While this may be true if the, said hug, took place during the sacrament, but it certainly has no affect on the sacrament if the priest did it after the sacrament had been completed which seems to be the case, in this case, from what I have read anyway:shrug:Tex, I have been lurking briefly on this thread since yesterday, and the very thread title somewhat troubles me, but not from any aspect of covert sexuality kind of thing. That is not the particular angle I wish to focus on.
Confession (formerly, Penance) is a Sacrament. It is a moment for God to entire our lives, directly. The priest is the indirect (but essential!) administrator. It is not a “personal” moment between priest and penitent – even when that moment is face to face. I think that is the main reason why I almost always prefer the confessional box – because there is no opportunity to focus on personal, visual, tactile interaction. I experience myself as alone, in the dark, with God, who is speaking through the priest. It is God, not the priest, who alone ‘sees in the dark.’ Our sins are always as visible as the sun, to Him. He does not need a priest’s face to “view” our sins.
I have had one excellent, grace-enriching face-to-face Confession, but the priest in that case is an extraordinary priest and just incarnated the whole moment with Jesus. Even then, this confessor did not hug me. I.m.h.o. this breaches the form of the sacrament. It is a formal event. The focus should be strictly restoring the pentitent – not to relationship with the confessor – but to relationship with the Creator and Redeemer. Again, a skilled priest who is as focused on the sin (not the sinner) as the pentitent is, can make a face-to-face moment a powerfully redeeming moment, but not every confessor can do that, nor is every pentitent ready at any particular time to do that.
Again, i.m.o., the gratuitous hug gesture reduces the signficance of the sacrament and distracts from it. Evidence of this is that you’ve had to post about it now, are still thinking about it, etc.
In the case I cited above, the priest laid his hands on my head. Other priests in face-to-face make a cross on the pentitent’s forehead, and sometimes rest a hand firmly on the shoulder while pronouncing the absolution. Those are all appropriate (if chosen), i.m.o.
I don’t think she meant that the hug invalidated the sacrament; I think she meant that a hug inserts an unnecessary personal element into the sacrament that detracts from the priest’s role of in persona Christi.While this may be true if the, said hug, took place during the sacrament, but it certainly has no affect on the sacrament if the priest did it after the sacrament had been completed which seems to be the case, in this case, from what I have read anyway:shrug:
That’s what I’m going to do next time I see him. If he has a problem with that (though he’s a pretty understanding person and I don’t think he would), well, then adios.TexMex tell the priest in question that you don’t want to be hugged. Alternatively, you can go to a different confessor. You need to move on for your own sake!
Very beautifully put. I remember many years ago my then Parish Priest, who was a Monsignor Canon, saying one night he was lonely and thought of 'phoning up a priest in the Diocese who he thought might be lonely. He was a truly marvellous Priest and a defender of and promoter of Family life. May he Rest in Peace. I understand the anxiety expressed and agree with the sentiment that if uncomfortable go to another priest, preferably in an adjacent parish. In passing my Parish Priest is 87 and a truly marvellous pastor. I count myself fortunate to have him in my corner.You own your personal space, and if it makes you feel uncomfortable, then it makes you feel uncomfortable. There are no right or wrong feelings.
That said, consider what it must be like to be a priest; you say he’s around 80 and my guess is that he has been a priest probably for 50 years. Can you see yourself going 50 years without any kind of physical (I’m not speaking sexual here, just basic affection) contact?
I once heard a priest describe himself as belonging to a “the community of the un-hugged”. It hit home, about how lonely the life of a parish priest must seem at times. It’s a huge sacrifice, to know you’ll never come home to a pair of loving arms happy to see you, never share your bed with a loving spouse, never have kids to hug and love unconditionally, and with the recent abuse scandals, have every minor gesture of affection scrutinized as a possible sign of unhealthy sexual desires.
I can’t imagine ever living that way.
Just a thought.
Bill, you are correct. Wrong choice of words on my part. Form refers to one of the two key elements of a sacrament (in addition to properly ordained administrator of sacrament). What I should have said is:While this may be true if the, said hug, took place during the sacrament, but it certainly has no affect on the sacrament if the priest did it after the sacrament had been completed which seems to be the case, in this case, from what I have read anyway:shrug:
Touch I a gift from God. I live with a hug and touch family and church…Touch sends care and comfort…Yes it has been perverted by the devil…You need to have safeguards in place like the pastors/secretaries door is always open and He never councils a lone female with out some one else present…I’m 5’9 and was doing constuction before I had health problems from a work accident…I maybe be bearded with rough hands but I like touch/hugs…Believe me I’m not a sissy…I say, no hugging. Then there’s no possibility of scandal.
Also: I recall St. Padre Pio bopped a female relative on the head with a book:; he wasn’t, as a friar, allowed to touch any women, I think. So there’s that aspect, also.
Priests are targets of the Devil and people oppressed by same. Hugging people could be used as leverage in a lawsuit.
Adult men wanting hugs? Sounds a bit sissy, to me.