C
Church_Militant
Guest
Can’t forget what Christ said … “By their fruits you will know them”. Did it increase the faith and devotion to God of many people? Yes…then there’s your answer…every time.
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L
Lenten_ashes
Guest
Apparitions freaked me out as a protestant, tbh.
Now I am indifferent about them.
But there is no denying the positivity to come out of our Lady of Guadalupe for example. Mexico was totally pagan, well like 95% prior to her appearance. Now it’s mainly Catholic Christian.
So if a person believes that Catholicism is a valid Christian faith, he or she must also acknowledge the good to come out of these Marian apparitions.
P
Potato1237
Guest
I’m just wondering that what if it is satans grand plan? My Protestant friends tell me that all private revelations from Catholic Mystics are evil and unbiblical. How can we know if it is truly Jesus or if it is a satanic false spirit?
L
Lenten_ashes
Guest
Jesus said:
Look at the Virgin of Guadalupe for a example. Mexico was mostly pagan when she appeared, to this day they are now 93% Christian with 83% of that being Catholic Christian. Satan would have to be some kind of fool to cast himself out of there like that. Makes no sense.
And the apostle John says:
The Church investigates claims like apparitions and they do test the Spirits. And there is nobody more well equipped to test them than the Church established by the Lord.
D
Della
Guest
What grand plan? To convert people to Christ? That has been the fruit of all approved Marian apparitions. Many conversions, healings, people renewing their faith in Christ have been the good fruit of approved apparitions. Tell me where any of that helps Satan’s cause?
And who made them experts? By whose authority do they determine that? It sounds like you have a group of very anti-Catholic friends who are trying their best to destroy your faith in Christ’s Church. Don’t listen to them. They have zero authority from God to speak about matters of faith and morals. Christ gave that authority to the Apostles and their successors. No where did he give such authority to any others. No where.
Because, as Lenten_ashes pointed out, the Church fully investigates any claims to apparitions. First the local bishop looks into it and decides what is happening–the bishop whose authority comes from Christ himself. If there is anything wrong about such claims he makes it clear to the faithful of his diocese. It’s up to the local bishop to make such decisions. If he declares an apparitions “worthy of belief” he’s done so after fully investigating all the circumstances and everyone involved. It’s quite a lengthy, grueling investigation not merely signing off on an apparition with no proofs or because it might be nice to have one in his diocese. Bishops take such things very seriously. If it is of Satan, believe me, the bishop will stamp it out quick. My bishop stopped such a thing in our diocese a few years ago involving a gal in my parish who claimed to receive messages from Mary. After the bishop decided that nothing spiritual was happening, the whole things died out pretty quickly. Don’t listen to people who don’t know what they’re talking about who try to use fear to disturb your faith. Listen to Christ’s Church whose authority to decide such matters comes from Christ himself.
P
Potato1237
Guest
Thank you! I have heard however that the women in Genesis is Sarah not Mary. I suppose we must trust the church on these matters. Thanks for the prayers.Greetings. Praying for your grandpa.
If the Church investigated these claims, and they did, you can be certain they are not the work of demons.
Personally, I am indifferent about private revelation.
But taking a look at Fatima, we know the major miracle to come out of that was the sun “dancing” of which tens of thousands of people witnessed. Then turn to the book of revelation chapter 12:
The Church has always understood this passage to be referring to Mary and Jesus. Yes it’s the Church as protestants would claim, but when it speaks of individuals, it refers to Jesus and Mary.
Notice the similarities? The woman clothed with the sun…and a dancing sun at Fatima?
And that woman who is battling Satan in Rev 12 was foretold in Genesis 3:15:
Notice the word “enmity”…that means like a great amount of active hostility. Mary is a arch enemy of Satan.
Mary is told by Simeon that a sword will pierce her very soul. This is why we hear about her immaculate heart:
Understand how the communion of saints works. We are all one body, when one of us sins, it hurts the entire body, that would include the most blessed and Holy woman to ever exist, Jesus Mother.
I would need to investigate further if maybe there is a translation issue in regards to what was said about sinning against her in particular.
