Priest Skips Obligatory Memorial

[drabikmr]

Hello

Just a question for someone who might be curious.

This past Saturday morning I attended a Mass celebrated in an old Polish Immgrant parish manned by Polish priests of the Society of Christ (S. Ch.). The parish is somewhere in the midwest - I don’t want to say exactly where as I happen to be a member of this parish.

The day, according to the proper of seasons in both the Sacramentary and the Liturgy of the Hours, was the obligatory memorial of St. Josaphat, Bishop and Martyr. (1595-1623).

This Saint was Polish born and of the Eastern Rite (Orothodox) Church but he was working hard to bring the east & west together. In fact he was so convincing that he was known as the ‘thief of souls’ by his brother bishops and was ultimately murdered by people in his Diocese in the Urkaine when he incurred their wrath by his effective preaching. Further, he was also held in great suspicion by the Western (Latin) rite Bishops of Poland and the Polish King of the time.

So, this Saint apparently was a very controversial man - possibily even stirring exterme feellings of nationalism throughout the Urkaine and Poland. I lot of people in both the western and eastern Church in this region of Europe seemed to have hated him a lot.

What I found interesting is that this priest of the S. Ch. who always assidously follows the proper liturgy of the day - and even uses the optional memoral of the Blessed Virgin on Saturday whenever he can - seemed to have deliebrately avoided using even the prayer for St. Josaphat as found in the Common of Seasons in the Sacarmentary. Indeed he used the prayer from the Ordinary - i.e. the general prayer one can use if there is no event in the Proper of Seasons for the day.

I am wondering whether this particuar order of priests (the Society of Christ) who do seem to have some nationalisitic inclinations might have some negative feelings about St. Josaphat and may not want to acknowledge him - even when they supposed to.

Any thoughts or insights on this would be appriecated.

 

[mercygate]

Why so cloak-and-dagger? You could just ask him why he omitted it.

 

[drabikmr]

I already have - got no response.

mercygate:

Why so cloak-and-dagger? You could just ask him why he omitted it.

 

[mercygate]

drabikmr:

I already have - got no response.

Ah ha. The plot thickens.

You asked him point blank: Why didn’t we celebrate the obligatory memorial of St. Josaphat today? and he looked you in the eye and did not answer?

Still, I wouldn’t call the liturgy police – unless stuff like this is habitual in a passive-aggressive dissident sort of way.

 

[Polvskoy]

drabikmr:

Hello

Just a question for someone who might be curious.

This past Saturday morning I attended a Mass celebrated in an old Polish Immgrant parish manned by Polish priests of the Society of Christ (S. Ch.). The parish is somewhere in the midwest - I don’t want to say exactly where as I happen to be a member of this parish.

The day, according to the proper of seasons in both the Sacramentary and the Liturgy of the Hours, was the obligatory memorial of St. Josaphat, Bishop and Martyr. (1595-1623).

This Saint was Polish born and of the Eastern Rite (Orothodox) Church but he was working hard to bring the east & west together. In fact he was so convincing that he was known as the ‘thief of souls’ by his brother bishops and was ultimately murdered by people in his Diocese in the Urkaine when he incurred their wrath by his effective preaching. Further, he was also held in great suspicion by the Western (Latin) rite Bishops of Poland and the Polish King of the time.

So, this Saint apparently was a very controversial man - possibily even stirring exterme feellings of nationalism throughout the Urkaine and Poland. I lot of people in both the western and eastern Church in this region of Europe seemed to have hated him a lot.

What I found interesting is that this priest of the S. Ch. who always assidously follows the proper liturgy of the day - and even uses the optional memoral of the Blessed Virgin on Saturday whenever he can - seemed to have deliebrately avoided using even the prayer for St. Josaphat as found in the Common of Seasons in the Sacarmentary. Indeed he used the prayer from the Ordinary - i.e. the general prayer one can use if there is no event in the Proper of Seasons for the day.

I am wondering whether this particuar order of priests (the Society of Christ) who do seem to have some nationalisitic inclinations might have some negative feelings about St. Josaphat and may not want to acknowledge him - even when they supposed to.

