Priesthood Naturally Attracts Gays?

[Sacramentalist]

Hey, gang.

This afternoon, my mother brought up an interesting point on gays and the priesthood.

She suggested that the priesthood attracts gay men because of these people’s innate femininity, which naturally inclines them to service, compassion, self-sacrifice, etc. Not that straight men are incapale of this, but the priesthood’s practical aspects do tend to bring out or accomidate themselves more to womanly instincts than manly.

And so well-intentioned gay man are naturally inclined to the priesthood.

What do you all say to this?

Note: This thread is not meant to go into the merits of havin gays in the priesthood. I am curious, however, as to whether the priesthood has always had a higher proportion of gays than other “professions,” and if the nature of the work itself tends to attract them.

Any thoughts?

 

[Semper_Fi_1]

Sacramentalist:

Hey, gang.

This afternoon, my mother brought up an interesting point on gays and the priesthood.

She suggested that the priesthood attracts gay men because of these people’s innate femininity, which naturally inclines them to service, compassion, self-sacrifice, etc. Not that straight men are incapale of this, but the priesthood’s practical aspects do tend to bring out or accomidate themselves more to womanly instincts than manly.

And so well-intentioned gay man are naturally inclined to the priesthood.

What do you all say to this?

Note: This thread is not meant to go into the merits of havin gays in the priesthood. I am curious, however, as to whether the priesthood has always had a higher proportion of gays than other “professions,” and if the nature of the work itself tends to attract them.

Any thoughts?

I haven’t met any priests I considered effeminate, and I’ve met quite a few. Maybe it just isn’t as prevalent in our Archdiocese.

Also, I don’t think your hypothesis can be accurate at all, because look at our Eastern Rites…

Another thing to consider is look at the military… they sacrifice themselves sometimes for their whole lives… and no one would consider most military people effeminate.

 

[Montie_Claunch]

Jesus and Paul both sacrified, had compasion on other ect. and they wern’t gay.

 

[Sacramentalist]

There’s a world of difference between the military and the priesthood, and the practical duties each entails.

The priesthood seems to require a greater deal of compassion on the part of its members, and it seems that this is something a man with femininity is better predisposed to do than most normal men. Face it; women are natually more compassionate, and naturally more religious.

“Jesus and Paul both sacrified, had compasion on other ect. and they wern’t gay.”

Did you even read my post? Did I ever make any absolute statements?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Once when I was tested by a psychologist (using the MMPI, for those who know) I actually tested high on the “feminine” scale, one of two “outside the norm” indications. The other was passive-aggressiveness.

Of the two, the doctor did not consider my indication of any consequence because you get the same reading for effeminate tastes as you do if a person is highly educated and/or involved in culture such as fine arts.

Professionals who misinterpret the test may think I’m gay, but it’s news to me if I am. The thought does not appeal to me.

It is an interesting theory, though. I’m not sure I’m buying it just yet but maybe there is a social cliche about “manly men” and the fact they are out slaying mastodons and spitting and other manly stuff, while leaving compassion and care for the downtrodden to the women back in the caves. .

Alan

 

[puzzleannie]

if you start with enough presumptions, biases, prejudices and misapprehensions you can validate any theory about behavior and socialization.

The priesthood demands many qualities generally considered masculine, including strength, fortitude, leadership etc. For thesis in OP to be valid you would have to prove that all or the majority of character traits demanded by the priesthood are “feminine”, that gays by definition exhibit these “feminine” traits - which many students would hotly dispute, and that traditional “masculine” traits would somehow hamper or discourage men from pursuing this vocation. The theory falls down in several places.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Sacramentalist:

Did you even read my post? Did I ever make any absolute statements?

I saw a couple pretty absolute facts:

a) your mother brought up a point, and
b) you find it interesting.

Without a qualifier, one might assume that “interesting,” though entirely subject to your opinion, is an adjective you intend to unconditionally apply.

I don’t suppose that’s what you were looking for?

Alan

 

[AlanFromWichita]

puzzleannie:

if you start with enough presumptions, biases, prejudices and misapprehensions you can validate any theory about behavior and socialization.

That is true. Do you think well-intentioned gay men are not attracted to the priesthood?

On the other hand, do you think it is only those with nefarious motives – such as to hide or to be in cahoots with others?

Alan

 

[rwoehmke]

Gay men run the spectrum just like stright men. Some are somewhat effeminate, but many are not. The notion that gay men are effeminate is a steriotype having little to do with the reality.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

rwoehmke:

Gay men run the spectrum just like stright men. Some are somewhat effeminate, but many are not. The notion that gay men are effeminate is a steriotype having little to do with the reality.

Sure, and I think that those who turn toward the priesthood are most likely very caring, and are wishing to commit their life to God.

There may be a few “rotten apples” as it were, but then again their are also those who are not gay.

Supposedly, some say they join the priesthood as self-discipline, so I don’t know… (The opposite is the insinuation they join for the opposite reason)

Gosh, I think I completely canceled myself out.

Probably if the truth were told, my opinion is uninformed.

Alan

 

[Pax]

I attended a high school seminary in my youth. I was never a softy or in any way effeminate. Neither were the priests that were members of that particular order. If anything, the masculine example and masculine spirituality was what attracted young men to the priesthood. Unfortunately, there has been a trend in society to accommodate everything homosexual. This has spilled over into all Christian denominations and even seminaries.

The decline in vocations is IMHO directly related to the “cultural/moral” decline within our country. Every liberalization that takes place within the church and within the rules of the clergy, the convents, and the seminaries tends to discourage vocations to religious life rather than to foster them. Discipline attracts people to the religious life.

