Preparing to tell my dad

[damooster]

I have not yet told my dad that I am entering the Catholic Church, but plan on doing so the week before my baptism (I’m taking the week off to visit him).

I want to be able to (calmly) prove to him that we are not as bad as he thinks we are. One of his biggest complaints is that he believes Catholics kill Jesus at every Mass. What exactly is he talking about and how do I refute this?

Thanks.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

Ah, I get it.

Catholics receive the Body and Blood of Christ.

That’s actually an interesting take coming from your dad. I usually get people saying Catholics are vampires. And I think, Oh, please! Vampires are way cooler.

But, yeah, “killing Christ every week” is just a derogatory phrase for receiving the Eucharist and believing in a literal transubstantiation.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[damooster]

But, yeah, “killing Christ every week” is just a derogatory phrase for receiving the Eucharist and believing in a literal transubstantiation.

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

I see. I asked because I heard this was a common misconception.

Thanks.

 

[pray4priests]

The accusation that Catholics kill Jesus every time we celebrate the Mass is meant to be a serious attack on the Church, just as the claim that we are cannibals. What the accusers never seem to realize is that, if this is the true presence of Christ, truly His Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity given as a gift to us sinners, then the Church must have the power from God to consecrate it in the first place. Its kind of like the Pharisees watching Jesus heal the man crippled from birth, but only seeing that He did it on the sabbath.

What the accusers fail to realize is that we are subject to time, but God is not. That is, while the host is consecrated each Mass, Jesus dies once for all on Good Friday. God enables us to peer through that window he opens between time and eternity, to participate (so briefly) in that timeless perfect existence of God. Jesus dies only once - and God permits us to revisit that one time, and His resurrection, again and again because He loves us so.

Welcome to the Church Militant!

 

[Luke65]

The accusation that Catholics kill Jesus every time we celebrate the Mass is meant to be a serious attack on the Church, just as the claim that we are cannibals. What the accusers never seem to realize is that, if this is the true presence of Christ, truly His Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity given as a gift to us sinners, then the Church must have the power from God to consecrate it in the first place. Its kind of like the Pharisees watching Jesus heal the man crippled from birth, but only seeing that He did it on the sabbath.

What the accusers fail to realize is that we are subject to time, but God is not. That is, while the host is consecrated each Mass, Jesus dies once for all on Good Friday. God enables us to peer through that window he opens between time and eternity, to participate (so briefly) in that timeless perfect existence of God. Jesus dies only once - and God permits us to revisit that one time, and His resurrection, again and again because He loves us so.

Welcome to the Church Militant!

Well put.

Damooster, in addition to that, you might want to ask your dad what this means:

“For from the rising of the sun to its setting My name shall be great among the nations, and in every place incense shall be offered to My name, and indeed a pure offering; for My name shall be great among the nations, says the Lord of hosts.” (Malachi 1:11)

Only the Catholic Church fulfills this prophecy. Only Jesus is pure; and His Church offers up His pure sacrifice every day, complete with incense! To our Father.

 

[FrDavid96]

I have not yet told my dad that I am entering the Catholic Church, but plan on doing so the week before my baptism (I’m taking the week off to visit him).

I want to be able to (calmly) prove to him that we are not as bad as he thinks we are. One of his biggest complaints is that he believes Catholics kill Jesus at every Mass. What exactly is he talking about and how do I refute this?

Thanks.

damooster,
You’re not alone in this. What you’re describing sounds a lot like what St Justin the Martyr had to deal with circa 150. Look through his writings, they’re relatively easy to find (copyright expired about 1,750 years ago).

 

[VociMike]

Question #1 for your dad: “Does Jesus want to be killed at every Mass?”

Question #2: “Who is more powerful, Jesus or a priest?”

It should follow immediately that, even if the priest wanted to kill Jesus at every Mass, it wouldn’t happen.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

I have not yet told my dad that I am entering the Catholic Church, but plan on doing so the week before my baptism (I’m taking the week off to visit him).

I want to be able to (calmly) prove to him that we are not as bad as he thinks we are. One of his biggest complaints is that he believes Catholics kill Jesus at every Mass. What exactly is he talking about and how do I refute this?

Thanks.

welcome home.

i found the best way to deal with the protestants in my life, specifically the most anti catholic ones, was to live my faith out loud, to love them and not relent.

good luck

 

[Catholicc]

I have not yet told my dad that I am entering the Catholic Church, but plan on doing so the week before my baptism (I’m taking the week off to visit him).

