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Guild_Master
Guest
Why does The Church permit different ways of receiving the Eucharist? Why do I get to choose between my hand, my mouth, standing or kneeling? Is there a correct way and if there is why is it not enforced?
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Deacon_Ed
Guest
Guild Master:
Receiving communion is not a “me-n-Jesus” event, it’s a “we-n-Jesus” so the bishops have asked for uniformity in posture, but some people feel they need to kneel to receive communion, and Rome has said that is permitted.
The Church is not here to “enforce” anything. She does regulate the liturgy to the extent of providing rubrics that tell the clergy what they are supposed to do. It is up to each of us to regulate outselves in comformance with the stated desires of the Church. After all, we’re supposed to be adults.
Deacon Ed
The Church permits communion on the hand (an indult, or exception to the law) and communion on the tongue (the normative method) because the bishops asked for it. Standing to receive communion is the tradition in the Eastern Catholic Churches and the bishops of the United States made it the normative position here. Kneeling, however, because of long standing custom, is still permitted.
Receiving communion is not a “me-n-Jesus” event, it’s a “we-n-Jesus” so the bishops have asked for uniformity in posture, but some people feel they need to kneel to receive communion, and Rome has said that is permitted.
The Church is not here to “enforce” anything. She does regulate the liturgy to the extent of providing rubrics that tell the clergy what they are supposed to do. It is up to each of us to regulate outselves in comformance with the stated desires of the Church. After all, we’re supposed to be adults.
Deacon Ed
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Guild_Master
Guest
Thank you, Deacon, for your swift reply.
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Ace86
Guest
Deacon Ed:
Why did it become normative? What made the bishops decide to do that?
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palmas85
Guest
Thats a great question and another one that I have yet to hear adequitely answered except of the fact that people say they want it that way. There are those who will always drag up the primitive church argument, but that one is really weak.
My own personal take is that with the increase in lay participation, the role of the Priest was downplayed to a great degree and since everyone was now theoretically equal in the Church, reception in the hand, would kind of re-enforce that belief.The Priest communes himself,and so should everyone else. Receiving on the tongue also probably made some people feel somewhat inferior. you know being fed by another person and all that.
I would have to imagine that those who dreamed up this idea actually looked forward to the day when there is no established ordained priesthood at all. Anyone and everyone could preside at Mass, and all could share in this calling. That actually is not a far fetched idea if you look at the ways things and ideas are now.
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Walking_Home
Guest
There seems to be some in the Church who may have taken the belief of the “royal priesthood” to mean equality with the ordained priesthood.
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G_S
Guest
Just yesterday I served a wedding Mass as deacon. The bride is a Magdalen College graduation. The piety of some of the communicants was so overwhelming. As I sat after purifying the vessels, the tears welled up in my eyes. I have witnessed this piety at Franciscan U of Steubenville as well. Not just the mind but the body must bear witness to the Reality of the Eucharist.
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MusicMan
Guest
I received on the tongue this morning for the first time in a very long time. It was fascinatingly reverent. I’m not sure why. The entire Mass I attended had that air of reverent mystery to it that actually makes the Mass.
Plus, the altar servers were armed with patens. I may have also figured that if the priest was going to be polite enough to have patens, I could be polite enough to receive on the tongue. Not sure WHY I felt that way, seeing as receiving in the hand is perfectly acceptable, but I did.
Plus, the altar servers were armed with patens. I may have also figured that if the priest was going to be polite enough to have patens, I could be polite enough to receive on the tongue. Not sure WHY I felt that way, seeing as receiving in the hand is perfectly acceptable, but I did.
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Deacon_Ed
Guest
This is a complicated question and really requires going through the detailed reports taken at Vatican II. However, a short version is something like this (leaving out days and weeks of debate).
There was a desire on the part of about 2/3 of the bishops at Vatican II to restore those practices which, it seemed, led to greater participation on the part of the faithful. There is nothing in Sacrosanctum Concilium that mandatess standing for the reception of communion. In the various debates and discussions that took place the Eastern Catholic Churches, especially the Melkite patriarch, reminded the West that standing to receive communion was the immemorial custom in both the East and the West. In fact, kneeling to receive communion in the West did not start until the 5th century, and was not common practice until the 8th or 9th century.
Thus, when Pope Paul guided the consilium in the revision of the Mass he asked that this posture be considered. It was not in the first two drafts of the revised missal, but was included from the third draft on.
