Priesthood authority?

[Big_Dummy]

Ah, where is there proof that any Christian in the church held the aaronic or melchizedek priesthood in the church ever? Fact, is no one since Jesus can hold the Melchizedek priesthood because Jesus is eternal and thus lives forever.

<< Hebrews 7:24 >>

New International Version (©1984)
but because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood.

New Living Translation (©2007)
But because Jesus lives forever, his priesthood lasts forever.

English Standard Version (©2001)
but he holds his priesthood permanently, because he continues forever.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
but Jesus, on the other hand, because He continues forever, holds His priesthood permanently.

International Standard Version (©2008)
But because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood.

GOD’S WORD® Translation (©1995)
But Jesus lives forever, so he serves as a priest forever.
King James Bible
But this [man], because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

American King James Version
But this man, because he continues ever, has an unchangeable priesthood.

American Standard Version
but he, because he abideth for ever, hath his priesthood unchangeable.

Bible in Basic English
But this priest, because his life goes on for ever, is unchanging.

Douay-Rheims Bible
But this, for that he continueth for ever, hath **an everlasting priesthood, **
Darby Bible Translation
but he, because of his continuing for ever, has the priesthood unchangeable.

English Revised Version
but he, because he abideth for ever, hath his priesthood unchangeable.

Webster’s Bible Translation
But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

Weymouth New Testament
but He, because He continues for ever, has a priesthood which does not pass to any successor.

World English Bible
But he, because he lives forever, has his priesthood unchangeable.

Young’s Literal Translation
and he, because of his remaining – to the age, hath the priesthood not transient,

Hebrews 7:11-28 (Wycliffe New Testament)
11 Therefore if perfection was by the priesthood of Levi, for under him the people took the law, what yet was it needful, another priest to rise, by the order of Melchisedec, and not to be said by the order of Aaron [what yet was it needful, another priest to rise, after the order of Melchisedec, and not to be said after the order of Aaron]?

** 12 For why when the priesthood is translated, it is need [it is needful] that also [the] translation of the law be made.**

13 But he in whom these things be said, is of another lineage, of which no man was priest to the altar [of which no man was priest, or ready, to the altar]. 

14 For it is open [Soothly it is openly known], that our Lord is born of Juda, in which lineage Moses spake nothing of priests. 

15 And more yet it is known, if by the order of Melchisedec another priest is risen up; [And more yet it is known, if after the order of Melchisedec another priest riseth;] 

16 which is not made by the law of fleshly commandment, but by [the] virtue of life that may not be undone. [the which is not made after the law of fleshly commandment, but after virtue of life indissoluble, or that may not be undone.]

17 For he witnesseth, That thou art a priest without end, by the order of Melchisedec; [Soothly he witnesseth, For thou art a priest into without end, after the order of Melchisedec;] 

18 that reproving of the commandment before-going is made, for the unfirmness and unprofit of it. 

19 For why the law brought nothing to perfection, but there is a bringing in of a better hope, by which we approach to God [by which we nigh to God]. 

20 And how great it is, not without swearing [that Christ is made priest after the order of Melchisedec]; 

21 but the others [forsooth others] be made priests without an oath; but this priest with an oath, by him that said to him, The Lord swore, and it shall not rue him, Thou art a priest without end, by the order of Melchisedec [Thou art a priest into without end, after the order of Melchisedec]; 

22 in so much Jesus is made [better] promiser of the better testament. 

23 And [soothly] the others were made many priests, therefore for they were forbidden by death to dwell still [for that they were forbidden by death to dwell]; 

24 but this man, for he dwelleth without end [for that he dwelleth into without end], hath an everlasting priesthood. 

25 Wherefore also he may save without end, coming nigh by himself to God, and evermore liveth to pray for us. [Wherefore and he may save into without end, coming nigh by himself to God, evermore living to pray for us.] 

26 For it beseemed that such a man were a bishop to us, holy, innocent, undefouled, clean, separated from sinful men, and made higher than heavens; [a]

27 which hath not need each day, as priests, first for his own guilts to offer sacrifices, and afterward for the people; for he did this thing in offering himself once [soothly he did this thing, once offering himself]. 

28 And the law ordained men priests having frailty [having sickness, or frailty]; but the word of swearing, which is after the law, ordained the Son perfect without end [ordained the Son perfect into without end].

 

[Stephen168]

Ah, where is there proof that any Christian in the church held the aaronic or melchizedek priesthood in the church ever?

There is no such thing as the Melchizedek Priesthood. Christ is the High Priest like Melchizedek was a priest (Hebrews 7:15). Therefore no Christian ever held the Melchizedek Priesthood.

 

[Steven_John]

Ah, where is there proof that any Christian in the church held the aaronic or melchizedek priesthood in the church ever? Fact, is no one since Jesus can hold the Melchizedek priesthood because Jesus is eternal and thus lives forever.

