke 1: 26 “In the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city of Galilee named Nazareth, 27 to a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin’s name was Mary. 28 And he came to her and said, “Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you!”

“The LORD is with thee”

Luke 1: 34 “And Mary said to the angel, “How shall this be, since I have no husband?” 35 And the angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.

“Blessed are you among [all] women”

Luke 1: 39 “In those days Mary arose and went with haste into the hill country, to a city of Judah, 40 and she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. 41 And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit 42 and she exclaimed with a loud cry, "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb!

“And Blessed be the fruit of YOUR womb…. JESUS!”

Luke 1:43 "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! 43 And why is this granted me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? 44 For behold, when the voice of your greeting came to my ears, the babe in my womb leaped for joy.

“Holy Mary”

Luke 1: 28 “And he came to her and said, “Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you!”

Luke 1: 46 “And Mary said, "My soul magnifies the Lord, 47 and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior, 48 for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden. For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed;”

“Mother of God”

Luke 1: 35 “And the angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.

“Pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death.” AMEN!

This is biblically founded in 2 Mac. Chapter 12: 39 “On the next day, as by that time it had become necessary, Judas and his men went to take up the bodies of the fallen and to bring them back to lie with their kinsmen in the sepulchres of their fathers. 40 Then under the tunic of every one of the dead they found sacred tokens of the idols of Jamnia, which the law forbids the Jews to wear. And it became clear to all that this was why these men had fallen. 41 So they all blessed the ways of the Lord, the righteous Judge, who reveals the things that are hidden; 42 and they turned to prayer, beseeching that the sin which had been committed might be wholly blotted out. And the noble Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves free from sin, for they had seen with their own eyes what had happened because of the sin of those who had fallen. 43 He also took up a collection, man by man, to the amount of two thousand drachmas of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a sin offering. In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the resurrection. 44 For if he were not expecting that those who had fallen would rise again, it would have been superfluous and foolish to pray for the dead. 45 But if he was looking to the splendid reward that is laid up for those who fall asleep in godliness, it was a holy and pious thought. Therefore he made atonement for the dead, that they might be delivered from their sin.”

Now you too are able to see that prayers, including the “Hail Mary” are solidly founded on the bible. What else would you have us prove?

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Love and prayers,

 

[refulgence]

Good point but the question was “praying to mary” I stick with the question. Asking a family member to pray for you is different than praying to them.

…but that is just the point. No Catholic “prays to Mary” but rather asks Mary to pray for him.