Protestant concept of the impossibility of God.

[Mannyfit75]

Are you saying that whoever disagrees with your doctrinal opinion is saying that god is impossible?

They aren’t my doctrinal beliefs. They are Christ’s Church doctrinal beliefs which has been revealed to us. I didn’t invent them. I think that since most Protestants **reject these essential Christian beliefs **because they are not explicit in Scripture, they reject them. Even though, Church document cited God’s role in these beliefs.

 

[AgnosTheist]

They aren’t my doctrinal beliefs. They are Christ’s Church doctrinal beliefs which has been revealed to us.

thats what i meant. so those who reject them automatically makes god impossible?

Even though, Church document cited God’s role in these beliefs.

They dont buy that assertion.

For protestants its not a matter of what God can do, what what God did do.

 

[SyCarl]

Flawed? I don’t think so. My concerns still reflect the denial of essential Christian beliefs.

Then why do some of your brothers and sisters deny the Perpetual Virginity of Mary? While it is believed by the Early Christians that Mary remain a virgin. They also believe she was also sinless.

or the Sacrifice of Divine Liturgy. That the Jesus Christ’s Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity is not present in the Eucharist, and claim it is only Symbolic. A Concept not believed by the Early Christians?

Of course, if you read the original OP, it said “its not directly targeted to all Protestants, since some of them held somewhat Catholic belief.” Go and take look at the Op. I also like to add how much different in theology Protestantism is compared to Christianity of the First Century.

While I do think Protestant that God can do miracle, the lack of unbelieving essential beliefs that Catholic Church believe to be necessary such as Immaculate Conception, Assumption, Real Presence, Confession, Papal Infallibility, etc. It is the Catholic doctrine and beliefs that I find completely troubling for Protestants to accept. When Protestants deny these to be True, they in turn deny God’s role in these beliefs. Thus, denial of these beliefs would implied that God cannot make these possible. So it does go back to the Op that Protestant theology of Sola Scriptura makes God impossible to do these things.

Let me turn it around. You, and the Catholic Church, deny the truth of Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide. Does that mean that you feel it is impossible that God could have chosen Scripture Alone and Faith Alone? Failing to believe something is not the same as saying it could not be done. Could the Immaculate Conception have occured. Most certainly it could have. Did it? I don’t know, it is possible that it did take place but I am not convinced that it did, not that it couldn’t happen.

You have made the statement that some Protestants are saying that that some things are impossible with God. I ask you to provide even one link confirming any such belief by any Protestant. And I mean a real Protestant, not just a non-Catholic. ie groups like Jehovah Witnesses are not Protestant although I doubt that they question the omnipotence of God.

 

[AgnosTheist]

They aren’t my doctrinal beliefs. They are Christ’s Church doctrinal beliefs which has been revealed to us.

thats what i meant. so those who reject them, they automatically make god impossible?

Even though, Church document cited God’s role in these beliefs.

Protestant rejection of Roman religious concepts is not a matter of what God can do, but what God did do. take the perpetual virginity of mary for example, protestants are smart enough to know that if god wills it -she could be a perpetual virgin, but they see the bible as saying that mary had other children after jesus. so its not fair to judge them as rejecting god’s omnipotence for this reason.

 

[AgnosTheist]

Let me turn it around. You, and the Catholic Church, deny the truth of Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide. Does that mean that you feel it is impossible that God could have chosen Scripture Alone and Faith Alone?

NICE ONE!!!

 

[SyCarl]

Manny let me pose another question to you.

Do you or the Catholic Church deny that not all people will be saved? If so does this mean you think it is impossible for God to save all people or just that He didn’t choose to?

 

[AgnosTheist]

Catholics deny that God is capable of making everybody born Immaculate like Mary.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Let me turn it around. You, and the Catholic Church, deny the truth of Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide. Does that mean that you feel it is impossible that God could have chosen Scripture Alone and Faith Alone?

The doctrine of Sola Scriptura and Faith Alone was developed by Martin Luther in 1517-30. These doctrines are unheard of and are completely foreign and alien to the orthodoxy of Christianity. Even the Eastern Orthodox reject these two pillars of Protestantism.,

The Catholic Church believes that the Word of God is Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition, and the Magisterium itself has the Sole authority to interpret them correctly. Otherwise, if you read Scripture you can interpret in many ways, and even distort the context of the Gospel.

Sola Scriptura and Faith Alone is not from God. It’s from a man, Martin Luther and other Protestant Reformers. Paul made this clear when he said, “Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Therefore, do not teach any strange doctrine.”

We see so many essential beliefs within Protestantism itself. Some believe the necessary of infant baptism, or that baptism saves. It seem to me that the Holy Spirit is giving different message to one Protestant Minister to the Next. So which one of the minister is telling the truth? The Holy Spirit is not the Holy Spirit of confusion.