Whats with your choice of name, do you really believe that of your self or is it an untruth?

Regardless to whether one believes that priesthood is the same by spirit or just similar you should seek clarity on this.
Best i understand most Christian sects they believe that together they are an imperfect body of Jesus (pbwh), perfectly him in entirety but with the additions of the imperfect.

Christians know them selves to be all priests, as they seek to follow and be Jesus (pbwh) it stands solid they are that same priesthood by intention though not always by action due to the imperfection.

The narrations that explain there has never been another since the time of Jesus (pbwh) speak of no one individual, not the body of believers. this teaching should help readers to be humble and stay on track.

Thats best i can explain if you want me to clarify anything here please ask, it would be also good if a Christian could offer any clarification needed.

Peace and blessings to you and yours

 

[StTommyMore]

There is no such thing as the Melchizedek Priesthood. Christ is the High Priest like Melchizedek was a priest (Hebrews 7:15). Therefore no Christian ever held the Melchizedek Priesthood.

You are wrong.there are actually two types of priesthood in the Catholic Church: the common priesthood of all believers and the ministerial priesthood.

 

[SteveVH]

Ah, where is there proof that any Christian in the church held the aaronic or melchizedek priesthood in the church ever? Fact, is no one since Jesus can hold the Melchizedek priesthood because Jesus is eternal and thus lives forever.

It is through the priesthood of Christ that a Catholic priest effects the sacraments. He acts “in persona Christi”, in the person of Christ, who indeed is a Priest in the line of Melchizedek. So you are correct, you just don’t understand. It is how and why the bread and wine are changed substantially into the the body and blood of Christ. It is Christ himself who utters the words “Take this, all of you, and eat. This is my body which is given to you. Take this and drink. This is the blood of the new and everlasting covenant.”
It is Christ himself on the altar, at every single mass, every single day, all over the world.

 

[PACKAROO]

Genesis 14:18 also says Melchizedek , king of salem, that he brings out bread and wine, and being a priest of God, blessed Abram.
And in the New Testament, Jesus ‘ordains’ the apostles to be an ‘extension’ of His Priesthood. He tells them to break bread, forgive sins, heal the sick , Baptize, ect.
So, the Apostles know they have the authority to pass on this/their priesthood given by Jesus THe HIGH PRIEST, when they chose Matthias to take the place of Judas as one of the 12 apostles.
And there is no priesthood left of the Jewish faith. They were all killed at the the burning of Jerusalem in 79 A.D. The lineage is stopped. So, Jesus is the start of the NEW COVENANT, and his Apostles set out across the world for all mankind as 'extentions of HIS PRIESTHOOD.

 

[Stephen168]

You are wrong.there are actually two types of priesthood in the Catholic Church: the common priesthood of all believers and the ministerial priesthood.

Correct; and neither one of them are a ‘Melchizedek Priesthood’ because there is no such thing. Hebrews Chapter Seven explains how Christ was a Priest** like** Melchizedek was a Priest.

on the order of

1. Of a kind or fashion similar to; like: a house on the order of a mountain lodge.

 

[StTommyMore]

Correct; and neither one of them are a ‘Melchizedek Priesthood’ because there is no such thing. Hebrews Chapter Seven explains how Christ was a Priest** like** Melchizedek was a Priest.

on the order of

1. Of a kind or fashion similar to; like: a house on the order of a mountain lodge.

The Ministerial priesthood is the Priesthood of Melchizedek: Offering of bread and wine, a priest-king.

 

[Stephen168]

The Ministerial priesthood is the Priesthood of Melchizedek: Offering of bread and wine, a priest-king.

Correct; the Ministerial Priesthood is just like Melchizedek. Melchizedek prefigured the priesthood of Christ as described in Hebrews Chapter Seven.

 

[4thetruth]

The Ministerial priesthood is the Priesthood of Melchizedek: Offering of bread and wine, a priest-king.

I agree with Stephen168. There is no Melchizedek Priesthood. “according to the order of Melchizedek.” means “in the manner of Melchizedek”. “order” in this use does not refer to a religious order like the Levitical Priesthood. The “manner” refers to the use of bread and wine, not a religious order. I think it’s incorrect to call the priesthood of Christ (and thus the ministerial and lay priesthoods thru participation in Christ’s priesthood) the “Melchizedek Priesthood”.

 

[SteveVH]

Correct; the Ministerial Priesthood is just like Melchizedek. Melchizedek prefigured the priesthood of Christ as described in Hebrews Chapter Seven.

My Bible says: "…where Jesus has entered on our behalf as forerunner, becoming high priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek (Heb 6:20)

and “You are a priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek.” (Heb 7:17)

Sounds to me like Christ is a priest according to the order of Melchizedek.