Any thoughts or insights on this would be appriecated.

I got to an SC parish also since I am Polish.
I think this was a mistake because St.Josaphat is hated by Russian and Ukrainian Orthodox and is called a hero by Polish and Ukrainian Catholics. Most of the Polish history books I have call him a hero but one says that it would of been better to have no Unia and make all Russians Latin Rite Catholics because of Greek Catholicism’s two sidedness.

Also, St.Josaphat was martyred in Nowogrodek/ Novogrodek/ Nawahradak(these are all the same city but different versions of the same name in different languages. They are Polish/Russian/Belarussian). which is in Belarus/White Russia north of Ukraine. It is possible that St.Josaphat never even went to Ukraine although he is one of their main patrons.

 

[stbruno]

Just a thought, but this happens with our immigrant priests. They are not proficient in preaching in the English language, so they frequently will resort to online or subscription homily helpers, and perhaps in their preparation, they went to the ordinary of the mass overlooking in error that it was a particular memorial. In this case, St.Josaphat. And while it is not a sin of omission that they failed to celebrate this feast, it was also not an intentional act to deliberately not celebrate the day.
I am sure, the alternate was acceptable as well. When we pray the Liturgy of the Hours, you can opt to use the ordinary or the feast and there is no problem with either selection for the day.
I am fairly sure that is the same in the case of celebrating the Mass. Just pray for your priest. Give him the benefit of the doubt especially since he seems to be a good priest.

 

[Joysong]

Thanks, St. Bruno,

When we pray the Liturgy of the Hours, you can opt to use the ordinary or the** feast** and there is no problem with either selection for the day. I am fairly sure that is the same in the case of celebrating the Mass. Just pray for your priest. Give him the benefit of the doubt especially since he seems to be a good priest.

Just a minor correction. When we pray the LOH, feasts are *not *optional, but memorials are. This was not a feast, but a “memorial” for the saint, and it is therefore *optional, *as you explained. The only part that was “proper” was the concluding prayer, if someone chose to use the memorial instead of the ordinary.

I am always edified when I see people like you encourage others to give priests the benefit of the doubt. Bless you!!

Carole

 

[stbruno]

“You are always edified to see people like me”…what does that mean. Priests are human. God chose men with blemishes. Lots of men with blemishes…starting in the Old Testament all the way through the selection of his apostles. They abandoned him in his hour of need, even denied him…We are not God, so shouldn’t we be forgiving??

 

[Joysong]

Dear St. Bruno,

“You are always edified to see people like me”…what does that mean.

My sincere apologies, for I see that my written word has caused you some confusion. My meaning was every bit complimentary, for I rejoice when I see people (like you) encourage others to give priests the benefit of the doubt.

You had replied to the original poster, “Just pray for your priest. Give him the benefit of the doubt especially since he seems to be a good priest.”

People are not always kind “like you” when they think a priest has made a mistake, yet you spoke in this priest’s defense, which is always a cause for others (like me) to rejoice and be edified. I was *commending *you. Try reading the sentence again without my poor use of the words “like you.”

Carole

 

[Joe_Monahan]

drabikmr:

This Saint was Polish born and of the Eastern Rite (Orothodox) Church but he was working hard to bring the east & west together. In fact he was so convincing that he was known as the ‘thief of souls’ by his brother bishops and was ultimately murdered by people in his Diocese in the Urkaine when he incurred their wrath by his effective preaching. Further, he was also held in great suspicion by the Western (Latin) rite Bishops of Poland and the Polish King of the time.

So, this Saint apparently was a very controversial man - possibily even stirring exterme feellings of nationalism throughout the Urkaine and Poland. I lot of people in both the western and eastern Church in this region of Europe seemed to have hated him a lot.

Drabikmr,

Josaphat Kuncevyc, a very controversial individual, was not of the Orthodox Church but of what is today known as the Byzantine Ruthenian Church.

Joe

 

[stbruno]

Thanks for your explanation. Let’s always pray for each other.