I was a protestant for 13 years and some of that time was anti-Catholic. I explored subject after subject with my objections and found reasonable explanations for all of them. I agree with the others here who are warning you about well intended protestant polemic sites. They mean well but you have to understand their position - first of all they have a incomplete bible, second of all they have a fallible understanding of that incomplete bible. And lastly most of them have totally separated themselves from their Catholic roots and the early church. They do real well with what they do have and we shouldn’t deny that, but they lack the total deposit of the faith and this is problematic in regards to proper understanding in conformity with the pillar and foundation of truth 1 Tim 3:15
L
Lenten_ashes
Guest
That’s a strange and unsubstantiated interpretation of that verse.
Most protestants wot deny that this is Mary.
P
Potato1237
Guest
I just feel concerned that “Mary” seems to focus on her self in Fatima. Rather than our Lord. How can she say "Only I can help/save you. This is actually very disturbing. I feel like things like this give a foothold to Protestants who are anti Catholic. Also, correct me if I’m wrong, but the first apparition was only in 1531(there have been alleged ones according to tradition before that like in 40 A.D. I have heard.) in sorry guys but this stuff really scares me and makes me question my already weak faith. Why would Jesus tell us to venerate an image or to do penance? I thought he made atonement on the cross. Sometimes; as much as I hate to say it, I feel like our church and apparitions could be completely demonic. Jesus said so few are saved. The Catholic Church is the largest denomination. Now I know that a vast number are lukewarm Catholics. But still. I just don’t get it. Apparently Teresa of Avila encountered demons pretending to be Jesus. Can someone tell me about this? It may help.
Thank you all again!
Thank you all again!
P
Potato1237
Guest
I just feel like this is the Holy Spirit convicting me the Catholic Church is wrong when I feel this way. And I don’t want that to be true.
C
Church_Militant
Guest
Feelings…emotions…are a source of regular deception and error. Who has the 2,000 years of scholarship and Christian history?
Find that in any n-C faith community if you can Potato.
Find that in any n-C faith community if you can Potato.
C
Church_Militant
Guest
Feelings…emotions…are a source of regular deception and error. Who has the 2,000 years of scholarship and Christian history?
Find that in any n-C faith community if you can Potato.
P
Potato1237
Guest
I certainly will. Thanks! And I enjoy your blog by the way!Feelings…emotions…are a source of regular deception and error. Who has the 2,000 years of scholarship and Christian history?
Find that in any n-C faith community if you can Potato.
D
Della
Guest
I’m pretty familiar with the Fatima apparitions and I don’t recall Mary saying that only she could save us. Please give us an actual citation that she said this, if you can. Certainly Mary is a help to our salvation–as are we all who are co-workers with Christ. Mary is the supreme co-worker with God in helping to save us, her spiritual children. Mary is our mother in the order of grace for she, and only she conceived and gave birth to Christ. On the cross Jesus gave Mary to John, the Church has always seen this as Jesus giving Mary to all his followers–even those who don’t believe he intended to do this.
I’m not fully up on apparitions, but prayers for Mary’s intercession and aid were found in the catacombs of Rome written by the Christians who were driven there to worship God during the persecutions. That was in the 1st and 2nd centuries. Devotion to Mary is quite ancient. You need to read a bit of real history instead of listening to people who have no knowledge and worse, are hostile to the teachings of your Church.
Your friends are trying to scare you to drive you from the Church. None of what they are saying is true. I used to be very anti-Catholic myself, and used to try to bring people out of the Catholic Church, too, so I know exactly what they are saying and doing. What they’re telling you is not true–they don’t know that, I’d imagine any more than I didn’t know–they’re only repeating what they’ve been told. But they don’t know what they’re talking about. Don’t listen to them.
The atonement Jesus obtained for us was a propitiation for our sins. He redeemed us–but salvation is something else. We damage ourselves and others and the body of Christ by our sins. We receive absolution in confession, but we need to repair that damage by penance. You need to educate yourself about these things and again, stop listening to your anti-Catholic friends who don’t understand real theology. They are feeding your fears with lies–not that they know they are lying, but they are lying to you just the same.
