Praying with Heretics?

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dominikus28

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Is it a sin to pray with heretics?

I have read websites which state that past Papal documents etc. have said that it is a sin to pray with heretics, and then sedevacantists (mostly) state that JPII and Benedict XVI pray with heretics, therefore they sin.

I believe Pope Benedict XVI is the current valid pope, but I also acknowledge that Popes can make mistakes - is this a mistake? To pray with heretics?
 
If you pray with them making it clear you do not support their heresy, what is wrong with that? Clearly people who know the Pope know that he doesn’t support [insert heresy here].

If anybody prays with someone and gives them the impression that they support their heresy * that would be imprudent but not sinful.

If anybody prays with someone and directly supports their heresy, I daresay they would be a heretic themselves and incur the sin of heresy anyway.*
 
Pre-Vatican II you were not allowed to pray with non-Catholics. This has all changed.
Thank God!
 
pinctor said:
Pre-Vatican II you were not allowed to pray with non-Catholics. This has all changed.
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Proof? Well, there is none. Otherwise, how did the Church grow in numbers in Evangelising others? Your answer is either a direct attack on what you perceive to be the “pre-VII Church” or it’s not nuanced enough.
 
dominikus28 said:
Is it a sin to pray with heretics?

I have read websites which state that past Papal documents etc. have said that it is a sin to pray with heretics, and then sedevacantists (mostly) state that JPII and Benedict XVI pray with heretics, therefore they sin.
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does your source say it is a sin to pray, any kind of prayer, or does it say it is a sin to join in their forms of worship–2 very different things
being present in a worship place is also not the same as participating in worship

without a source no way to discuss
pinctor said:
Pre-Vatican II you were not allowed to pray with non-Catholics. This has all changed.
Thank God!
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source, please
 
puzzleannie said:
does your source say it is a sin to pray, any kind of prayer, or does it say it is a sin to join in their forms of worship–2 very different things
being present in a worship place is also not the same as participating in worship

without a source no way to discuss

source, please
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50 years ago you could not attend a non-Catholic wedding without your Bishop’s OK.
You could not participate in (say) Episcopal Anglican Evensong without incurring ex-communication for ‘communicatio in sacris’. (Unless you told the usher you were there in Westminster Abbey only to hear the music.)
Probably the best source of my knowledge is to have been a Catholic more than 50 yeas ago.
 
I think this is a very wise and profound statement. It’s why I can thoroughly repudiate the actions of Luther and the other Protestant Reformers in splitting from the Church and still hesitate to repudiate my own heritage by unilaterally reuniting myself with Rome. I am not claiming that Pope Benedict would approve of my hesitation, though I think he would understand it.

Edwin
 
If anyone prays with heretics, he is a heretic.
St. Agatho I, SCN:XXI:635
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Heresy: is when we join in prayer with heretics.
Piux XI, D.2199
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Praying with heretics for “unity” is heresy.
Pius IX, D.1685-1687
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No one can pray with heretics and be a Catholic.
St. Agatho, SCN:XI:635
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Praying with false religions for peace is heresy!
Pius XI, MA:1-17
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From:
romancatholicism.org/101-john-paul.htm

I’m just wondering how to reconcile this
 
It’s my understanding that many of these popes said those things in the 1800’s (hundreds of years after the Protestant Reformation). Wouldn’t all of those Protestants be lifelong Protestants too?

I’m having trouble reconciling it too. EIther the Catholic Church is the one and only, true Church for all time or it is not.
 
The_Scott said:
How about from a site that isn’t biased? I can make things up and put it online too.
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The problem is this stuff isn’t made up. They are direct quotes from past popes. As much as I would like to ignore it, I can’t.
 
dominikus28 said:
From:
romancatholicism.org/101-john-paul.htm

I’m just wondering how to reconcile this
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I would encourage you to go to the Vatican website and read the encyclicals for yourself. I just read Mortalium Animos (Encyclical of Pope Pius XI on Religious Unity) - the last one on your list. Not only is that precise phrase “Praying with false religions for peace is heresy!” not in the document, but the argument presented is much different. He seems to be addressing two specific things: groups that treat all religions as equals, and Christian groups that seek “unity” without reconciling themselves to Holy Mother Church. I suspect that upon reading the other documents, I may find the same thing - someone summarized it to fit their beliefs, not what was actually said.
So basically as Link0126 said:
sites like this typically boil down a long nuanced statement from a pope into a fraction of a full sentence and lose all the necessary context in order to falsely claim heresy. I would take these things with a grain of salt.
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baylee said:
The problem is this stuff isn’t made up. They are direct quotes from past popes. As much as I would like to ignore it, I can’t.
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I don’t know what to make of those quotes as well.

There are so many and they can be verified. I know TRUTH doesn’t change; could it be the sinfulness of praying with non Catholics is just a personal opinion of an individual Pope? I mean that these opinions aren’t part of the “infallible” teachings of the Pope? I don’t know if I buy the arguments that all Popes taught the EXACT SAME THING but the people just understood it differently depending on what age they lived in.
 
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