 

[4thetruth]

My Bible says: "…where Jesus has entered on our behalf as forerunner, becoming high priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek (Heb 6:20)

and “You are a priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek.” (Heb 7:17)

Sounds to me like Christ is a priest according to the order of Melchizedek.

This is a repost in case you didn’t see it.

I agree with Stephen168. There is no Melchizedek Priesthood. “according to the order of Melchizedek.” means “in the manner of Melchizedek”. “order” in this use does not refer to a religious order like the Levitical Priesthood. The “manner” refers to the use of bread and wine, not a religious order. I think it’s incorrect to call the priesthood of Christ (and thus the ministerial and common priesthoods thru participation in Christ’s priesthood) the “Melchizedek Priesthood”.

 

[Steven_John]

kat-ah’
A primary particle; (preposition) down (in place or time), in varied relations (according to the case [genitive, dative or accusative] with which it is joined): - about, according as (to), after, against, (when they were) X alone, among, and, X apart, (even, like) as (concerning, pertaining to, touching), X aside, at, before, beyond, by, to the charge of, [charita-] bly, concerning, + covered, [dai-] ly, down, every, (+ far more) exceeding, X more excellent, for, from . . . to, godly, in (-asmuch, divers, every, -to, respect of), . . . by, after the manner of, + by any means, beyond (out of) measure, X mightily, more, X natural, of (up-) on (X part), out (of every), over against, (+ your) X own, + particularly, so, through (-oughout, -oughout every), thus, (un-) to (-gether, -ward), X uttermost, where (-by), with. In composition it retains many of these applications, and frequently denotes opposition, distribution or intensity.

 

[Steven_John]

hom-oy-ot’ace
From G3664; resemblance: - like as, similitude.

 

[StTommyMore]

I will have to ask my prof about this one.

 

[Big_Dummy]

There is no such thing as the Melchizedek Priesthood. Christ is the High Priest like Melchizedek was a priest (Hebrews 7:15). Therefore no Christian ever held the Melchizedek Priesthood.

Exactly, that is my point. So, there is no need for the mormons to restore it. Since, no Christian ever had it in the first place.

And, Hebrews 7 makes it plain that the Melchizedek priesthood is non-transferible because Jesus being God never passes it on to others.

 

[Big_Dummy]

You are wrong.there are actually two types of priesthood in the Catholic Church: the common priesthood of all believers and the ministerial priesthood.

No, he is right, Therefore no Christian ever held the **Melchizedek **Priesthood.

 

[Big_Dummy]

It is through the priesthood of Christ that a Catholic priest effects the sacraments. He acts “in persona Christi”, in the person of Christ, who indeed is a Priest in the line of Melchizedek. So you are correct, you just don’t understand. It is how and why the bread and wine are changed substantially into the the body and blood of Christ. It is Christ himself who utters the words “Take this, all of you, and eat. This is my body which is given to you. Take this and drink. This is the blood of the new and everlasting covenant.”
It is Christ himself on the altar, at every single mass, every single day, all over the world.

Actually you are wrong, the church never claims that the priest holds the Melchizedek priesthood and in fact Hebrews 7 makes it plain that there is only one person who holds it, Jesus. And, he does not pass that specific priesthood on to anyone.

So, us even one offical catholic document that claims the the priests holds the Melchizedeck priesthood.

Melchizedeck is referred to three times in catholic catechism and not one of those claims that catholic priests holds the Melchizedeck priesthood. Saying what happened in Genesis is a prefigure, symbol, image, forshaddow of the mass is not the same thing as saying the catholic priesthood is the Melchizedeck priesthood.

CC 1544
Everything that the priesthood of the Old Covenant prefigured finds its fulfillment in Christ Jesus, the "one mediator between God and men."15 The Christian tradition considers Melchizedek, “priest of God Most High,” as a prefiguration of the priesthood of Christ, the unique “high priest after the order of Melchizedek”;16 "holy, blameless, unstained,"17 "by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are sanctified,"18 that is, by the unique sacrifice of the cross.

CC 58
The covenant with Noah remains in force during the times of the Gentiles, until the universal proclamation of the Gospel.13 The Bible venerates several great figures among the Gentiles: Abel the just, the king-priest Melchizedek—a figure of Christ—and the upright "Noah, Daniel, and Job."14 Scripture thus expresses the heights of sanctity that can be reached by those who live according to the covenant of Noah, waiting for Christ to "gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad."15

CC 1333
At the heart of the Eucharistic celebration are the bread and wine that, by the words of Christ and the invocation of the Holy Spirit, become Christ’s Body and Blood. Faithful to the Lord’s command the Church continues to do, in his memory and until his glorious return, what he did on the eve of his Passion: “He took bread. . . .” “He took the cup filled with wine. . . .” The signs of bread and wine become, in a way surpassing understanding, the Body and Blood of Christ; they continue also to signify the goodness of creation. Thus in the Offertory we give thanks to the Creator for bread and wine,154 fruit of the “work of human hands,” but above all as “fruit of the earth” and “of the vine”—gifts of the Creator. The Church sees in the gesture of the king-priest Melchizedek, who “brought out bread and wine,” a prefiguring of her own offering.155

prefigure
Popularity
pre·fig·ure verb
\ˌprē-ˈfi-gyər, especially British -ˈfi-gər
Definition of PREFIGURE
transitive verb
1: to show, suggest, or announce by an antecedent type, image, or likeness
2: to picture or imagine beforehand
— pre·fig·ure·ment -mənt\ noun
See prefigure defined for English-language learners »
Examples of PREFIGURE
His style of painting prefigured the development of modern art.