Our Church was founded by Christ himself. No other Protestant church can claim this because all of them were founded by men who rebelled against Christ’s Church to found their own churches, and it’s only gotten worse over the centuries so that now there are hundreds of Protestant denominations and sects. Which of them is right? Is that not demonic when Christ prayed that we all might be one?
First of all, the Church is not just another denomination. It is the universal Church–the body of Christ. All who are baptized are a part of Christ’s body, but those not Catholic are joined imperfectly to it. So, even Protestants, and thus all Christians everywhere, are our brothers and sisters. Jesus intended that his Church be formed from people from throughout the whole world when he sent his Apostles “to the farthest ends of the earth.”
When Jesus said that few will saved he was using a Jewish mode of expression which uses hyperbole to make a point. It has nothing to do with whose “denomination” is the largest. Nothing at all. Jesus was warning his followers against complacency–a stern warning meant to keep us humble before God and wanting to not sin. He gave no numbers as to how many will be saved. Perhaps, compared to how many people have lived and died the number will seem few that will be saved, but again, it has nothing to do with anyone’s denomination or its size.
And it didn’t fool her because a) she discerned it wasn’t the Lord, and b) her bishop, who has the authority from Christ himself to decide such things was there to help her discern if she couldn’t do so herself. Our bishops are the safeguard against demonic activity. Christ gave them their authority, therefore we can trust their judgment.
My dear, you need to stop listening to anti-Catholic arguments, which are full of holes and simply not true. You need to learn your Catholic faith for your soul’s good and so you can defend it against such attacks, which are truly demonic since they make you afraid. Jesus told us to “be not afraid.” And St. Paul told us that even if an angel should preach to us another Gospel than the one given to the Apostles (the men upon whom Christ founded his Church) they were to be anathema–cursed by God. Now that is what we should truly be afraid of–of listening to those who are trying to destroy our faith in Christ and the Church he founded.
J
JosephHope
Guest
Many people feel happy when they hear about apparitions and such revelations.
Unfortunately, I do not as many people with years of sins or worse years thinking that they are good Christians while they were not, I am now scared, living a scrupulous life where I question every act I do and am very irritable not to mention that fear and anxiety made my bleeding ulcer come back.
I confessed it and will do it again but I think the best thing for people like me is to stop visiting sites or people or any such triggers. And while the Vatican has its own procedures and it takes years, I wish that they speed up such processes because many Catholics and non-catholics are making a living by promoting fear and that terrible stuff are to happen.
Unfortunately, I do not as many people with years of sins or worse years thinking that they are good Christians while they were not, I am now scared, living a scrupulous life where I question every act I do and am very irritable not to mention that fear and anxiety made my bleeding ulcer come back.
I confessed it and will do it again but I think the best thing for people like me is to stop visiting sites or people or any such triggers. And while the Vatican has its own procedures and it takes years, I wish that they speed up such processes because many Catholics and non-catholics are making a living by promoting fear and that terrible stuff are to happen.
L
Lenten_ashes
Guest
I’m pretty familiar with the Fatima apparitions and I don’t recall Mary saying that only she could save us. Please give us an actual citation that she said this, if you can. Certainly Mary is a help to our salvation–as are we all who are co-workers with Christ. Mary is the supreme co-worker with God in helping to save us, her spiritual children. Mary is our mother in the order of grace for she, and only she conceived and gave birth to Christ. On the cross Jesus gave Mary to John, the Church has always seen this as Jesus giving Mary to all his followers–even those who don’t believe he intended to do this.
I’m not fully up on apparitions, but prayers for Mary’s intercession and aid were found in the catacombs of Rome written by the Christians who were driven there to worship God during the persecutions. That was in the 1st and 2nd centuries. Devotion to Mary is quite ancient. You need to read a bit of real history instead of listening to people who have no knowledge and worse, are hostile to the teachings of your Church.
Your friends are trying to scare you to drive you from the Church. None of what they are saying is true. I used to be very anti-Catholic myself, and used to try to bring people out of the Catholic Church, too, so I know exactly what they are saying and doing. What they’re telling you is not true–they don’t know that, I’d imagine any more than I didn’t know–they’re only repeating what they’ve been told. But they don’t know what they’re talking about. Don’t listen to them.
