Pro-Choice folks, what are your reasons for supporting abortion?

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It is a woman’s choice to do with her own body what she chooses…but not the life that lives in her. Our laws have twisted the truth of abortion, to making it about a woman’s choice. It’s a woman’s choice to sever her leg, if she really wants to, but it shouldn’t be anyone’s choice to take the life of anyone–in the embryonic stage of life or not. It is the beginning stage of life. We were all once an embryo. Life begins at the cellular level…and if we find a small bit of bacteria on another planet, scientists are jumping for joy because they have discovered LIFE on another planet.

Yet, here we don’t call an embryo–life. We call it …something else. It is not something else, it’s life.

Do we only refer to something as living, only if we choose it to be? If a pregnant woman is murdered, the murderer will be charged with the murder of TWO victims, not just one. Is that because the mother chose to not abort? Do we only put value on life, because we choose it to be so?

The sooner our society dispels its love for narcissism, the better.
Very good post, Whatevergirl. I just wanted to comment on the part I highlighted. If a women wanted to severe her leg (especially a healthy one) our society wouldn’t defend her “choice”. Hopefully the people around her would dissuade her from doing it. She could be legally deemed a risk to herself. She could be at least required counseling.

But a woman’ right to choose is sacrosanct? :confused:

Also, I close person to me had cancer. His cancer diagnosis and subsequent treatment took time, he needed biopsies, second opinions, other biopsies. Finally, after a few months…then the removal of the diseased organ.

But, (since I don’t know the laws in all states, I’ll use my own as a reference) in my state, a woman can take a pregnancy test in the morning, and abort in the afternoon. No counseling is necessary, no one to dissuade her, no waiting period. A woman can choose to “terminate” up until the 24th week, no questions asked, no referrals. This "choice’ is protected by law.

So we are more conservative in treating cancer, than in terminating a pregnancy!

A 15 year old girl can go in and have an abortion, her parents never have to know.

Funny, I was at the pediatrician with my kids, and a young girl of about 15 walked in. She seemed to have a cold and wanted to see the pediatrician. The pediatrician wanted to know if she had her parent with her. She didn’t. He told her he wasn’t allowed to see her without a parent. He probably cared for her since birth, but he wasn’t legally allowed to examine her without a parent.

Same girl can have an abortion without her parents knowledge. These are the laws. :mad:
 
…oh, and you forgot to say card carrying, I have one that says, “I am a Catholic, in case of an accident please call a Priest.”👍
…and also yes, quite frankly you are stinking up the world with this idea of yours that abortion isn’t murder. You’ll find no
“glimmer of openmindedness amidst the steely rhetoric” that you keep claiming that …"*If *abortion is not murder…", it is-Period!!
You, quite frankly are the one that needs to open your mind, not to mention your heart and soul and realize this. No one is judging any woman, just the facts, the sin of abortion is murder, plain and simple.
👍 👍
 
And what are the odds of Marietta, or anyone else who does not agree with you-opening up their minds when this is how they are treated?

Nobody’s mind was ever changed by someone’s insults.
It’s just the truth. Would you rather I lied to her and tried to see her side of it? (Pretty much that is what this world acts like these days, try to see everyone’s side of everything, she’s been given all kinds of facts and information, so I guess now she’ll just pick up her toys and go home because nobody wants to play her way.)
 
"Do women with religious affiliations have abortions?

*“Nearly eight in 10 U.S. women obtaining an abortion report a religious affiliation (43% are Protestant, 27% Catholics and 8% another religion). Among all women aged 15–44, 51% are Protestant, *28% are Catholic *and 5% belong to other religions.” *

– Guttmacher Institute

Abortion clinics across the United States have to fill out cumbersome paperwork at the end of each year and report their stats to Guttmacher. These figures are accurate and are even echoed by uberconservative R. J. Kendra, statistician:

" . . .Catholics are not exempt from this holocaust, as there appears to be no significant differences between the rates of abortion for Catholics and non-Catholics . . ."

Gonna have to set up some kinda auditorium seating now in Purgatory.

marietta
 
Gonna have to set up some kinda auditorium seating now in Purgatory.

marietta
Indeed.
So you have now proven that Catholics can sin just as easily as anyone else.

Now how about the questions posed to you?
Why should the choice to abort be a valid choice?
 
"Do women with religious affiliations have abortions?

*“Nearly eight in 10 U.S. women obtaining an abortion report a religious affiliation (43% are Protestant, 27% Catholics *and 8% another religion). Among all women aged 15–44, 51% are Protestant, *28% are Catholic *and 5% belong to other religions.”

