Priest's chalice

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I was thrown off today, and my young son was asking me as well. We have a new pastor (older guy), and we don’t usually attend this particular Mass. They have always had just the priest’s chalice at this particular Mass only, and the previous pastor was the only one to receive the blood.

Today looked like usual just the one chalice. The 3 EMHC came up, he gave them the body as usual, then he handed them all his chalice and they drank from it! Is this typical? I want to have an answer for my son and myself!
 
I was thrown off today, and my young son was asking me as well. We have a new pastor (older guy), and we don’t usually attend this particular Mass. They have always had just the priest’s chalice at this particular Mass only, and the previous pastor was the only one to receive the blood.

Today looked like usual just the one chalice. The 3 EMHC came up, he gave them the body as usual, then he handed them all his chalice and they drank from it! Is this typical? I want to have an answer for my son and myself!
Some priests do that, and others do not. It’s not forbidden or illicit, if that’s what you’re asking… 😉

(It’s just a bit weird, since he’s distributing the Precious Blood to part of the congregation (i.e., the EMHCs) and not the entire congregation. What you saw might regularly happen in a place where the bishop hasn’t allowed reception of Communion under both kinds, but that’s not the case in the U.S. …)
 
The priest is allowed to distribute the Precious Blood to as many people or as few as he wants. Heck, he could even decide not to distribute the Host, if he felt like it and had good reason (although the congregation would usually wonder more, and he would probably have to explain). Mass is valid as long as the priest receives under both kinds; it’s unnecessary for anybody else to receive under either kind, and receiving only under one kind is normative.

Receiving under both kinds was permitted at Vatican II for special occasions. Otherwise, a layperson would usually only receive under both kinds at your First Communion (maybe) and your wedding. Over most of the world, we stretch this a lot in the OF.

Now… here’s my best guess at why this happened.

Father probably was low on wine back in the sacristy, so he’s eking it out by having only one chalice. (Forgetful shopping? Package delivery didn’t come? Somebody knocked over some bottles? Who knows?)

He poured out enough that he needs the EMHCs to help him, but not enough that he could have the congregation receive. (In the old days, a priest’s chalice was often tiny or only a tiny amount of wine was poured in, because it would only contain enough for the priest to receive a smallish sip.)

But either way, it’s not really anything worrying. It’s just a thing that happened.
 
At daily mass our priest does that; the EMHC drinks from his chalice, and then uses it to distribute the precious blood to congregants.
 
The priest is allowed to distribute the Precious Blood to as many people or as few as he wants. Heck, he could even decide not to distribute the Host, if he felt like it and had good reason (although the congregation would usually wonder more, and he would probably have to explain). Mass is valid as long as the priest receives under both kinds; it’s unnecessary for anybody else to receive under either kind, and receiving only under one kind is normative.

Receiving under both kinds was permitted at Vatican II for special occasions. Otherwise, a layperson would usually only receive under both kinds at your First Communion (maybe) and your wedding. Over most of the world, we stretch this a lot in the OF.
This is really a stunner for Catholics who take for granted that the priest must give Holy Communion to the congregation during the mass.

I felt like a bad guy all the times when I said that receiving Holy Communion was not the most important thing but that attending the mass was.

Perhaps it was my upbringing. We were taught not to receive Holy Communion if we had not gone for Confession or did not prepare sufficiently for the mass rather than justify ourselves purely on legalism. In fact by refraining, God would honor us for respecting the Body and Blood by not receiving it unworthily.
 
Receiving under both kinds was permitted at Vatican II for special occasions. Otherwise, a layperson would usually only receive under both kinds at your First Communion (maybe) and your wedding. Over most of the world, we stretch this a lot in the OF.
Receiving under both kinds is permitted. Period. The special occasion thing you mention is not an official position or in the documents of the Church today.
 
