projector screen to display text hymns?

[choy]

There is no way that this 1958 document in any way precludes the use of some AV equipment here in 2010 if it’s used in a responsible manner. The gear available in 1958 – literally movie footage, “flim strips”, slides and overhead projectors could never do the Mass any justice.

On the other hand I was at one church that appeared to have two large and beautiful icons – one of Mary and one of Joseph on each side of the main sanctuary crucifix. It turns out they were two large screen plasma TVs sunken into the walls. No way could you tell until the image changed. Their application and use was masterful. No way did the creators of De Musica Sacra de Musica Liturgia anticipate such technology and perhaps such a masterful application.

Those that uniformly reject the application of such gifts within the Mass are terribly mistaken.

wow, they must have really generous parishoners

 

[lizaanne]

On the other hand I was at one church that appeared to have two large and beautiful icons – one of Mary and one of Joseph on each side of the main sanctuary crucifix. It turns out they were two large screen plasma TVs sunken into the walls. No way could you tell until the image changed. Their application and use was masterful. No way did the creators of De Musica Sacra de Musica Liturgia anticipate such technology and perhaps such a masterful application.

At the end of the day - it’s still two tvs in the sanctuary. Tacky.

No matter how you dress up a pig, it’s still a pig.

~Liza

 

[boatbearer]

wow, they must have really generous parishoners

I suspect so. The panels looked like icons even after very careful inspection. Their use was also masterful which means a great deal too.

They show the daily readings in CRISP looking images that look like a page out of a fancy Lectionary. 2-3 screen-fulls are sown at the beginning reminding people to extinguish cell phones, etc. Very professional.

 

[sulkow82]

Really? This surprises me. One of my local churches has a gigantic screen high up which displays hymn text. However, it is definitely not in the sanctuary! It is way over to the side.

This is the same thing with my parish. There are two (2) screens with projectors hooked up to a computer (outside the sanctuary). The Bishop has also had a DVD played where he discussed the plan for financing the revitalization of the Diocese (this was the only DVD played in the three years we’ve had the screens).

As a “screen-saver” between masses, they display the list of people for whom intentions are being prayed. After this, there are a few lines of announcements (the line “check the bulletin for more info.” is very common). This has reduced the time our priest spends on announcements to near non-existent.

OTOH, this is the same church that allows lay preaching of the homily in replacement of the priest, 4-5 times/year.

This, OTOH, is unheard of in our parish. It is either our priest or deacon who gives the homily.

 

[boatbearer]

At the end of the day - it’s still two tvs in the sanctuary. Tacky.

No matter how you dress up a pig, it’s still a pig.

~Liza

No, not “tacky.”

Amazing anyone could pass judgment on something they have never even seen.

I think that’s the problem with many on matters like this. They cling to an outdated document(s) or a bad real life experience(s) and assume that no one else has (or could) raised it several levels above the best they have ever personally experienced.

Many even work themselves up into an agitated lather as they equate the use of such technology as being “Protestant.” Utter malarkey.

Rather than express their own experiences for other people to reference they make nasty and erroneous remarks like “No matter how you dress up a pig, it’s still a pig.”

Sad – but not unexpected.

 

[lizaanne]

Rather than express their own experiences for other people to reference…

I did that. Read the thread.

I still think it is in very poor taste. I don’t care how fancy or artfully disguised it may be - it is still a tv or screen in the Church.

My goodness - what would happen if the power went out, or the technology died or something!!?? How would anyone function?

There are good an bad choices for what belongs in the Mass - I just think this is a bad choice. It takes the attention off what’s happening on the altar. Even if someone doesn’t need the screen/words/music - it’s right IN THEIR FACE when they look up, and it is distracting. ANY distraction during the Mass is unacceptable.

Just because everything else in our lives is flashed before us on shiny bright screens, large and small, does not mean the Mass needs to be as well. Can’t we just knock it down a notch for one hour a week? Do we ALWAYS have to have technology staring us in the face? Can’t God just be enough?