The atonement Jesus obtained for us was a propitiation for our sins. He redeemed us–but salvation is something else. We damage ourselves and others and the body of Christ by our sins. We receive absolution in confession, but we need to repair that damage by penance. You need to educate yourself about these things and again, stop listening to your anti-Catholic friends who don’t understand real theology. They are feeding your fears with lies–not that they know they are lying, but they are lying to you just the same.
Our Church was founded by Christ himself. No other Protestant church can claim this because all of them were founded by men who rebelled against Christ’s Church to found their own churches, and it’s only gotten worse over the centuries so that now there are hundreds of Protestant denominations and sects. Which of them is right? Is that not demonic when Christ prayed that we all might be one?
First of all, the Church is not just another denomination. It is the universal Church–the body of Christ. All who are baptized are a part of Christ’s body, but those not Catholic are joined imperfectly to it. So, even Protestants, and thus all Christians everywhere, are our brothers and sisters. Jesus intended that his Church be formed from people from throughout the whole world when he sent his Apostles “to the farthest ends of the earth.”
When Jesus said that few will saved he was using a Jewish mode of expression which uses hyperbole to make a point. It has nothing to do with whose “denomination” is the largest. Nothing at all. Jesus was warning his followers against complacency–a stern warning meant to keep us humble before God and wanting to not sin. He gave no numbers as to how many will be saved. Perhaps, compared to how many people have lived and died the number will seem few that will be saved, but again, it has nothing to do with anyone’s denomination or its size.
And it didn’t fool her because a) she discerned it wasn’t the Lord, and b) her bishop, who has the authority from Christ himself to decide such things was there to help her discern if she couldn’t do so herself. Our bishops are the safeguard against demonic activity. Christ gave them their authority, therefore we can trust their judgment.
My dear, you need to stop listening to anti-Catholic arguments, which are full of holes and simply not true. You need to learn your Catholic faith for your soul’s good and so you can defend it against such attacks, which are truly demonic since they make you afraid. Jesus told us to “be not afraid.” And St. Paul told us that even if an angel should preach to us another Gospel than the one given to the Apostles (the men upon whom Christ founded his Church) they were to be anathema–cursed by God. Now that is what we should truly be afraid of–of listening to those who are trying to destroy our faith in Christ and the Church he founded.
Very well stated.
Potato (I get hungry when i read your posts lol), Protestants mean well, but they have a incomplete bible and a faulty understanding of that incomplete bible because they lack the total deposit of the faith.
To avoid being lead into error yourself and following them, it would be a great idea to invest some time getting stronger in your Catholic faith. Because I’m telling you, later on in life you will end feeling duped and finding your way back to the Catholic Church.
Christ told us just how close he planned on being with the Church he founded. He appeared to the apostles many times after His death. He said He would be with them always. Matt 28:20. He told Paul why do you persecute ME? But Paul had never met the Lord, Paul was persecuting CHRISTIANS (ACTS 9:4) This is a living Christian faith and private revelation is not wrong it’s evidence of what we see in the scriptures and in our own lives.
P
Potato1237
Guest
Thank you all so much!
D
Della
Guest
Jesus is the only Redeemer of mankind. All of us are to help each to salvation, in the many ways God gave us–through encouraging each other in the faith and by our prayers, etc. Mary also helps save us in the same way–through imitating her example of faithfulness and her prayers for us.
P
Potato1237
Guest
I understand now. Thank you!Jesus is the only Redeemer of mankind. All of us are to help each to salvation, in the many ways God gave us–through encouraging each other in the faith and by our prayers, etc. Mary also helps save us in the same way–through imitating her example of faithfulness and her prayers for us.
D
Della
Guest
:tiphat:
P
Potato1237
Guest
One last question haha I’m sorry guys. How do our prayers affect Gods will? How can we pray to get souls out of purgatory for example, if it is Gods unbending will for them to be their for a certain amount of time.
Thanks again. I don’t know where I’d be without CAF and all of it’s awesome users!
Thanks again. I don’t know where I’d be without CAF and all of it’s awesome users!
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