Heck, he could even decide not to distribute the Host, if he felt like it and had good reason (although the congregation would usually wonder more, and he would probably have to explain). .
Could you cite where you found this information?

The priest is not free to mark abitrary decisions regarding the celebration of Mass and most certainly cannot with old distribution of communion to the faithful unless he was certain all were in a state of grave sin publicly or in apostacy
 
Another variation that I heard of was earlier in church days and the practice of “sub una” was common, which is what you’re talking about now. “under one” when they simply didn’t have wine. I’m not sure if that was a Protestant practice or a Catholic one

(ignore this: evangelization - I always get a spelling error on this word and somebody told me how to add this spelling to my dictionary – right click on the word and “add to dictionary”

I can rest tonight that this is fixed)

Reception under one species was the rule until after Vatican II. I don’t know why so many people want to receive under two species from a common cup.
 
Reception under one species was the rule until after Vatican II. I don’t know why so many people want to receive under two species from a common cup.
Perhaps it is out of habit or I am just one of those people, I am uncomfortable in receiving the blood, usually drinking from a priest’s chalice. In our place receiving two specie is not done in public mass, I guess it is more dictated by an impossible logistic - the crowd is massive. Thus receiving the blood is often done in a private mass at home or during retreats, but that is if the priest feels like doing it; that somehow helps in mitigating the overwhelming factor of finding oneself drinking from the chalice, and I kind of like it. 😛
 
Reception under one species was the rule until after Vatican II. I don’t know why so many people want to receive under two species from a common cup.
Because the Apostles did. It’s a beautiful privilege/
 
In the Cathedral here ( Killarney , Ireland) one of the Lay ministers takes the chalice to the left side of the nave. So the choice is yours. Turn left or right… Same I think at the Friary.
 
I was thrown off today, and my young son was asking me as well. We have a new pastor (older guy), and we don’t usually attend this particular Mass. They have always had just the priest’s chalice at this particular Mass only, and the previous pastor was the only one to receive the blood.

Today looked like usual just the one chalice. The 3 EMHC came up, he gave them the body as usual, then he handed them all his chalice and they drank from it! Is this typical? I want to have an answer for my son and myself!
At our Saturday evening Mass there is only one EMHC and he/she receives and gives out the Precious Blood from the same chalice as the priest. At the Sunday Mass there are two identical chalices. The priest receives from one and both are offered to the congregation.

Our last Pastor had his own chalice (technically, it was a cup while the congregation’s chalices were real chalices) but he was the first priest I’d seen do that in the 19 years I’ve been in this parish.
 
Mass is valid as long as the priest receives under both kinds; it’s unnecessary for anybody else to receive under either kind, and receiving only under one kind is normative.
Oh boy, there could be volumes written against this. Unnecessary is not a word I would use, and frankly it’s an extremely problematic mentality that was unfortunately propagated in the West until Pius XII’s Mediator Dei. It seems quite intuitive that the confection of the Eucharist is for its reception - perhaps not by everyone all the time but to received by all who are able sometimes. The corpus of Patristic literature on the spiritual advantages of receiving the Eucharist express its reception as quite necessary, in fact. The institution narrative even states it is given for many not one.

Receiving under one kind is not normative, at least in the US. There exists a document called the Norms For The Distribution And Reception Of Holy Communion Under Both Kinds In The Dioceses Of The United States Of America. Furthermore, the communing under a singular species is a liturgical aberration that the novus ordo sought to correct (whether or not the method employed is perceived as proper) - essentially since the Latin commingling during the fraction only goes one way. The inconsequential attitude some Latin Catholics approach the Blood with actually shocks and mortifies Eastern Christians.

Re OP: All that being said, the priest should really either commune as many laity as possible with the blood or singularly himself. It seems the only actually legislated rule, though, is that it is fitting that all concelebrants be communed with the Blood.
 