~Liza

 

[Cat]

Don’t you go to the movies??

This is a horrific idea.

Buy a printer and print them off yourself to take to Mass. Sancta Missa - Kyriale

~Liza

I’m guessing that when paper copies first were used in the Mass, that there were people who said, “This is a horrific idea.”

And I’m guessing that the first time the Papal Masses in Rome were filmed and broadcasted on television around the world, that there were people who said, “This is a horrific idea.”

Why on earth would being able to see and read the notes to the chants be any more “horrific” on an overhead than on sheets of paper? Why is looking UP at the words on a screen any more “horrific” than looking at the words on a sheet of paper? That makes no sense to me. I don’t see a demon in this at all. I’m utterly amazed at the vehemence in this thread when it comes to the simple transmission of information.

What about PDAs? Is it OK for us to look up the chants and other texts on the computer on the iPhone or other PDA and read them during Mass? Or is that also forbidden for some unfathomable reason?

In our parish, during the weekday school Masses, the Psalm responses are printed on large sheets of paper and hung up on the wall. Is that wrong? If it’s OK, why is it any different than using a projector or computer and screen? After all, the copies were printed by a computer printer, a bit of modern technology. And computers are definitely used for entertainment–in fact, our television is done through TiVo…

I have the feeling that the reason the Church has not rescinded this ancient dictum is that they have other things on their agenda that are much more important and they figure that the bishops can handle this one without bringing the Church down and destroying the witness of the Lord Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament.

I can’t remember the occasion, but I know that the Holy Father recently expressed a desire for more use of modern technology in the Church. I think he was talking about computer technology. Maybe some of the rest of you have the exact words and know the occasion. I’m pretty certain he was not speaking of the Mass. But the point is, the Church is not and never has been utterly opposed to the use of modern technology in the Mass. The Church is slow and careful about jumping on every modern bandwagon and that’s good. Perhaps they will choose to never normalize use of overhead projection of information. But I think they will. It’s just a question of time, waiting for them to get this on the agenda.

We also have to realize that in many Catholic church buildings, there is simply no place in the nave where the projections can be done without blocking the view to something beautiful–a stained glass window with a picture, an image of a saint or the Lord, a quote from Holy Scripture, etc. It would be disruptive to use screens and projections. In one of the ancient churches like this in our city, I’ve seen them use television sets set in the front of the church to show the DVDs that the bishop sends to be broadcast in every parish. They’re kind of small, unfortunately. I’m guessing that as modern churches are built, even if they have a traditional or ancient feeling in the art work and decor, that they will have a place in the nave set aside for a projection (just in case).

 

[sulkow82]

My goodness - what would happen if the power went out, or the technology died or something!!?? How would anyone function?

Well, if the power went out, would people be able to read the missal in the dark? If the technology didn’t work, then, there is always the tradition of apologizing and moving on from there. Just because there are those who appreciate the convenience of having a screen doesn’t mean that we see it as necessary to complete the service.

 

[ProVobis]

What about PDAs? Is it OK for us to look up the chants and other texts on the computer on the iPhone or other PDA and read them during Mass? Or is that also forbidden for some unfathomable reason?

In our parish, during the weekday school Masses, the Psalm responses are printed on large sheets of paper and hung up on the wall. Is that wrong? If it’s OK, why is it any different than using a projector or computer and screen?

Depends on the purpose. Is this done for the greater glory of God? Or just simply because they want to look cool so they can have something to talk about? Big difference.

 

[Cat]

Depends on the purpose. Is this done for the greater glory of God? Or just simply because they want to look cool so they can have something to talk about? Big difference.

I don’t understand this. Why would someone look cool (or think they look cool) because they are reading off a PDA instead of a book or pamphlet? That doesn’t make sense.