– Guttmacher Institute

Abortion clinics across the United States have to fill out cumbersome paperwork at the end of each year and report their stats to Guttmacher. These figures are accurate and are even echoed by uberconservative R. J. Kendra, statistician:

" . . .Catholics are not exempt from this holocaust, as there appears to be no significant differences between the rates of abortion for Catholics and non-Catholics . . ."

Gonna have to set up some kinda auditorium seating now in Purgatory.

marietta
I don’t think anyone on this forum suggested that Catholics do not participate in abortions. But just because the Catholic Church is pro-Life and their are certain Catholics who take it upon themselves to ignore Catholic teaching, does not prove that chosing to murder an innocent child is right. If you posted your stats as evidence that we should be pro-choice, it doesn’t help your argument at all. Abortion is still murder, no matter who has one, who chooses to ignore that it is happening, who chooses to endorse a pro-choice stance. No matter what…it is murder. Plain and simple.

Certain Catholic public figures are pro-choice and receive the Body of Christ —it is still wrong, still a sin, and it in no way should be used as an example of what Catholics should do.
 
Hi Marietta,

I see your statistics on Catholic women having abortions. These are not new for me…I know that Catholic women have abortions. It is very sad. I think especially for a Catholic, because our faith teaches the beauty of life.

Jesus is mercy. Plain and simple. As I said before, the Crucifix is the symbol of his mercy. All we need to do is reconcile ourselves to Him. As Catholics we are especially blessed to have a Sacrament of Reconciliation. “I absolve you of your sins, In the name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit.” These are such beautiful words. Jesus’ mercy is real.

As for Purgatory, I will paraphrase my one of my favorite Priest, Father John Corapi…Purgatory is a blessing, if we didn’t have Purgatory we’d have to be perfect when we check out.

Sometimes, I look at the Crucifix with this simple prayer, “You did this for us.” We didn’t merit Jesus’ mercy. He gives it freely. We only need to ask.

For any woman who is post abortive and struggling with pain or anguish or anger or whatever, I invite them to go to Jesus. He can take the worst sin and the worst sinner and redeem them.
 
vz71:

In English this time: I do not defend the choice to abort. I defend the right to choose. The woman may choose to abort and she may choose not to. If the negative outcome of choice is on everyone’s head, then who among you is willing to go down for Catholic Kat’s “[c]ertain Catholic public figures [who] are pro-choice and receive the Body of Christ”?

What I would prefer is that abortion services remain legal in the U.S. I have been in offices where abortions are performed, more than once, and what I have observed is professional care in a meticulously clean environment, with open-minded staff and compassionate doctors. Don’t even go there: these doctors have reconciled their actions spiritually or philosophically and, after all, we’re not here to judge, now are we?

Now, as far as the choice to terminate a pregnancy being a “valid” choice - well, my trusty old Webster’s defines “valid” this way:

“Having legal force; properly performed and binding under the law.” That is the preferred definition in my dictionary. So, considering abortion is currently legal here, I think you’ve answered your own question, vz71.

I would prefer that abortion remain legal in the United States. I have not continued my participation on this thread in an effort to “convert” any of you to a pro-choice stance. I continue to post here in the event that a pregnant teen or a pregnant teacher or a pregnant firefighter’s wife, who might be in a compromised situation, might look around for options and find these posts here. Aside from the name-calling and the excitability of some of the participants, I think this thread has been a great exercise in the expression of faith, morals and diversity. And if one of these women finds us here, maybe she can come to understand herself and her own beliefs well enough to make an intelligent choice. We don’t know what she might choose.

That’s my point.

marietta
 
…who might be in a compromised situation, might look around for options … enough to make an intelligent choice. We don’t know what she might choose.

That’s my point.

marietta
:banghead:

Your point is dull but dangerous.
 
I pray daily that she may choose LIFE. I will continue to.
As for you Marietta, may I suggest that you read the book:
“The Hand of God” (A journey from Death to Life by the Abortion
Doctor who changed his mind.) By Bernard N. Nathanson, M.D.
What he says in his book gives a far different view of it then you do.
The man converted by prayers of intercession on his behalf.
I will keep you in my prayers too and all those that are involved in the culture of death.
 
