Prostration

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My local UGCC has pews and kneelers, so I haven’t experienced anyone prostrating yet (some stand, some kneel). Please, tell about prostration in your church.
 
I_Thirst said:
My local UGCC has pews and kneelers, so I haven’t experienced anyone prostrating yet (some stand, some kneel). Please, tell about prostration in your church.
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We would go into the aisles and do prostrations there. There aren’t as many people for Pre-sanctified Liturgy anyway.
 
I do not know how EC’s do it, but most Orthodox prostrate very differently than latin catholics. Down on your knees, touching forehead to floor and palms flat on the floor witth arms extended in front of you. During lent we prostrate when entering the Temple twice, then kiss the icon on the analogian, and then prostrate one more making the sign if the cross before each prostration. Since kneeling/prstrations are forbiden on Sundays we do not do it then. We actually do prostrate at the Great Entrance at the Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts since the body and blood of Christ are carried out of the sanctuary into the nave in
the presence osf the faithful. There are also prayers that require prostrations, and some Spiritual Fathers may assign them as penance.
 
OrthodoxJosh, I attended a DL at an Orthodox Church (OCA) yesterday (on a Thursday) and there were prostrations by everyone. Is this common during the week or during times like the Nativity Fast? I’ve never been on a Sunday.
 
My mother did this once but it was due to a wet floor and slippery tile at the entrance to the Church. :o
 
I_Thirst said:
OrthodoxJosh, I attended a DL at an Orthodox Church (OCA) yesterday (on a Thursday) and there were prostrations by everyone. Is this common during the week or during times like the Nativity Fast? I’ve never been on a Sunday.
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Yes, prostrations are permissable during weekly Divine services unless you are in the Paschal season.
 
I’ve still not been able to figure out when to prostrate during a weekday liturgy.
 
Orthodox Josh, at our Russian Greek-Catholic parish people generally make prostrations as you describe, except that on entering the temple it is usually just metanias before venerating the icon on the tetrapod, even on weekdays. But during the Presanctified Liturgy it is exactly as you describe: during the Great Entrance with the consecrated Gifts, during the verses of “Let My Prayer Arise”, during the prayer of St. Ephrem, etc…

The church has no pews, just some movable chairs - so there is plenty of space for prostrations.
 
ConstantineTG said:
We would go into the aisles and do prostrations there. There aren’t as many people for Pre-sanctified Liturgy anyway.
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I haven’t been to a Pre-sanctified Liturgy yet.

Symeon mentioned metanias – is that done at your church? It’s Byzantine, right? UGCC or ???
 
I_Thirst said:
I haven’t been to a Pre-sanctified Liturgy yet.

Symeon mentioned metanias – is that done at your church? It’s Byzantine, right? UGCC or ???
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UGCC

There’s no specific prescribed time that we would do metanias. I would when I enter, leave, reverence icons, at the “Amen” at the words of institution. Sometimes its only me doing all that. But since we’re pretty Latinized, many are kneeling anyway during Consecration.
 
ConstantineTG said:
UGCC

There’s no specific prescribed time that we would do metanias. I would when I enter, leave, reverence icons, at the “Amen” at the words of institution. Sometimes its only me doing all that. But since we’re pretty Latinized, many are kneeling anyway during Consecration.
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Ok. Sounds like it is similar to here.
 