Failing to believe something is not the same as saying it could not be done. Could the Immaculate Conception have occured. Most certainly it could have. Did it? I don’t know, it is possible that it did take place but I am not convinced that it did, not that it couldn’t happen.

Immaculate Conception is professed by the Church basing itself on Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture. Like the Trinity, this was defined to get a better understand of the nature of Jesus.

You have made the statement that some Protestants are saying that that some things are impossible with God. I ask you to provide even one link confirming any such belief by any Protestant. And I mean a real Protestant, not just a non-Catholic. ie groups like Jehovah Witnesses are not Protestant although I doubt that they question the omnipotence of God.

Let us take the issue and belief that Jesus Christ is truly present in the Blessed Sacrament. His Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity is present. You know of course Catholics and Orthodox and some Protestants affirm this belief. Yet, there are those Protestants who believe that the Holy Eucharist is only symbolic.

The Church declare that during the Consecration the Body and Blood becomes Jesus. The Eastern Christians haven’t defined their when this actually take place but affirms the Real Presence of Jesus Christ.

Those Protestants who say that the Eucharist is not Jesus and it is symbolic have gone at length by declaring Catholics as idolators for worshipping the “Bread of Life.” Why do they deny the Real Presence, when Scripture itself makes it clear that Jesus’ flesh is real food and his Blood is real drink? Can’t God make bread as his body and the wine as his blood? I believe God who created all things can make this possible because with God all things are possible.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Manny let me pose another question to you.

Do you or the Catholic Church deny that not all people will be saved?

People who die as unrepentent sinners will not be saved. This is what the Church teaches and this is what Jesus taught and I firmly believe this as well. Do you?

If so does this mean you think it is impossible for God to save all people or just that He didn’t choose to?

God who knows the hearts of men can judge rightly who is worthy to inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. If he is righteous and true to God’s precepts (that is being obedient to all of God’s commandments) he can be saved. Those who are lukewarm and unrepentent cannot be saved even if he wants them too, because God made it clear in Scripture that he hate sin. St. Paul made it clear that neither adulterers, homosexuals, fornicators, murderers, perverts, and other immoral individuals cannot inherit the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Catholics deny that God is capable of making everybody born Immaculate like Mary.

God has not revealed that to us. If he could, he would make us Immaculate if he so desire. However, he granted us the gift of free will. The right to decide right from wrong. This gift must be taken with care. We abuse it, we loose our soul to the eternal fires of hell. We decide to do what is right in the eyes of God by not sinning, we can be save.

 

[Mannyfit75]

thats what i meant. so those who reject them, they automatically make god impossible?

Correct because they don’t believe **God is capable **of preserving Mary from sin.

Protestant rejection of Roman religious concepts is not a matter of what God can do, but what God did do. take the perpetual virginity of mary for example, protestants are smart enough to know that if god wills it -she could be a perpetual virgin, but they see the bible as saying that mary had other children after jesus. so its not fair to judge them as rejecting god’s omnipotence for this reason.

If Protestant believed that Jesus Christ established One Church upon Peter, they would be Catholic. Unfortunately, they don’t. But their own free will, they reject the revealed truth concerning the Papacy.

 

[bengal_fan]

manny, i don’t understand how you cannot see that you are losing this argument… pretty hardcore too. you still have not shown where protestants say God is incapable of doing something. you have said that protestants don’t believe that God has done certain things but not where they say God is not capable of doing it.

in fact, you have actually said that God is incapable of doing something.

i quote:

If he could, he would make us Immaculate if he so desire.

so you are saying that God can’t do this? you must believe that not all things are possible with God. hmmm, sounds like you are a protestant. welcome!!

 

[Mannyfit75]

manny, i don’t understand how you cannot see that you are losing this argument… pretty hardcore too.

I’m not losing. This is not the issue of winning and losing. This is the issue of discussion. My intend is not win or lose, my friend.,

you still have not shown where protestants say God is incapable of doing something. you have said that protestants don’t believe that God has done certain things but not where they say God is not capable of doing it.

I have. If you bother reading the other replies I made.

Point # 1: Why do Protestant deny that Mary remain sinless? The Catholic Church affirmed that God’s preserved Mary from all sin both original sin and personal sin. Protestants deny this belief. To them, this is impossible because this isn’t explicit in Scripture.

in fact, you have actually said that God is incapable of doing something.

God can make preserved from all sin.

i quote:

so you are saying that God can’t do this? you must believe that not all things are possible with God. hmmm, sounds like you are a protestant. welcome!!

I’m Catholic. Protestants by nature protestant Catholic Christian belief. That is what they do, they protest. They are rebels against authority. God if he will, God could make us immaculate. Reality shows that this is not the case. He love us and gave us a free will to decide what is right and wrong.