My husband is a systems administrator, and he is constantly on the computer. If he is on call and takes a ticket, he’ll sit in a restaurant or at the ice skating rink for several hours working, using his computer. This isn’t anything cool. Its just the way things are in the 21st Century. We get much of our information from a computer, and computers are often small. I don’t see what’s cool about everyday life. My daughters are the same way–my older daughter especially is constantly referring to her hand-held.

For years, my husband has used a Palm Pilot to read the Bible in church (Protestant). Maybe when those devices first came out, people noticed. But honestly, no one cared. What’s the difference–book, Palm, missal, overhead–they’re all just devices to read the Word of God.

Now if someone unrolled a scroll, or broke a wax seal and opened a large leather-bound book full of manuscript written in ink by a fountain-pen, and read the chant or the Scriptures–then I would be staring at them and thinking how utterly cool they are!

 

[choy]

I don’t understand this. Why would someone look cool (or think they look cool) because they are reading off a PDA instead of a book or pamphlet? That doesn’t make sense.

My husband is a systems administrator, and he is constantly on the computer. If he is on call and takes a ticket, he’ll sit in a restaurant or at the ice skating rink for several hours working, using his computer. This isn’t anything cool. Its just the way things are in the 21st Century. We get much of our information from a computer, and computers are often small. I don’t see what’s cool about everyday life. My daughters are the same way–my older daughter especially is constantly referring to her hand-held.

For years, my husband has used a Palm Pilot to read the Bible in church (Protestant). Maybe when those devices first came out, people noticed. But honestly, no one cared. What’s the difference–book, Palm, missal, overhead–they’re all just devices to read the Word of God.

Now if someone unrolled a scroll, or broke a wax seal and opened a large leather-bound book full of manuscript written in ink by a fountain-pen, and read the chant or the Scriptures–then I would be staring at them and thinking how utterly cool they are!

right. somewhere in the Church history, books weren’t common until the modern printing press came about. i wonder if it was a big issue then. perhaps there were a few who were saying those who use a book is less reverent because the words are not etched in their minds while i don’t have proof, i will not be surprised at all if that were true

 

[ProVobis]

My husband is a systems administrator, and he is constantly on the computer. If he is on call and takes a ticket, he’ll sit in a restaurant or at the ice skating rink for several hours working, using his computer. This isn’t anything cool. Its just the way things are in the 21st Century. We get much of our information from a computer, and computers are often small. I don’t see what’s cool about everyday life. My daughters are the same way–my older daughter especially is constantly referring to her hand-held.

I guess we see things differently then. I’ve written, maintained, and analyzed computer code for 35 years in seven different languages on Unix and IBM mainframes, PCs, microcomputers, minicomputers, and programmable calculators and always had job offers and I thought that was pretty cool.

But when I saw a midi-compatible keyboard in church, I freaked out. I don’t think I like integrated circuitry there.

 

[Sarabande]

right. somewhere in the Church history, books weren’t common until the modern printing press came about. i wonder if it was a big issue then. perhaps there were a few who were saying those who use a book is less reverent because the words are not etched in their minds while i don’t have proof, i will not be surprised at all if that were true

Funny thing is that when I was in grade school in the late 80s/early 90s, there was a period where the teachers berated us if we picked up a missalette so that we could read along with the readings. It was considered irreverent and wrong to read because it took our focus off the mass. So, we had to listen. I personally like to read along, as I absorb it more, but they thought differently. After a couple of years, though, they didn’t continue to promote it. I think they realized that it wasn’t working. I thought maybe my school/parish was the exception, but I’ve discovered that there were many people from my generation who had to do the same.

I personally don’t think projector screens are needed. In the very few older churches I’ve seen them in, it just looks incongruent, cheap, and tacky compared to the rest of the building. That said in the newer, more modern buildings, they don’t stick out like a sore thumb.

 

[lizaanne]

I guess we see things differently then. I’ve written, maintained, and analyzed computer code for 35 years in seven different languages on Unix and IBM mainframes, PCs, microcomputers, minicomputers, and programmable calculators and always had job offers and I thought that was pretty cool.