An unmistakeably masculine priest can be compassionate, understanding, and holy. A priest does not need to be effeminite to possess these kinds of qualities. An unmistakeably masculine priest will probably possess these qualities in the proper proportions. Moreover, his masculinity will also provide a greater sense of strength and leadership.

The problems in the priesthood are but a reflection of the problems within society at large. Moral relativism and the mass media have pumped the current manifestations of cultural and moral sewage over most of our protective barriers and ramparts. When we decide to no longer let Satan have his way in our lives, and when we decide to fight the good fight without compromise we will see more vocations and we will see more holy priests that are spiritually tough and masculine to the core. Priestly life, in and of itself, is not for wimps or girly men. It is a tough and challenging life. Likewise, the life of a nun is a tough and challenging life for “real” women.

I don’t buy into any of the typical stereotypes that are floating around out there. Guys like St. Francis of Assisi, John Paul II, and others were real men molded in the example of love and compassion of Jesus. And like Jesus these men, and many others like them, set a standard of masculinity for every man to emulate.

 

[Bella3502]

I have always believed that the Priesthood attracts gay men in much the same way as the convent attracts gay women.

It’s a safe alternative lifestyle “cover”, where no one will question them about not being married and having children.

I also don’t think anything in this matter will change anytime soon.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Pax:

I don’t buy into any of the typical stereotypes that are floating around out there. Guys like St. Francis of Assisi, John Paul II, and others were real men molded in the example of love and compassion of Jesus. And like Jesus these men, and many others like them, set a standard of masculinity for every man to emulate.

Absolutely!!



Alan

 

[Ianjo99]

I think that the general idea of a priest tends to come with a type of counselor mentality; that is someone who is very empathetic and tends to be very open (women are naturally more in tune with emotional aspects). As such, I would say that a priest more often than not has effeminate characteristics.

Having said that, effeminate does not equal gay. Realistically, I would say that there a large number of gay priests (this coming from a heterosexual student thinking about the priesthood). My best guess is that a lot of times, gay men misinterpret their homosexuality as a call to the priesthood because they may think priests aren’t sexually attracted to women or something along those lines.

I think the hypothesis holds some water.

 

[Lux_et_veritas]

Rather than comment, I’ll guide you to two great books that explain the heavy presence of gays in the priesthood. In a nutshell, they were filtered in, while solid orthodox young men were filtered out.

Goodbye Good Men by Michael S. Rose

AmChurch by Paul Likoudis

 

[AndyF]

Sacramentalist:

Any thoughts?

Sacramentalist:

I agree, but not for the reason you state. Demons naturally convince their charge to gravitate to the center of most prominance within the Church, as from this higher perch they can affect change to the broader audience among the one Religion that has Favor of the Holy Spirit. The priest is a teacher and example, the perfect tool for the purpose. Simply tempting the person and succeeding within his social setting holds lessor
rewards than having him manifest within the sanctity of the Church.

For the sake of clarity, I would like to point out that these afflicted are not the condition. Their identity to the sin is a deception. If they ARE anything, they ARE servants of God as you and I are, period. They call themselves gay because the demon wants them to identify with the sin as they themselves are.

(It is more than coincidental in that if they were to succeed, then the sinner would BE the sin as they are. This is one clue that we know the affliction has demonic influence. Demons have been known to answer that they are the sin when asked their names.)

Since this is a deception, it is up to his brothers and sisters to correct him at every opportunity until through his efforts and the assistance of the Devotions,observances of the Church,Blessed Mother,St.Michael and the Holy Spirit, he can come to see his true self behind the mask.

 The demon that causes this is the one in Rev 3:15-19 and uses more cunning methods of employment than other demons.


 Andy

 

[viktor_aleksndr]

I don’t buy into any of the typical stereotypes that are floating around out there. Guys like St. Francis of Assisi, John Paul II, and others were real men molded in the example of love and compassion of Jesus. And like Jesus these men, and many others like them, set a standard of masculinity for every man to emulate.

YeS! St Francis was a knight. He always wanted to be a knight. But because GOD called him, he left the knighthood to live in a life devoted to GOD.

 

[Sherlock]

Ianjo99,
Good heavens, our priest is as masculine a man as one could wish, a real “guy’s guy”. Big outdoorsman, hunter, fisherman…likes reloading and shooting. Nothing effeminate whatsoever. Does that mean he isn’t a great counselor? No, not at all—he is terrific. He’s also very empathetic and a good listener. I don’t think he’s an exception to a rule, as other priests I know seem very masculine (though not all are as outdoors-y as my priest).

 

[iceman]

These days, we have greater and greater difficulty recognizing positive masculine qualities as our culture is overly feminized and often blatantly critical of, if not out right mocking, men with traditionally masculine character. The priesthood, like the rest of society, has been bombarded by and adversely affected by our popular culture. I am certain that more than a few, although perthaps not all, homosexual men joined the Catholic priesthood in the 1950s, 1960s and 1970s in order to alter the fundamentals of the faith and to undermine it within Western Society. Call it too conspiratorial if you like but a number of very powerful people in the early part of the twentieth century openly identified their intention to destroy the Catholic church from within and they have since been very effective at undermining its influence in political circles and in Western society as a whole. This was not simply a bad coincidence.

Mature, confident, authoritative and dedicated masculine males have somehow survived this societal onslaught in the priesthood and in our society as a whole but we still fight an uphill battle to be recognized as a positive influence as opposed to an outdated abusive chauvinist stereotype. Perhaps all of us simply need to remind ourselves and others of the fundamental need for masculine men, and especially in priests, and become better at recognizing them and their vital importance when we find them.

 

[Aaron_I]

I’d say that the priesthood is a vocation that highly values masculinity. I can’t understand how anyone could claim otherwise.