 

[BrianH]

I’m not losing. This is not the issue of winning and losing. This is the issue of discussion. My intend is not win or lose, my friend.,

Manny, respectfully, you are not losing you are getting creamed. You have offered NO support that Protestants think it is impossible. You have offered unsupported by quotes opinions. You are not a mind reader. You are assuming something about what people are thinking.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Manny, respectfully, you are not losing you are getting creamed. You have offered NO support that Protestants think it is impossible. You have offered unsupported by quotes opinions. You are not a mind reader. You are assuming something about what people are thinking.

I am using my opinions without any citation other than my own. Why do Protestants deny Mary is sinless?

and No I am not getting creamed. I think Protestants here are the one being creamed.

 

[HannahLisa]

I am using my opinions without any citation other than my own. Why do Protestants deny Mary is sinless?

and No I am not getting creamed. I think Protestants here are the one being creamed.

Why couldn’t God have had Jesus be born to a sinful woman? God can do anything, right? So why couldn’t he have done it that way?

The question goes both ways. I believe God can do anything. I think most Christians believe that God can do anything. The question is, did he?

Just because certain people believe that God did different things does NOT mean that they believe there are things God cannot do. Though I would also argue that every Christian denomination has a list of things God cannot do because He is a good and righteous God.

 

[Mannyfit75]

Why couldn’t God have had Jesus be born to a sinful woman? God can do anything, right? So why couldn’t he have done it that way?

Because God hate sin. The Ark is the dwelling place of God and it is know that if everyone touches it, dies. Moses was told to take off his scandals for the ground he was standing is holy. God wants us to be Holy.

Since Jesus was to become flesh. God, the Father will that Mary be preserved from Sin. Because Jesus’ flesh is from Mary. Jesus’ flesh is from Mary.

The question goes both ways. I believe God can do anything. I think most Christians believe that God can do anything. The question is, did he?

Our Tradition hold that Mary remain sinless. Protestantism which came out of Martin Luther, deny that belief. Protestantism isn’t founded by God but by man.

Just because certain people believe that God did different things does NOT mean that they believe there are things God cannot do. Though I would also argue that every Christian denomination has a list of things God cannot do because He is a good and righteous God.

God is the not the God of confusion. We see a lot of that based on Sola Scriptura.

 

[HannahLisa]

Because God hate sin. The Ark is the dwelling place of God and it is know that if everyone touches it, dies. Moses was told to take off his scandals for the ground he was standing is holy. God wants us to be Holy.

Since Jesus was to become flesh. God, the Father will that Mary be preserved from Sin. Because Jesus’ flesh is from Mary. Jesus’ flesh is from Mary.

Our Tradition hold that Mary remain sinless. Protestantism which came out of Martin Luther, deny that belief. Protestantism isn’t founded by God but by man.

God is the not the God of confusion. We see a lot of that based on Sola Scriptura.

That was a rhetorical question in this context. I’m aware of the arguments for why Mary had to be sinless. That is not the issue here.

I understood your original argument to be that because Protestants do not believe in various Catholic doctrines, they are limiting God. I am trying to point out that one could say the exact same thing about Catholic doctrines. The fact that you say God hates sin, therefore Mary had to be sinless, shows the Catholic idea of God which DOES limit God. Protestants have similar frameworks, with different “limits”.

The question is not the actual doctrines. The question is, can God do anything? The answer is yes. But that does not mean He CHOOSES to do anything that he CAN. One could also say he cannot do certain things because to do them would to stop being what he is - a righteous, just, merciful, loving God.

 

[BrianH]

I am using my opinions without any citation other than my own. Why do Protestants deny Mary is sinless?

and No I am not getting creamed. I think Protestants here are the one being creamed.

You are saying that Protestants think God cannot do things, if that were the case, you would have quotes. Giving your opinion about what Protestants think without support is nothing more than a opinion.
And yeah…Manny…you are getting creamed. Do you see all of the Catholics rushing to support you on this? There are lots of reasons you can give why Protestants are wrong on this. But saying they are wrong because they believe God is limited or weak is absurd (and that is being charitable).

 

[Mannyfit75]

You are saying that Protestants think God cannot do things, if that were the case, you would have quotes. Giving your opinion about what Protestants think without support is nothing more than a opinion.
And yeah…Manny…you are getting creamed. Do you see all of the Catholics rushing to support you on this? There are lots of reasons you can give why Protestants are wrong on this. But saying they are wrong because they believe God is limited or weak is absurd (and that is being charitable).

When Protestants deny essential Christian beliefs, this would imply that God can’t preserved Mary from sin.

and no I am not getting cream. Protestants are.