Priest explains why yoga and new age are dangerous

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Reminiscing, Fr Joe said it was in 1981 that he first treated three patients from Mother Theresa’s Home in Mumbai for addiction, and all three got cured. ** Mother Theresa was so happy that she called him to Kolkatta and offered him her male orphanage to open his second and one of the largest rehabilitation centres in Kolkatta.**
Priest advocates use of Yoga to combat HIV-AIDS

timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/goa/Priest-advocates-use-of-yoga-to-combat-HIV-AIDS/articleshow/4151984.cms

If he used Yoga in curing these patients of addiction in this case and Mother Theresa approved, it makes you wonder. I don’t want to read into it things that are not there. Perhaps there is more to the story.

It’s interesting that Yoga terms are used to describe what Mother Theresa did:
I guess the thing about Mother Teresa is that her life is a testament to that truth that’s important to understand in doing this work: that there’s no separation between knowing (Jnana), loving (Bhakti), and doing (Karma).
It would be interesting to see if Mother Teresa ever made any specific statements on Yoga but surely, she knew that the Priest in the first example was using Yoga.
 
You simply make yoga a scapegoat for every evil. The warnings are general guidelines that have more to do with one’s motives and attitudes than practices themselves.

I would appreciate it if you would not insert (your words) into my quote.

Yoga does not invite false spirits. Why do you even think that? Because someone told you? It certainly isn’t Church teaching.

You never answerd my question about what false spirit this woman is inviting.
http://myperformancerehab.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/longsitting.jpg
The spiritual path of yoga is to unite with ‘the absolute’, ’ the absolute self’, that everyone and everything is god, yoga is a religion that predates Hinduism. That was why it was created for. Every pose and mantra is to achieve this.
 
Testimony from the Ephesians website I quotes earlier

Madam Choy Poh Shon (from Malaysia) is the member of Wesley Methodist Church, She wrote a book “Confessions of an Ex-Yoga teacher”.
This is what Madam Choy Poh Shon’s told my friend, when she went to visit her:
On Wednesday, I attended a talk by an ex-yoga teacher, Madam Poh Shon Choy, who sold her yoga centre (earning lots of money giving yoga lessons) and severed all ties with yoga. She urges us to inform relatives, friends, Family members, etc., NOT to get involved at all.
For those who had taken up yoga lessons (hot yoga, power yoga, pe-la-tei, so on), repent and ask God for forgiveness.
Many claimed that they only join to keep fit, only doing the exercise poses and not meditation.
Christians think it is OK so long they don’t participate in the Meditation part. Madam Choy explains that the central of Yoga (originated from Hinduism) is the spirit of Kundalini (spirit of snake or cobra).
Yoga poses are actually animal poses (e.g. camel, rabbit,). All these look very normal and harmless, stretching and exercising. But the danger is, once a person does such poses, the spirit of Kundalini (the snake is in a coiled position) is stimulated or aroused. As the persons goes from basic to intermediate to advance stage of yoga lessons (still not meditation yet), the coiled “snake” will be aroused further. It will rise and rise further.
There are seven centres in the human body – starting from the navel.
The final centre is the part between the eye brows (known to many as the third eye). When the spirit is aroused to the final centre, the third eye will be opened. This is called the full enlightenment.
The first thing the person sees is demons. For some, they will become insane seeing such horrifying demons.
For others, they are not afraid and will have the power to fore-tell other people’s health, problems, luck, etc (like a fortune teller). In fact, they manipulate and control other people.
The meditation part will come in very subtle.