Reception under one species was the rule until after Vatican II. I don’t know why so many people want to receive under two species from a common cup.
Because Christ gave us all the Cup; because it was the practice of the early Church and for centuries; because at Vatican 2 the bishops of the world indicated they wanted to move in that direction, and because as the Church has said, it is a fuller sign of the Eucharistic Meal.
 
Oh boy, there could be volumes written against this. Unnecessary is not a word I would use, and frankly it’s an extremely problematic mentality that was unfortunately propagated in the West until Pius XII’s Mediator Dei. It seems quite intuitive that the confection of the Eucharist is for its reception - perhaps not by everyone all the time but to received by all who are able sometimes. The corpus of Patristic literature on the spiritual advantages of receiving the Eucharist express its reception as quite necessary, in fact. The institution narrative even states it is given for many not one.

Receiving under one kind is not normative, at least in the US. There exists a document called the Norms For The Distribution And Reception Of Holy Communion Under Both Kinds In The Dioceses Of The United States Of America. Furthermore, the communing under a singular species is a liturgical aberration that the novus ordo sought to correct (whether or not the method employed is perceived as proper) - essentially since the Latin commingling during the fraction only goes one way. The inconsequential attitude some Latin Catholics approach the Blood with actually shocks and mortifies Eastern Christians.

Re OP: All that being said, the priest should really either commune as many laity as possible with the blood or singularly himself. It seems the only actually legislated rule, though, is that it is fitting that all concelebrants be communed with the Blood.
(a) In reference to the Eucharist as a sacrifice, the communion, under both kinds, of the celebrating priest belongs at least to the integrity, and, according to some theologians, to the essence, of the sacrificial rite, and may not therefore be omitted without violating the sacrificial precept of Christ: “Do this for a commemoration of me” (Luke 22:19).

This is taught implicitly by the Council of Trent (Sess. XXI, c. i; XXII, c. i).

(b) There is no Divine precept binding the laity or non-celebrating priests to receive the sacrament under both kinds (Trent, sess. XXI, c. i.)

(c) By reason of the hypostatic union and of the indivisibility of His glorified humanity, Christ is really present and is received whole and entire, body and blood, soul and Divinity, under either species alone; nor, as regards the fruits of the sacrament, is the communicant under one kind deprived of any grace necessary for salvation (Trent, Sess. XXI, c., iii).

(d) In reference to the sacraments generally, apart from their substance, salva eorum substantia, i.e. apart from what has been strictly determined by Divine institution or precept, the Church has authority to determine or modify the rites and usages employed in their administration, according as she judges it expedient for the greater profit of the recipients or the better protections of the sacraments themselves against irreverence.

Hence “although the usage of Communion under two kinds was not infrequent in the early ages [ab initio] of the Christian religion, yet, the custom in this respect having changed almost universally [latissime] in the course of time, holy mother the Church, mindful of her authority in the administration of the Sacraments, and influenced by weighty and just reasons, has approved the custom of communicating under one kind, and decreed it to have the force of a law, which may not be set aside or changed but by the Church’s own authority” (Trent, Sess. XXI, c. ii).

Not only, therefore, is Communion under both kinds not obligatory on the faithful, but the chalice is strictly forbidden by ecclesiastical law to any but the celebrating priest. These decrees of the Council of Trent were directed against the Reformers of the sixteenth century, who, on the strength of John 6:54, Matthew 26:27, and Luke 22:17-19, enforced in most cases by a denial of the Real Presence and of the Sacrifice of the Mass, maintained the existence of a Divine precept obliging the faithful to receive under both kinds, and denounced the Catholic practice of withholding the cup from the laity as a sacrilegious mutilation of the sacrament.
 