I want to be able to (calmly) prove to him that we are not as bad as he thinks we are. One of his biggest complaints is that he believes Catholics kill Jesus at every Mass. What exactly is he talking about and how do I refute this?

Thanks.

Print out this tract and give it to him:
catholic.com/library/Christ_in_the_Eucharist.asp

 

[Verisimilitude]

And I think, Oh, please! Vampires are way cooler.

Vampires are way cooler than Catholics? How do you get that? Vampires can’t see themselves in a mirror and shy away from the sun. Result: messy hair and pasty white skin. Not cool.

Catholics (intent) are the reflection of Christ and prefer the light to the darkness. Result: Cool people.

When vampires are mad at you they bite your neck or send the wolfman to get you. Result: A biten neck or the wolfman sheds on your floor. Not cool.

Catholics forgive your anger and offer you to invite the Holy Spirit to make you less angry at others or self. Result: Cool people.

Vampires also wear black with a little bit of red. Goth is not cool.

To the OP: Welcome and others gave some great advice. I just wanted to clear up how much cooler Catholics are compared to vampires.

 

[Odell]

I would Also tell him sonit Jesus apearing in revelation as a lamb slain

This is because he is still offering that same sacrafice

That was before the foundstun of the world don’t know the verse but someone can help

Also do what Tim Staples did and just ask what are the problems they have with the church and politly respond with scripture

 

[Th0t]

give him some websites that show Eucharistic miracles.

 

[Goth_Catholic]

Vampires are way cooler than Catholics? How do you get that? Vampires can’t see themselves in a mirror and shy away from the sun. Result: messy hair and pasty white skin. Not cool.

Catholics (intent) are the reflection of Christ and prefer the light to the darkness. Result: Cool people.

When vampires are mad at you they bite your neck or send the wolfman to get you. Result: A biten neck or the wolfman sheds on your floor. Not cool.

Catholics forgive your anger and offer you to invite the Holy Spirit to make you less angry at others or self. Result: Cool people.

Vampires also wear black with a little bit of red. Goth is not cool.

To the OP: Welcome and others gave some great advice. I just wanted to clear up how much cooler Catholics are compared to vampires.

Erm, I’m Irish, my pasty complexion is the result of polygenetic inheritence of several recessive alleles that code for skin color, and a desire to not get skin cancer. I very much prefer darkness over light.

Goth is very much reflected in Catholicism, and our priests wear black. (Edited).

 

[Junebug999]

Hi fellow 2009 Tiber Swimmer – I admire your courage to tell you dad – I’ve let the family grapevine tell him. Unfortunately the disbelief that has taught people like our dads that Eucharist is “killing Christ every Sunday” are the same people that believe miracles stopped with the end of the apostles (they also unfortunately believe that the Bible appeared “SOMEhow” at the time of the apostles since they also don’t believe in a Church authority that determined what the Bible would be.

Sigh…I think our best witness has to be living our life, and speaking up in love. I do have to have the conversation with each of my parents because of my concern for their souls, but so far this is in the praying stages (hoping the Holy Sprit will soften up the ground).

Best wishes to you with your conversations with your father, I will keep you in my prayers (as Catholic and as vain and repititious as those may be)

 

[Randy_Carson]

I have not yet told my dad that I am entering the Catholic Church, but plan on doing so the week before my baptism (I’m taking the week off to visit him).

I want to be able to (calmly) prove to him that we are not as bad as he thinks we are. One of his biggest complaints is that he believes Catholics kill Jesus at every Mass. What exactly is he talking about and how do I refute this?

Thanks.

The following articles will help:

**Is the Mass a Sacrifice? **
By Jason Evert
catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0109sbs.asp

Is the Mass a True Sacrifice?
By Kenneth J. Howell
catholic.com/thisrock/2003/0309sbs.asp

The Institution of the Mass
catholic.com/library/Institution_of_the_Mass.asp

"Once For All"
By Mark Brumley
catholic.com/thisrock/1990/9006chap.asp

 

[Verisimilitude]

Erm, I’m Irish, my pasty complexion is the result of polygenetic inheritence of several recessive alleles that code for skin color, and a desire to not get skin cancer. I very much prefer darkness over light.

Genetics have little to do with fictional vampires who hide from the sun. I am probably whiter than you.

Goth is very much reflected in Catholicism, and our priests wear black.

Goth as practiced by kids today has zero to do with Catholicism.
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

So bite me.

Vampire reference or other?