Madam Choy said she was approached by a couple who found her contact from the yellow pages and told her they wanted to teach her new things about yoga.
She was very keen and sat under their teaching. She learnt how to meditate and it must be done in odd hours of the day (past midnight). So she tried. She actually felt a wriggling feeling in her stomach! She also mentioned that her third eye was opened. She could see her own aura (electric fields in all human beings).
Her turning point came when God caused her spiritual eyes to open – she witnessed a lady being delivered, wriggling like a snake on the floor. Madam Choy thanked God for being gracious to her; she took 1-2 weeks to be delivered. She knows of a lady who took 3 months to be cleansed!!
It is a sad thing; there is even yoga lessons for children.
In the States, a Methodist started the Christian yoga. However, there are some believers who still continue, saying that they find no harm after doing yoga for 3 years.
Madam Choy says it is our soul that is in danger. The evil one will try all ways to ensnare/trap Christians.
Someone in the class raised a question! If we have the Holy Spirit, how can the spirit of kundalini be aroused?
Madam Choy replied our God is a holy God; the Holy Spirit will be grieved and will depart. God cannot be mocked.
God’s spirit left King Saul when he disobeyed God. To God, rebellion spirit is witchcraft.
We are not against yoga teachers, yoga students but we are fighting against powers, principalities in the Spiritual realm.
Let’s be on guard, be aware! May Jesus Holy Spirit be with all HIS children and also guide us at all time to be careful. God Bless all those reading this. Elizabeth
 
Testimony from the Ephesians website I posted earlier

I used to exercise to a popular kick-boxing DVD which helped me lose weight and get into shape. But one thing I did not like about it was that during the warm-ups and cool-downs the instructor talked about making a ball out of the air surrounding your mid-section, that is, making a ball out of energy centered over one’s gut. The instructor would ask us to move this ball, as if it had real substance, from left to right and so on. There were other types of stretching, breathing, and insight that this instructor “preached” that sounded spiritual in nature. Do you know if the energy ball exercise is derived from yoga?
As a teenager, many years ago, I lost 50 pounds one summer by doing yoga and by controlling what I ate. I honestly believe that through this yoga a demonic influence was introduced into my
life. I had learned yoga from a TV show and there was one instance where I was “displaced”, while being instructed. What I mean is, in what I thought was just a few seconds, 10 minutes had passed and I was physically in a different position on the floor from where I started. It was if I had not moved, but the room moved.
From that time on until my late twenties I had to battle demons that held me down in my bed, uttered curses, and caused dissention between me and my wife to be. I also became interested in occultic matters; not that I wanted to delve into those religions, but I wanted to know about them, which as you have stated before, can be very dangerous. For this reason, I believe, a demon showed itself to me once–the scariest moment in my life.

Luckily these attacks ended when I returned to attending mass regularly and got rid of occultic books, and that was almost 20 years ago.
So I wanted to know if I exercise to this kick-boxing DVD again, can I ignore the energy-ball part, or do you think this is harmless? Or should I just find another exercise program? I don’t want to see a demon again! -Ron
 
The spiritual path of yoga is to unite with ‘the absolute’, ’ the absolute self’, that everyone and everything is god, yoga is a religion that predates Hinduism. That was why it was created for. Every pose and mantra is to achieve this.
One thing I know I believe in, sourcing what I say!
 
Another testimony from the Ephesians website against the occult in new age practices

I know many will hate me and call me all kinds of names for speaking out about this but exposing the truth is far more important than what anyone thinks. I would have been the same way, so very defensive if any one had told me what I am about to reveal while I was still in it. I will be talking about Isha Yoga, its roots, Sadhguru aka Jaggi Vasudev (the Founder), and my involvement and experience in it. First I’d like to say I believe there are sincere people that are truly searching and sacrificing themselves that are following Isha Yoga, but I tell you out of love and for the love of truth that it is not what it seems. Even if you get angry at viewing this information, and you think that the Bible is a lie created by men and those believing in it are highly indoctrinated (pretty much my sentiments before), and you will not take any biblical scripture as truth, I ask that you please, please read this until the end. I will be touching on the lies and fraud of Isha Yoga, but covering more in depth the true spiritual force behind the establishment as well as yoga and Hinduism in general.

I am an Indian woman. I was born in India and grew up in the USA. I have been involved with eastern philosophy and various traditions of Hinduism, Jainism, and a mingling of them both for most of my life. I also had a “new age” mentality and have read and studied many scriptures of the Upanishads, Gita, and many, many (too many to count) writings of eastern “spiritual masters.” I was offended by Christians who would tell me Jesus is the truth, the life, the way and would argue and debate them. I was always interested in helping others and considered myself to be a good person (in my own eyes) but still in need of something deeper. A very sensitive person in many ways. I meditated regularly even before Isha Yoga. I will tell you that I was immediately drawn to Isha Yoga given my background and became deeply involved as I progressed all the way from Inner Engineering to BSP (Bhavana Spandana Program) to Samyama and everything in-between (Shoonya, Hatha, Shakti Chalana, etc).
 