APOSTOLIC JOURNEY
TO THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
AND VISIT TO THE UNITED NATIONS
ORGANIZATION HEADQUARTERS
MEETING WITH THE BISHOPS
OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

RESPONSES OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI
TO THE QUESTIONS POSED BY THE BISHOPS

National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception in Washington, D.C.
Wednesday, 16 April 2008
  1. The Holy Father is asked to give his assessment of the challenge of increasing secularism in public life and relativism in intellectual life, and his advice on how to confront these challenges pastorally and evangelize more effectively.
I touched upon this theme briefly in my address. It strikes me as significant that here in America, unlike many places in Europe, the secular mentality has not been intrinsically opposed to religion. Within the context of the separation of Church and State, American society has always been marked by a fundamental respect for religion and its public role, and, if polls are to be believed, the American people are deeply religious. But it is not enough to count on this traditional religiosity and go about business as usual, even as its foundations are being slowly undermined. A serious commitment to evangelization cannot prescind from a profound diagnosis of the real challenges the Gospel encounters in contemporary American culture.

Of course, what is essential is a correct understanding of the just autonomy of the secular order, an autonomy which cannot be divorced from God the Creator and his saving plan (cf. Gaudium et Spes, 36). Perhaps America’s brand of secularism poses a particular problem: it allows for professing belief in God, and respects the public role of religion and the Churches, but at the same time it can subtly reduce religious belief to a lowest common denominator. Faith becomes a passive acceptance that certain things “out there” are true, but without practical relevance for everyday life. The result is a growing separation of faith from life: living “as if God did not exist”. This is aggravated by an individualistic and eclectic approach to faith and religion: far from a Catholic approach to “thinking with the Church”, each person believes he or she has a right to pick and choose, maintaining external social bonds but without an integral, interior conversion to the law of Christ. Consequently, rather than being transformed and renewed in mind, Christians are easily tempted to conform themselves to the spirit of this age (cf. Rom 12:3). We have seen this emerge in an acute way in the scandal given by Catholics who promote an alleged right to abortion.

On a deeper level, secularism challenges the Church to reaffirm and to pursue more actively her mission in and to the world. As the Council made clear, the lay faithful have a particular responsibility in this regard. What is needed, I am convinced, is a greater sense of the intrinsic relationship between the Gospel and the natural law on the one hand, and, on the other, the pursuit of authentic human good, as embodied in civil law and in personal moral decisions. In a society that rightly values personal liberty, the Church needs to promote at every level of her teaching – in catechesis, preaching, seminary and university instruction – an apologetics aimed at affirming the truth of Christian revelation, the harmony of faith and reason, and a sound understanding of freedom, seen in positive terms as a liberation both from the limitations of sin and for an authentic and fulfilling life. In a word, the Gospel has to be preached and taught as an integral way of life, offering an attractive and true answer, intellectually and practically, to real human problems. The “dictatorship of relativism”, in the end, is nothing less than a threat to genuine human freedom, which only matures in generosity and fidelity to the truth.

Much more, of course, could be said on this subject: let me conclude, though, by saying that I believe that the Church in America, at this point in her history, is faced with the challenge of recapturing the Catholic vision of reality and presenting it, in an engaging and imaginative way, to a society which markets any number of recipes for human fulfillment. I think in particular of our need to speak to the hearts of young people, who, despite their constant exposure to messages contrary to the Gospel, continue to thirst for authenticity, goodness and truth. Much remains to be done, particularly on the level of preaching and catechesis in parishes and schools, if the new evangelization is to bear fruit for the renewal of ecclesial life in America.🙂 vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/speeches/2008/april/documents/hf_ben-xvi_spe_20080416_response-bishops_en.html
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/b...ben-xvi_spe_20080416_response-bishops_en.html
 
It is a woman’s choice to do with her own body what she chooses…but not the life that lives in her. Our laws have twisted the truth of abortion, to making it about a woman’s choice. It’s a woman’s choice to sever her leg, if she really wants to, but it shouldn’t be anyone’s choice to take the life of anyone–in the embryonic stage of life or not.
I would take it a step further and say that if a woman chooses to sever her leg, she should be arrested as well and at the very least put into a mental institution. Just because it is her body, she is not free to do with it, or to it, or use it however she pleases.
 
"Do women with religious affiliations have abortions?

*“Nearly eight in 10 U.S. women obtaining an abortion report a religious affiliation (43% are Protestant, 27% Catholics *and 8% another religion). Among all women aged 15–44, 51% are Protestant, *28% are Catholic *and 5% belong to other religions.”