Origin of PREFIGURE
Middle English, from Late Latin praefigurare, from Latin prae- pre- + figurare to shape, picture, from figura figure
First Known Use: 15th century
Related to PREFIGURE
Synonyms: adumbrate, forerun, harbinger, herald, foreshadow
Related Words: anticipate, foreknow, foresee; forecast, foretell, predict, prognosticate, prophesy; forewarn; augur, bode, forebode (also forbode), portend, presage, promise; allude, connote, hint, imply, insinuate, intimate, suggest
+]more

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/prefigure

 

[SteveVH]

Actually you are wrong, the church never claims that the priest holds the Melchizedek priesthood and in fact Hebrews 7 makes it plain that there is only one person who holds it, Jesus. And, he does not pass that specific priesthood on to anyone.

So, us even one offical catholic document that claims the the priests holds the Melchizedeck priesthood.

Melchizedeck is referred to three times in catholic catechism and not one of those claims that catholic priests holds the Melchizedeck priesthood. Saying what happened in Genesis is a prefigure, symbol, image, forshaddow of the mass is not the same thing as saying the catholic priesthood is the Melchizedeck priesthood.

CC 1544
Everything that the priesthood of the Old Covenant prefigured finds its fulfillment in Christ Jesus, the "one mediator between God and men."15 The Christian tradition considers Melchizedek, “priest of God Most High,” as a prefiguration of the priesthood of Christ, the unique “high priest after the order of Melchizedek”;16 "holy, blameless, unstained,"17 "by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are sanctified,"18 that is, by the unique sacrifice of the cross.

CC 58
The covenant with Noah remains in force during the times of the Gentiles, until the universal proclamation of the Gospel.13 The Bible venerates several great figures among the Gentiles: Abel the just, the king-priest Melchizedek—a figure of Christ—and the upright "Noah, Daniel, and Job."14 Scripture thus expresses the heights of sanctity that can be reached by those who live according to the covenant of Noah, waiting for Christ to "gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad."15

CC 1333
At the heart of the Eucharistic celebration are the bread and wine that, by the words of Christ and the invocation of the Holy Spirit, become Christ’s Body and Blood. Faithful to the Lord’s command the Church continues to do, in his memory and until his glorious return, what he did on the eve of his Passion: “He took bread. . . .” “He took the cup filled with wine. . . .” The signs of bread and wine become, in a way surpassing understanding, the Body and Blood of Christ; they continue also to signify the goodness of creation. Thus in the Offertory we give thanks to the Creator for bread and wine,154 fruit of the “work of human hands,” but above all as “fruit of the earth” and “of the vine”—gifts of the Creator. The Church sees in the gesture of the king-priest Melchizedek, who “brought out bread and wine,” a prefiguring of her own offering.155

prefigure
Popularity
pre·fig·ure verb
\ˌprē-ˈfi-gyər, especially British -ˈfi-gər
Definition of PREFIGURE
transitive verb
1: to show, suggest, or announce by an antecedent type, image, or likeness
2: to picture or imagine beforehand
— pre·fig·ure·ment -mənt\ noun
See prefigure defined for English-language learners »
Examples of PREFIGURE
His style of painting prefigured the development of modern art.

Origin of PREFIGURE
Middle English, from Late Latin praefigurare, from Latin prae- pre- + figurare to shape, picture, from figura figure
First Known Use: 15th century
Related to PREFIGURE
Synonyms: adumbrate, forerun, harbinger, herald, foreshadow
Related Words: anticipate, foreknow, foresee; forecast, foretell, predict, prognosticate, prophesy; forewarn; augur, bode, forebode (also forbode), portend, presage, promise; allude, connote, hint, imply, insinuate, intimate, suggest
+]more

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/prefigure

I’m sorry you went to such trouble to convince me. You need to re-read my post. I said that it was Jesus who held the Melchizedek priesthood and that the priest acts in the Person of Christ. It is Christ, both High Priest and Victim, at the altar offering himself to the Father.

 

[StTommyMore]

No, he is right, Therefore no Christian ever held the **Melchizedek **Priesthood.

like I said, I am going to ask my prof about this one.