Indian woman testimony continued (from Ephesians website)

At that time I thought that Jesus was just another great teacher. I had no clue who He truly is. I experienced shaking and twitching and groaning during most of the programs as many did (if they didn’t they at least witnessed others who did). I was excited as I believed this to be a sure sign that I was getting in touch with universal energy or releasing karma and getting closer to reaching new dimensions towards the enlightenment of my soul. With each program I felt like I was getting more in tune. I was a main volunteer at every program I could get to, even using my own money to fly to Tennessee for BSP every chance I got (several times). I believed the lie that through my own works I could attain liberation if I was committed enough. Plus the fact that I was actually feeling something happening in my system was further evidence to me that I was surely on the right path. I was becoming aware of the money minded politics that take place at the higher levels but made excuses that any institution will have its flaws and that it is not Sadhguru’s fault and he may not even know about it. What I came to know is that the core of the whole thing revolves around deceit and lies both in the worldly material way and also in the most important spiritual way. I will go in depth and explain further below. For me, my “well being” was slowly degenerating while doing high level Isha Yoga programs in India (I was practicing correctly as told to me by several instructors) to the point of a horrible condition. I sought help while there and upon returning to the USA. I while in very poor health made it to a local talk that was given by Sadhguru. I approached Sadhguru afterward (people were all around him) and started, “I am not well, I was in the Isha Ashram in India and…” when he immediately told me to “shhhhh.” There were other people attending the talk an earshot away that he certainly did not want to hear any bad publicity that might dissuade them from Isha or the India Ashram in particular. Bad experiences are ignored and hushed (on a quick side-note, I remember at one of the programs a lady stood up and shared how after doing the practice she could feel the presence of entities in her room and weird feelings in her system and it scared her. There was no response given by the teacher about it as she quickly moved on and asked the rest of the class, “Does anyone have any good positive experiences to share?”) Anyway, I was basically told to do more yoga by Sadhguru. No amount of yoga or meditations (of any form), or any advice directly from Sadhguru or teachers, no amount of chanting, positive affirmations, or visualizations, calling on Hindu gods or other “gurus”, NOTHING helped me. The Jesus Christ of the Bible (the Christian view) I thought was a figment of western people’s deluded imaginations as I held the belief that he was just another “enlightened master” among many. However it was ONLY when I cried out to Jesus Christ asking forgiveness of my sins did my whole world, my perspective and everything as I knew it change. For the slightly longer version of my journey and what happened to me, look towards the bottom of this document in the section titled “My Testimony.”

Isha Yoga is not just a money scam although that is a part of it certainly. There are truly spiritual principalities involved. But it is from the occult. For definition of “occult” see en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult. As I mentioned I was actually feeling something happening in my system. I emotionally, physically, and mentally felt change that took on different forms. Sometimes I would laugh, cry, feel euphoria, twitch, grunt/groan, shake, dance, roll eyes, breathe different, gain supernatural energy, gasp, hop up and down, etc. This is very common throughout the programs (and many yoga programs taught by other “mystics” as well) and I was certainly not alone in such expressions. The truth is it was actually spirits/demons altering my system as I opened pathways through the practices for them to enter in and yoke with me. It was NOT spiritual advancement toward “enlightenment” or any indication of spiritual progress whatsoever. The monks at the Ashram at one time may have displayed similar expressions but no longer do. They are quite still. Sadhguru says this is because they are more seasoned yogis and have learned to control energy through doing the high-level practices for so long. The fact is that these people have become the personalities of the various spirits invoked and invited. It is a deeper level of possession in which the personality of the person has been overtaken in a zombie like way although it may SEEMINGLY look like it is for the better or more peaceful. In Isha Yoga (as with many other yogic traditions) we are taught an invocation (the common invocation is the one that starts “sahana vavatu…”) to be recited before doing a “sadhana” (such as Shambhavi Mahamudra). It is openly called for what it is as the term used to describe it by Isha Foundation is “invocation.” There are even cd’s sold at the Isha Yoga shop with the invocations on them (see picture).
Invocation is defined as the following in Wikipedia: “An invocation (from the Latin verb invocare “to call on, invoke, to give”) may take the form of: Supplication, prayer or spell. A form of possession. Command or conjuration. Self-identification with certain spirits…
The word “possession” is used here in its neutral form to mean “a state (potentially psychological) in which an individual’s normal personality is replaced by another”. This is also sometimes known as ‘aspecting’… Possessive invocation may be attempted singly or, as is often the case in Wicca, in pairs - with one person doing the invocation (reciting the liturgy or prayers and acting as anchor), and the other person being invoked (allowing themselves to become a vessel for the spirit or deity).
 
