Propitiation and the Mass

[porthos11]

And how did the early fathers interpret this verse?

Is Jesus that pure offering they are talking about?

Continuously offering Himself up?

My Scriptures don’t say that.

The Holy Spirit has told us:
Hbr 7:27 “He did once for all when He offered up Himself.”

Hbr 9:14 “how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?”

Hbr 9:28 "Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many"There was only one offering and it was offered.

There was only one offering and only Christ Himself offered it.

There was only one offering after which Christ sat down on High.
Hbr 10:12 "But this Man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God"Let’s now recall the Creed.

The Creed says Christ is seated at the right hand of the Father. If any theology has Christ perpetually offering Himself, then He has yet to sit down as the Creed says.

That Christ offered Himself ONCE is spoken of in past tense by the Holy Spirit.

Secondly, ONCE was only as long as to give the Holy Spirit the ability in Hebrews to say: “after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God”

By definition, that “ONCE” ended right before the “AFTER.”

Christ’s offering was completed by the time Hebrews was written.

All you write here is true. The sacrifice was completed on Calvary, once for all. Catholics do not dispute this. There can never be another sacrifice. Hebrews 9:25ff:

“Not that he might offer himself repeatedly … But now once for all he has appeared at the end of the ages to take away sin by his sacrifice. … Christ, offered once to take away the sins of many”

But you cannot ignore that “Christ remains a priest forever.” Look at Hebrews 7:24: “He holds his priesthood permanently because he continues forever.” We also read “Jesus Christ is the same, yesterday, today and forever” (13:8). If he was a priest and victim then, he can and does remain priest and victim now (“victim” should be understood in the sacrificial, not everyday sense).

A priest’s defining function is to offer sacrifice. Hebrews 8:3 says “For every high priest is appointed to offer gifts and sacrifices; hence it is necessary for this priest also to have something to offer.”

By this definition Christ cannot be an eternal priest if he had ceased to offer something. By the time he completed the offering, he should have retired as priest (that is, he should have been a priest only in time, not forever). An eternal priest requires an eternal sacrifice.

When we say that his offering WAS completed, we are clearly referring to the once-for-all sacrifice of Calvary in space and time. This is true, Catholics agree wholeheartedly. And the sacrifice must be COMPLETE and FINISHED.

But when Christ ascended, he brought his offering beyond space and time. That’s why we read in Revelation of the Lamb standing as if slain. Even glorified and alive, he remains a sacrifice, bringing fullness to the meaning of “once for all”. In other words, his death is always present in heaven, even though his is resurrected and alive.

 

[NotWorthy]

A priest’s defining function is to offer sacrifice. Hebrews 8:3 says “For every high priest is appointed to offer gifts and sacrifices; hence it is necessary for this priest also to have something to offer.”

By this definition Christ cannot be an eternal priest if he had ceased to offer something. By the time he completed the offering, he should have retired as priest (that is, he should have been a priest only in time, not forever). An eternal priest requires an eternal sacrifice.

When we say that his offering WAS completed, we are clearly referring to the once-for-all sacrifice of Calvary in space and time. This is true, Catholics agree wholeheartedly. And the sacrifice must be COMPLETE and FINISHED.

But when Christ ascended, he brought his offering beyond space and time. That’s why we read in Revelation of the Lamb standing as if slain. Even glorified and alive, he remains a sacrifice, bringing fullness to the meaning of “once for all”. In other words, his death is always present in heaven, even though his is resurrected and alive.

Yeah, Yeah, that’s what I was trying to say.

But not nearly as well as you did, Porthos.

Bless you!