Not only, therefore, is Communion under both kinds not obligatory on the faithful, but the chalice is strictly forbidden by ecclesiastical law to any but the celebrating priest. These decrees of the Council of Trent were directed against the Reformers of the sixteenth century, who, on the strength of John 6:54, Matthew 26:27, and Luke 22:17-19, enforced in most cases by a denial of the Real Presence and of the Sacrifice of the Mass, maintained the existence of a Divine precept obliging the faithful to receive under both kinds, and denounced the Catholic practice of withholding the cup from the laity as a sacrilegious mutilation of the sacrament.
Since you seem to know a bit of ecclesiastical law from 4 centuries ago, you might want to check out the current law.
 
Because otjm’s above response is sufficient, I will refrain from a lengthy response. However, all I will point out is my post was about the liturgical aberration of discontinuing the distribution of the Blood in the Latin tradition (a clear break from Patristic theology and all the other Apostolic traditions) and its later correction - you cited laws from the period I pointed to during this liturgical aberration. There is no necessary contradiction between the two posts - as otjm wrote, though, you might want to read the current norms (as I’ve cited in my above post).
 
Not only, therefore, is Communion under both kinds not obligatory on the faithful, but the chalice is strictly forbidden by ecclesiastical law to any but the celebrating priest.
I was with you up till that statement. “The chalice is strictly forbidden”? No. Rather, deferring the distribution of the Precious Blood to the congregation is a ‘custom’ which is not abrogated, but rather, was permitted as if with ‘force of law.’

That’s not to say that distribution to the congregation from the chalice is ‘forbidden’… :nope:

On the other hand…
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MorEphrem:
Receiving under one kind is not normative, at least in the US. There exists a document called the Norms For The Distribution And Reception Of Holy Communion Under Both Kinds In The Dioceses Of The United States Of America.
In fact, this document discusses the times in which distribution of only one species is appropriate. Therefore, “receiving under one kind” is “normative,” although it is also normative to receive under both species.

It’s possible to fall into the ditch on both sides of this argument, and we’ve seen examples of each of these in this thread… 🤷
 
I was with you up till that statement. “The chalice is strictly forbidden”? No. Rather, deferring the distribution of the Precious Blood to the congregation is a ‘custom’ which is not abrogated, but rather, was permitted as if with ‘force of law.’

That’s not to say that distribution to the congregation from the chalice is ‘forbidden’… :nope:
At some point in times time in the Middle Ages, receiving from the chalice was indeed forbidden (specifically by the Council of Constance, 1415).

We have come a long way in this, in being allowed to receive both specie, but it was not so straight forward then.

Just for the record, I am not against receiving from the priest’s chalice. In fact in my earlier post I did mention I like that.

*By the Middle Ages, the Church had become, like most of European society, increasingly hierarchical. There was much stress on being holy when receiving Communion, and a greatly heightened appreciation of the sufferings of Christ. This meant that all who approached the altar were to be as pure as possible, and inevitably led to the exclusion of the laity from administering the Eucharist, reserving the practice to the clergy. It is difficult to say when the practice of offering the chalice to the people stopped, but it may be presumed that this was part of the way in which Church authorities sought to prevent anything disrespectful happening to the Eucharist; it was also, by this time, that Communion was given only on the tongue.

This practice was challenged by the Bohemian reformer, Jacob of Mies, who in 1414 began to offer Communion under both kinds to his congregation. The matter was reviewed by the 13th Session of the Council of Constance, in 1415; the council rejected the grounds for offering the chalice to lay people and banned the practice. This became the most emblematic issue of the Hussite Wars, which resulted in the permission of the communion under both kinds for Utraquists in Bohemia in 1433 (it would be banned again in 1627 and allowed again by the Patent of Toleration in 1781). In the following century, this was challenged again by the Protestant Reformers, including Martin Luther, John Calvin and Huldrych Zwingli.[3] The Council of Trent referred to the pope the question whether the petition of the Holy Roman Emperor to have the use of the chalice allowed in his dominions be granted; in 1564 Pius IV did grant this permission to some German bishops, provided certain conditions were fulfilled. However, his concession was withdrawn in the following year.*

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communion_under_both_kinds

Peace.
 
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