Continued Indian woman testimony

Deception is the name of the game. Yoga is NOT what it appears to be dear friends…I tell
you from personal experience. Christian Yoga is an oxymoron.
I Corinthians 10:21: Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord’s table, and of the table of devils.
Yoga is not just stretching or physical exercise as is the common deception. The only thing that benefits all aspects of your life is godliness.
I Timothy 4:8: For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.
 
This Father Joseph Perreira certainly got involved and apparently worked with Mother Teresa.

http://vidasimples.abril.com.br/imagem/fatherjoe_materia.jpg

He’s really into Yoga, it seems he hails from the part of India, Goa, that was colonized by the Portuguese.

vidasimples.abril.com.br/temas/padre-iogue-799156.shtml

This webpage is from Brazil, obviously, another Portuguese-speaking nation.
Yes that priest may be for yoga, but Fr Gabriel Amorthe retired head exorcist of the Vatican and retired head of the International Association of Exorcists, and honourary President life member of the International Association of exorcists has said in interviews: Yoga is satanic. Yoga can lead to demonic oppression.
He has to have reason to say this. He has performed thousands of exorcisms he has claimed from his book and confronted spirits himself in the process.
 
OurLadyServant, like I said, you and the Ephesians website are simply making a scapegoat of yoga with hearsay “testimonies” that prove nothing. Please refer to actual church documents. And you still have not answerd my question about what false spirit the woman is inviting.
 
OurLadyServant, like I said, you and the Ephesians website are simply making a scapegoat of yoga with hearsay “testimonies” that prove nothing. Please refer to actual church documents. And you still have not answerd my question about what false spirit the woman is inviting.
I answered that the mantras and poses of yoga (an actual religion) are to unite with a spirit called the ‘Universal Self’ the ‘everything is god,’ that is god, he is god, that thing is god,
Not the Holy Spirit.

Church documents above mentioned said there are parts of eastern mysticism incompatible with Christianity. And yes it mentions also new age and Transcedental meditation. Which are both occult. The church has not given judgement as you said. But the church has said the above have concepts incompatible with christianity
 
Thank you for a post that is making some sense and can give us a better footing for discusion.
Yes, in India there are many gods and many “options” of belief. But I think all those gods are viewed as manifestations of one god, Brahman which has both a personal and impersonal aspect. And you are right. the Catholic Church does not teach that we are to accept their beliefs and somehow graft them on to our own. But rather simply to respect them while also being clear of our differences.
So we are on the same page in terms of how to relate to members of other faiths if subjects concerning faith come up with them (how often they would in reality I don’t know). This is important though for evangelisation as well as peaceful accord and moving forward in terms of inter-religious discussion.
But about using ways of worship we can still have some common ground. Inscense, for example, is used in almost every religious worship. Bells and hand gestures are also common.
This is what complicates the whole subject of yoga, I think, which is why the start was a bit of a mess, because there are various elements to consider - this is not just an exercise thought up in the West, its origin manifested in Eastern religions so there are a few factors here. But I’ll try to remain objective. Certainly, some objects used in faith for worship, such as bell ringing etc…has in themselves, as a bell being rung, no automatic link to the faith itself until applied as such. So here we agree.
I do not think you will find much in church teaching about demons linked ot other religions or gods. I think there is far more danger in worshipping false dieties such as consumerism, materialism and pride.
I am going to look at the links you provided. Will you then have a peek at the spiritualdirection.com links I provided please?

spiritualdirection.com/2014/0…pective-part-i

spiritualdirection.com/2014/0…ective-part-ii

spiritualdirection.com/2014/0…ctive-part-iii.