I doubt that this was something the bishops felt the people wanted but, rather, was something that they felt would benefit the people – and they could see that it did not harm the sanctity of the Eucharist in the East.
Deacon Ed
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MrS
Guest
Deacon Ed:
Personally, receiving communion is a Jesus-in-me “event”
so much for a personal relationship with Jesus… or the need for individual confession to be in the individual proper state of grace to receive. :whacky:The Church permits communion on the hand (an indult, or exception to the law) and communion on the tongue (the normative method) because the bishops asked for it. Standing to receive communion is the tradition in the Eastern Catholic Churches and the bishops of the United States made it the normative position here. Kneeling, however, because of long standing ( long kneeling ??)custom, is still permitted.
Receiving communion is not a “me-n-Jesus” event, it’s a “we-n-Jesus” so the bishops have asked for uniformity in posture, but some people feel they need to kneel to receive communion, and Rome has said that is permitted.
The Church is not here to “enforce” anything. She does regulate the liturgy to the extent of providing rubrics that tell the clergy what they are supposed to do. It is up to each of us to regulate outselves in comformance with the stated desires of the Church. After all, we’re supposed to be adults.
Deacon Ed
Personally, receiving communion is a Jesus-in-me “event”
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5-Decades-a-Day
Guest
Deacon Ed:
I think there’s a pun in there, or something…
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Deacon_Ed
Guest
While I fully agree with your last statement, the Church teaches that we are members of a “corporate body” – the Body of Christ. When we come to communion it is literally the Body of Christ (the communicant) receiving the Body of Christ (the Eucharist) from the Body of Christ (the minister)! Because it is the Body of Christ who receives it is not “me-n-Jesus” but “we-n-Jesus.” But that does not obviate the need to be in the proper state of grace to receive communion.
Deacon Ed
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AltarMan
Guest
Deacon Ed:
You’re wrong. While the Church has said that no one is to be denied Holy Communion because they are kneeling (as this is certainly not the time to address such an issue), pastors are directed to counsel said people away from the Mass so that they too may follow the direction set by the Church and receive while standing.
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AltarMan
Guest
You would also have to ask that question of the Holy See as it approved the US Bishops’ request.
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Deacon_Ed
Guest
Yes, and Rome has also replied to the dubium regarding this by saying that the directive to stand does not preclude kneeling. Should an individual persist in kneeling he or she may continue to receive communion. Thus, my statement is correct. Apology accepted.
Deacon Ed
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LighthouseRon
Guest
Deacon Ed:
Thank you.
Very well said.
Thank you.
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MrS
Guest
Deacon Ed:
Perhaps the replacement of “we” for “me” is the same mistake made in the Creed. Credo can never mean “we” believe. Yet the liturgists have changed it. It will forever mean “I” and is so critical to our theology.
Thankfully indications are that we (no pun) will return to the I this very year.
And at the next Mass “I” am privileged to attend, “I” will again receive,… all the time knowing that what is really required is less of me and more of Him
I think one of us might be missing the point… my objection was to the “restriction” I perceived in the “we-in-Jesus” I do not require the presence or even the existence of any other human being to be able to receive the Lord.
Perhaps the replacement of “we” for “me” is the same mistake made in the Creed. Credo can never mean “we” believe. Yet the liturgists have changed it. It will forever mean “I” and is so critical to our theology.
Thankfully indications are that we (no pun) will return to the I this very year.
And at the next Mass “I” am privileged to attend, “I” will again receive,
… all the time knowing that what is really required is less of me and more of Him
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AltarMan
Guest
Deacon Ed:
It’s not allowed. It’s tolerated (along with counseling) given the delicate nature of the setting. Those that continue to kneel are objectively ignoring the counseling and that’s bad form.
(BTW, no apology was ever offered.)
Naw. It’s still wrong to kneel. To suggest that it’s OK to kneel because the Holy See dosen’t want to cause potential problems during the distribution of Holy Communion is wrong.
It’s not allowed. It’s tolerated (along with counseling) given the delicate nature of the setting. Those that continue to kneel are objectively ignoring the counseling and that’s bad form.
(BTW, no apology was ever offered.)
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AMDG1
Guest
Guild Master:
The Church is just trying to confuse newcomers. Anyone who can figure it out must be A-OK and can keep coming to Mass…
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viktor_aleksndr
Guest
We Catholics must be reminded that recieving in tongue and kneeling is the norm and recieving in hands is just an option…
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