– Guttmacher Institute
Doesn’t mean its okay to kill people.
Abortion clinics across the United States have to fill out cumbersome paperwork at the end of each year and report their stats to Guttmacher. These figures are accurate and are even echoed by uberconservative R. J. Kendra, statistician:

" . . .Catholics are not exempt from this holocaust, as there appears to be no significant differences between the rates of abortion for Catholics and non-Catholics . . ."
Doesn’t make it okay to kill people. 😉
 
In English this time: I do not defend the choice to abort. I defend the right to choose.
How are you defending the right to choose if you are not defending the ‘choice’ to abort?
The woman may choose to abort and she may choose not to. If the negative outcome of choice is on everyone’s head, then who among you is willing to go down for Catholic Kat’s “[c]ertain Catholic public figures [who] are pro-choice and receive the Body of Christ”?
Whatever errors public figures may make, does not make it okay to kill people.
What I would prefer is that abortion services remain legal in the U.S.
Abortion should be outlawed and criminaly prosecuted.
I have been in offices where abortions are performed, more than once,
And you did nothing to defend the lives of all the people who were being murdered?
and what I have observed is professional care in a meticulously clean environment, with open-minded staff and compassionate doctors.
who used sterile and clean instruments of death to crush, dismember, and burn living people with brine until they died.
Don’t even go there: these doctors have reconciled their actions spiritually or philosophically and, after all, we’re not here to judge, now are we?
They have not reconciled their actions, they have either deceived themselves, lied to themselves, or tell themselves the truth but choose to kill anyway.
Now, as far as the choice to terminate a pregnancy being a “valid” choice - well, my trusty old Webster’s defines “valid” this way:

“Having legal force; properly performed and binding under the law.” That is the preferred definition in my dictionary. So, considering abortion is currently legal here, I think you’ve answered your own question, vz71.
And with that you have positively refuted yourself, since the commission of murder being an invalid choice is absolutely binding under NATURAL law.
I would prefer that abortion remain legal in the United States.
Abortion should be outlawed and criminaly prosecuted.
I have not continued my participation on this thread in an effort to “convert” any of you to a pro-choice stance. I continue to post here in the event that a pregnant teen or a pregnant teacher or a pregnant firefighter’s wife, who might be in a compromised situation, might look around for options and find these posts here.
It is a very good thing that you are here to present your reasons for supporting abortion in this thread. That way the those pregnant teens, teachers, and firefighters’ wives who were unsure about abortion and who were trying to rationalize their thoughts, will with God’s grace come to see the logical falacy of your arguments as the numerous posters on this thread have pointed out.
 
What to do with all this love? It’s staggering, the amount of time and energy so many of you have spent listening without judging, truly contemplating what I was trying to convey to you. Your refinement, your politeness, your generosity of thought and spirit - well, gosh darn it, I’m just overwhelmed.

A fabulous job done with vigor and zeal by Christ’s most vociferous soldiers! Although, as I thumb through my Baltimore Catechism and my Cathechism of the Catholic Church, neither
has a glossary which contains any of the expressions of affection listed above. Can anyone explain that?
And therefore, this justifies killing people?
 
As for you Marietta, may I suggest that you read the book:
“The Hand of God” (A journey from Death to Life by the Abortion
Doctor who changed his mind.)
This is a good suggestion Allhers but I wouldn’t hold my breath.

Have you noticed Marrietta hasn’t truly answered a single question? She just keeps coming back with the same tired pro-abort mantra. The OP of this thread asked for reasons why people are pro-abort. Marrietta can’t or won’t answer this question anymore than she can or will answer any question that has been posed to her on this thread. The reason for this is two fold. The pro-abort has no conscience and he or she either will not or cannot think. Anyone with a conscience who applies serious thought to the issue of abortion, will become pro-life. If I thought Marrietta was sincere, I would send her to www.abortionno.org and if she had a conscience she would begin her journey toward the hard truth about abortion and in time she would change her mind. As it is, she is more intent on wasting our time and going around in circles.

To new posters on this thread,

You are wasting your time with Marietta. She is as dead in her mind and heart as the 40+ million children who have been exterminated legally in this country over the past 35 years. There is nothing more we can do but pray for her and others like her who have decided that the culture of death is where they wish to spend thier time.

May God Bless
 
It’s just the truth. Would you rather I lied to her and tried to see her side of it? (Pretty much that is what this world acts like these days, try to see everyone’s side of everything, she’s been given all kinds of facts and information, so I guess now she’ll just pick up her toys and go home because nobody wants to play her way.)
I believe I read something somewhere about “speaking the Truth in Love”…
 
I believe I read something somewhere about “speaking the Truth in Love”…
This is true but usually the soft, squwishy love is just that, soft and squwishy and it has no effect. Tough love, on the other hand, has been proven to be very effective.

Abortion is ugly. Why do you want us to make it pretty by being soft and squwishy? The truth is sometimes hard to hear, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t tell it.

Believe me, Marietta can take care of herself. From what I’ve read of her posts, she too is a tough cookie.
 
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