I will have another look as I need to check them out again too.

(underlined) - absolutely agreed. But these things will always be around as they reflect the superficial selfish aspects of human nature. My angle here at the moment is that I don’t think they are as disconnected as you might believe but I have no definite conclusions, yet.
Post something official? I have posted from and linked to the three major official documents: Nostra Aetate, LETTER TO THE BISHOPS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH ON SOME ASPECTS OF CHRISTIAN MEDITATION and JESUS CHRIST, THE BEARER OF THE WATER OF LIFE
And they have been dismissed.
How about we read them together and share observations?
Quite a lot to be going on with. I’ll post or you can post assessments of the documents as I think this is still related to the thread. Some things to chew on anyway.

One other thing, I don’t think it is fair to dismiss OurLadysServant’s opinions because they are very black and white. This outlook can help discussion in terms of points to raise and I think OurLadysServant also does provide good explanations that fit into discussion. If points are raised then they can be looked at. I think we could try to be all inclusive here, so even if we don’t end up agreeing, at least we have achieved something else maybe more important!
 
I answered that the mantras and poses of yoga (an actual religion) are to unite with a spirit called the ‘Universal Self’ the ‘everything is god,’ that is god, he is god, that thing is god,
Not the Holy Spirit.

Church documents above mentioned said there are parts of eastern mysticism incompatible with Christianity. And yes it mentions also new age and Transcedental meditation. Which are both occult. The church has not given judgement as you said. But the church has said the above have concepts incompatible with christianity
Do you mean to say that this spirit of “Universal Self” can then posess a body when someone stretches to touch their toes or spread their arms, or sit with their legs crossed, or for that matter even stand up straight as in Tadasana?

Yes, there are parts of eastern mysticism incompatible with Christianity just as there are parts of everything incompatible with christianity. It is the philosophy that is incompatible.

And as for Fr Amorth: here is something to consider by Fr Francis Clooney:

First, mere recriminations against the religion of another are just about never acceptable or useful. No Catholic likes it if the Eucharist is written off as merely “priestcraft” or “patriarchal machinations” or even the venerable “hocus pocus,” and it is hard to imagine that it helps in any way to burden the millennia-old theory and practice of yoga with the deadly charge of being Satanic. And it is a really bad idea to insult a nearly billion Hindus – who see Hinduism as having a special affinity to yoga – by charges of Satanism that echo centuries of heated Christian attacks on Hinduism, and I hope Church leaders in Rome have instructed Fr. Amorth not to make such sweeping charges.

Second, if one is a professional exorcist, one may indeed see everything in light of that profession, and so it is not surprising that Fr. Amorth sees the devil at work everywhere; perhaps it is his default explanation of the woes that afflict us. Others might appeal to literary or philosophical measures of worth, but the exorcist sees things in his own way. To others this will seem odd, exaggerated, and this is all the more reason to be careful when speaking to a wider audience who do not share one’s profession or expertise, but see the world through other legitimate lenses.

Francis X. Clooney, S.J., is the Parkman Professor of Divinity at Harvard Divinity School, where he has taught since 2005, after teaching for 21 years at Boston College. Since 2010 he is the Director of Harvard’s Center for the Study of World Religions. He is the author most recently of Comparative Theology: Deep Learning Across Religious Borders (Wiley-Blackwell, 2010), and of the forthcoming His Hiding Place is Darkness: A Hindu-Catholic Theopoetics of Divine Absence (Stanford University Press). He was the first president of the International Society for Hindu-Christian Studies, was elected a member of the British Academy in 2011 and, from 1998 to 2004, was the coordinator for interreligious dialogue for the Society of Jesus in the United States.

americamagazine.org/content/all-things/fr-amorths-yoga-and-devil
 
Yes that priest may be for yoga, but Fr Gabriel Amorthe retired head exorcist of the Vatican and retired head of the International Association of Exorcists, and honourary President life member of the International Association of exorcists has said in interviews: Yoga is satanic. Yoga can lead to demonic oppression.
He has to have reason to say this. He has performed thousands of exorcisms he has claimed from his book and confronted spirits himself in the process.
We know your opinion, I’m still interested in post #136 which I quoted you claiming:
The Vatican has up on their website that it’s occult and it is a spiritual worship of multi gods (through the postures and chants), it’s like using a ouiji board -no matter what reason it’s an act of devil worship, Fr Gabriel Amorthe exorcist of the Vatican said the devil is in yoga,
and people haven’t a clue.
I still haven’t seen where the “Vatican has up on their website that it’s occult and it is spiritual worship of multi-gods (etc.)”