 

[Goth_Catholic]

Genetics have little to do with fictional vampires who hide from the sun. I am probably whiter than you.

The reason the myths about vampires exist is partly due to genetics.

Goth as practiced by kids today has zero to do with Catholicism.

Oh really? Prove it. And Emo is not nor will it ever be Goth. Research cultures before you slam them.

Vampire reference or other?

Pfft.

 

[Church_Militant]

The following articles will help:

Is the Mass a Sacrifice?
By Jason Evert

Is the Mass a True Sacrifice?
By Kenneth J. Howell

The Institution of the Mass

"Once For All"
By Mark Brumley

Best answer of all!
Study these articles carefully because Randy has offered you the only post so far that has given you the correct and in-depth information you need.

As often happens, most of us fumble when it comes to apologetics responses because we fail to understand precisely what it is that our opponent is objecting to.

Your Dad is objecting to the sacrifice of the Mass.

Not the Real Presence in the Eucharist, though that may well come along behind it.
Nor Eucharistic miracles, which he would simply oppose by asserting that they could be supernatural deceptions of demons. (Something BTW, that the church is careful to make a part of its investigations of every apparition and miracle.)

No, this is all about the Mass, and the fact that we believe that it is a re-presentation of the once for all sacrifice on Calvary. God is timeless, and that sacrifice is as well because its efficacy “rolls out” (so to speak) across time in both directions. Back to Adam & Eve and then forward beyond us all to the very last soul born before Our Lord returns at the end of time.

The sacrificial nature of the Eucharist is reflected in the prayers at every Mass.

Priest: Pray, my brothers and sisters, that our sacrifice
may be acceptable to God, the almighty Father.

All: May the Lord accept the sacrifice at your hands,
for the praise and glory of his name,
for our good, and the good of all his Church.

If you read the letter of Ignatius to the church at Smyrna you’ll see that even then the church recognized that the Mass was a sacrifice.

The Catechism teaches:

1322 The holy Eucharist completes Christian initiation. Those who have been raised to the dignity of the royal priesthood by Baptism and configured more deeply to Christ by Confirmation participate with the whole community in the Lord’s own sacrifice by means of the Eucharist.
1323 "At the Last Supper, on the night he was betrayed, our Savior instituted the Eucharistic sacrifice of his Body and Blood. This he did in order to perpetuate the sacrifice of the cross throughout the ages until he should come again, and so to entrust to his beloved Spouse, the Church, a memorial of his death and resurrection: a sacrament of love, a sign of unity, a bond of charity, a Paschal banquet ‘in which Christ is consumed, the mind is filled with grace, and a pledge of future glory is given to us.’"135

1330 The *memorial *of the Lord’s Passion and Resurrection.
The Holy Sacrifice, because it makes present the one sacrifice of Christ the Savior and includes the Church’s offering. The terms holy sacrifice of the Mass, “sacrifice of praise,” spiritual sacrifice, pure and holy sacrifice are also used,150 since it completes and surpasses all the sacrifices of the Old Covenant.
The Holy and Divine Liturgy, because the Church’s whole liturgy finds its center and most intense expression in the celebration of this sacrament; in the same sense we also call its celebration the Sacred Mysteries. We speak of the Most Blessed Sacrament because it is the Sacrament of sacraments. The Eucharistic species reserved in the tabernacle are designated by this same name.

V. THE SACRAMENTAL SACRIFICE THANKSGIVING, MEMORIAL, PRESENCE
1356 If from the beginning Christians have celebrated the Eucharist and in a form whose substance has not changed despite the great diversity of times and liturgies, it is because we know ourselves to be bound by the command the Lord gave on the eve of his Passion: "Do this in remembrance of me."183
1357 We carry out this command of the Lord by celebrating the memorial of his sacrifice. In so doing, we offer to the Father what he has himself given us: the gifts of his creation, bread and wine which, by the power of the Holy Spirit and by the words of Christ, have become the body and blood of Christ. Christ is thus really and mysteriously made present.
1358 We must therefore consider the Eucharist as:

• thanksgiving and praise to the Father;
• the sacrificial memorial of *Christ *and his Body;
• the presence of Christ by the power of his word and of his Spirit.

I urge you to look this all up and read this section of the Catechism from 1322-1419. You’re going to need it.

 

[Verisimilitude]

Pfft.

I was having a little fun with an Atheist who was having a little fun with Catholics. You seem overly sensitive and as not to derail this thread any further we can end it here.