But when I saw a midi-compatible keyboard in church, I freaked out. I don’t think I like integrated circuitry there.

Exactly!! I am an IT Project Manager - I deal with the IT world every single day, and (far often than I’d like) on the weekend. I often have two phones and two laptops going at the same time. I think technology is amazing, and was just fascinated by a presentation a colleague recently made on cloud computing. I am a bit of a geek, married to the Senior Platform Architect for RealCatholicTV.com - another geek. So I am absolutely NOT technology averse.

However ---- when it comes to Mass. I don’t want that level of technology anywhere near me.

There is a time and a place for everything. And Mass is not the place for big fancy glowing screens.

~Liza

 

[boatbearer]

I’m guessing that when paper copies first were used in the Mass, that there were people who said, “This is a horrific idea.”

And I’m guessing that the first time the Papal Masses in Rome were filmed and broadcasted on television around the world, that there were people who said, “This is a horrific idea.”

Bet the ranch on both…

Why on earth would being able to see and read the notes to the chants be any more “horrific” on an overhead than on sheets of paper? Why is looking UP at the words on a screen any more “horrific” than looking at the words on a sheet of paper? That makes no sense to me. I don’t see a demon in this at all. I’m utterly amazed at the vehemence in this thread when it comes to the simple transmission of information.

My only guess is that some early attempts at “audio-visual” support were technically incompetent and poorly implemented.

What about PDAs? Is it OK for us to look up the chants and other texts on the computer on the iPhone or other PDA and read them during Mass? Or is that also forbidden for some unfathomable reason?

Ha! When I serve Mass and follow the readings in my missalette I get nods of approval from the up-tights. When I follow the readings on my PDA while serving I get purple faces from the same. They need to get (spiritual) lives.

In our parish, during the weekday school Masses, the Psalm responses are printed on large sheets of paper and hung up on the wall. Is that wrong? If it’s OK, why is it any different than using a projector or computer and screen? After all, the copies were printed by a computer printer, a bit of modern technology. And computers are definitely used for entertainment–in fact, our television is done through TiVo…

I have the feeling that the reason the Church has not rescinded this ancient dictum is that they have other things on their agenda that are much more important and they figure that the bishops can handle this one without bringing the Church down and destroying the witness of the Lord Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament.

I doubt the Church even recognizes that using electronics is a problem anymore…

 

[ProVobis]

There is a time and a place for everything. And Mass is not the place for big fancy glowing screens.

It seems that we should be the ones worshipping God, not build machines that do that for us. Machines don’t have hearts.

 

[choy]

It seems that we should be the ones worshipping God, not build machines that do that for us. Machines don’t have hearts.

do the Missals and Hymnals do the worshiping for us?

 

[boatbearer]

I am in the process of planning a Mass for about 1,100 people.

The printing of the “worship aid” alone will be over $800.00 Afterward the church will be littered with a mountain of the little booklets that will then hit the recycling center. Hardly “green.”

I wish my church had a top-quality AV system. It would make a great deal of sense in so many ways.

 

[choy]

I am in the process of planning a Mass for about 1,100 people.

The printing of the “worship aid” alone will be over $800.00 Afterward the church will be littered with a mountain of the little booklets that will then hit the recycling center. Hardly “green.”

I wish my church had a top-quality AV system. It would make a great deal of sense in so many ways.

how about a pew-by-pew mini-LCD screens like on most airlines nowadays?

 

[KevinAK]

The National Shrine of the Little Flower in Michigan has two MASSIVE screens that come down out of the ceiling - you can see them in the background of some of the photos here:

Call to Holiness Conference 2009

Sure - it’s practical, but I think it is entirely unnecessary and a bit tacky - especially for one of the most beautiful art deco Churches I’ve ever seen.

Scroll down on the page to see a link to a wonderful slide show of this conference with more photos of this truly beautiful Church. This is where we were married, but we no longer belong to this parish.

~Liza

The screens are not used during the Mass. I don’t see anything wrong with using them for conferences or relayng other info.