So where is this on the Vatican website? Or is this just your opinion?
 
We know your opinion, I’m still interested in post #136 which I quoted you claiming:

I still haven’t seen where the “Vatican has up on their website that it’s occult and it is spiritual worship of multi-gods (etc.)”

So where is this on the Vatican website? Or is this just your opinion?

That’s Fr Gabriel Amorthe’s opinion. The retired head exorcist of the Vatican and International Association of exorcists. I would think his opinion gives gravity to this.

I said the Vatican has said there are aspects incompatible with christianity. It’s in that church document. Also I said the church has in this document New age and Transcedental meditation.

I’m saying that is it not a bit of a warning to put yoga along with new age in a document?

(New age is occult because it’s claiming healers, miracle workers and out of body experiences).

Two deliverance evangelists in my country condemn yoga as possibly leading to spiritual oppression, and they are in full time deliverance ministry
 
Do you mean to say that this spirit of “Universal Self” can then posess a body when someone stretches to touch their toes or spread their arms, or sit with their legs crossed, or for that matter even stand up straight as in Tadasana?

Yes, there are parts of eastern mysticism incompatible with Christianity just as there are parts of everything incompatible with christianity. It is the philosophy that is incompatible.

And as for Fr Amorth: here is something to consider by Fr Francis Clooney:

First, mere recriminations against the religion of another are just about never acceptable or useful. No Catholic likes it if the Eucharist is written off as merely “priestcraft” or “patriarchal machinations” or even the venerable “hocus pocus,” and it is hard to imagine that it helps in any way to burden the millennia-old theory and practice of yoga with the deadly charge of being Satanic. And it is a really bad idea to insult a nearly billion Hindus – who see Hinduism as having a special affinity to yoga – by charges of Satanism that echo centuries of heated Christian attacks on Hinduism, and I hope Church leaders in Rome have instructed Fr. Amorth not to make such sweeping charges.

Second, if one is a professional exorcist, one may indeed see everything in light of that profession, and so it is not surprising that Fr. Amorth sees the devil at work everywhere; perhaps it is his default explanation of the woes that afflict us. Others might appeal to literary or philosophical measures of worth, but the exorcist sees things in his own way. To others this will seem odd, exaggerated, and this is all the more reason to be careful when speaking to a wider audience who do not share one’s profession or expertise, but see the world through other legitimate lenses.

Francis X. Clooney, S.J., is the Parkman Professor of Divinity at Harvard Divinity School, where he has taught since 2005, after teaching for 21 years at Boston College. Since 2010 he is the Director of Harvard’s Center for the Study of World Religions. He is the author most recently of Comparative Theology: Deep Learning Across Religious Borders (Wiley-Blackwell, 2010), and of the forthcoming His Hiding Place is Darkness: A Hindu-Catholic Theopoetics of Divine Absence (Stanford University Press). He was the first president of the International Society for Hindu-Christian Studies, was elected a member of the British Academy in 2011 and, from 1998 to 2004, was the coordinator for interreligious dialogue for the Society of Jesus in the United States.

americamagazine.org/content/all-things/fr-amorths-yoga-and-devil
St Paul and St Peter had disagreements in the bible. Paul corrected Peter in front of some Pharisees. And Peter wrote in one of his letters that Paul’s writings were rather wordy and difficult to understand. Paul later had an argument with Barnabas and they parted seperately.
 
OurLadysServant, I admire your fervour, but what I am finding after a meeting of like minds to reach peaceful ground, is that from reading your dialogue with some posters, they have simply reposted arguments to you, which I already tried to counter-argue in previous pages, and received no response. So posts that are due consideration are being ignored and you might end up going around in circles. Your points might be ignored, IOW.
 
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