I_Thirst said:
OrthodoxJosh, I attended a DL at an Orthodox Church (OCA) yesterday (on a Thursday) and there were prostrations by everyone. Is this common during the week or during times like the Nativity Fast? I’ve never been on a Sunday.
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At the vespers Monday before the beginning of the Fast on Tuesday we prayed the Prayer of St Ephraim with the three full prostrations. There was a little toddler there who did excellent prostrations. 😃 This was in the Russian Orthodox parish. We didn’t have these vespers in my small Russian Greek Catholic parish. There were only 4 lay people at the Orthodox service, tho seemed like full choir, with clergy. Wonderful beginning to the Fast. 🙂
OrthodoxJosh said:
I do not know how EC’s do it, but most Orthodox prostrate very differently than latin catholics. Down on your knees, touching forehead to floor and palms flat on the floor witth arms extended in front of you. During lent we prostrate when entering the Temple twice, then kiss the icon on the analogian, and then prostrate one more making the sign if the cross before each prostration. Since kneeling/prstrations are forbiden on Sundays we do not do it then. We actually do prostrate at the Great Entrance at the Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts since the body and blood of Christ are carried out of the sanctuary into the nave in
the presence osf the faithful. There are also prayers that require prostrations, and some Spiritual Fathers may assign them as penance.
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This would be the same in my parish. I’ll add that the Forehead to the floor is usually a brief movement, down and back up. At the OCF in Berkeley which is basically a Greek service it seems, they remain with forehead on the floor during the Anamnesis. That DL is on a weeknight.
 
Alveus_Lacuna said:
I’ve still not been able to figure out when to prostrate during a weekday liturgy.
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Certainly in place of the Metania used on Sunday, during the anaphora. But not between Pascha and Pentacost. At the Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts, you can metania at “Lord have mercy on me a sinner.”, after the hymn of the evening sacrifice, some say the prayer of St. Ephram, so it can be done there three times. That is just after “the light of Christ enlightens everyone”. It varies with the tradition, but basically at the most penitential moments, asking for the mercy (indwelling) with humility.
 
Hesychios said:
A good reason to have wide aisles and backless benches instead of pews.
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We’re not going to get rid of the pews in the foreseeable future. De-Latinization is a slow process. We can’t just yank the literal and proverbial pews from underneath the people.
 
Alveus_Lacuna said:
Could you be really specific and quote lines from the liturgy when it is the appropriate times?
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  1. If the Prayer of St. Ephrem is done before, there can be prostrations.
  2. Some churches use a full prostration immediately after the second Prokeimenon when the priest comes out with a lighted candle and says “The light of Christ enlightenes everyone!”
  3. One version of the Presanctified (Passaic), the three prostrations are made by all just after the final “And the lifting up of my hands as an evening sacrifice.” But in revised edition, the three prostrations are made, one after each verse, of the Prayer of St. Ephrem (see the link for an example from another church).
Then we make three prostrations [saying customarily the Prayer of St Ephrem:

Lord and Master of my life, do not give me a spirit of sloth, idle curiosity, love of power, and useless chatter.
(Prostration)
Rather accord to me, your servant, a spirit of sobriety, humility, patience and love.
(Prostration)
Yes, Lord and King, grant me to see my own faults and not to condemn my brother; for you are blessed to the ages of ages.
(Prostration)]

mynachdy-sant-elias.org.uk/Presanctified_Complete.pdf
  1. Another time is at the Great Entrance after placing the Holy Gifts on the Table, during the incensation of the Holy Gifts. All make three prostrations in silence.
 
Also in the Divine Liturgy, there are three profound bows in the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom & Divine Liturgy of St. Basil (2006 Byzantine) at:
  1. CELEBRANT: Take, eat; this is my body which is broken for you for the remission of sins.
    *The celebrant, concelebrants, and deacon together make a profound bow. **
    RESPONSE: Amen.
  2. CELEBRANT: Drink of this all of you; this is my blood of the new covenant which is shed for you and for many for the remission of sins.
    *The celebrant, concelebrants, and deacon together make a profound bow. **
    RESPONSE: Amen.
  3. CELEBRANT: That for those who partake of them they may bring about a spirit of vigilance, the remission of sins, the communion of your Holy Spirit, the fullness of the heavenly kingdom, and confidence in you, not judgment or condemnation.
    *The celebrant, concelebrants, and deacon together make a profound bow. **
** The pew book states: “All make a profound bow” for 1 and 2, and for 3,“The clergy and the faithful make a profound bow.”*

So these are touching the floor with the hand on Sundays and non fasting Feast days, and can be head to floor on Monday through Saturday, particularly fast days, but not between Pascha and Pentecost.
 
Yes, I was wondering more about weekday divine liturgies rather than Lenten services. My parish just started doing weekday services and I wasn’t sure. Thanks.
 
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