Protestant hatred Mary without realizing it.

[MDK]

I suggest you go back and read Manny’s post. I didn’t call Manny a bigot because he wholeheartedly believes what his church teaches.

Let’s see if you can figure it out. I doubt you can but it’s worth a try.

Ah, arrogance again among those who deny what Christ established… but, this is no surprise, but more of a calling card. The truth escapes the arrogant, but is available to the humble. Ironic that you criticize not figuring something out, when you didn’t identify the essence of my post… your comment is projection, perhaps? In any event, I brought up the root of the issue between you two, and a fundamental problem you’ve exhibited, namely your attempt to slander when you don’t have an answer to basic issues and you’re on shifting sand. People who know me, have a very different view than you. But, then again, they’re honest, intelligent, confident, and secure. No need to go back and read what you wrote, as it’s a waste of time, and will contribute nothing to anyone’s quest for truth. I won’t be discussing with you anymore, unless there’s evidence that you’ve turned into a person who can be behave like a decent individual.

 

[RobHom]

Manny,

At one point you said you were contemplating the the priesthood. I can ony hope that you will become a priest

It is my fervent prayer that many gets the calling and responds to it. I also pray that when he chooses the Order to which he will join that it will be the “Society of Jesus”. I think Manny would make a “most excellent Jesuit”! And I think that because he is honest and forthright, and is not afraid to stand his ground. He uses his intellect well, and he has inner strength, and will serve God and the Church well!!

because if you do I am sure you will indirectly encourage many peope to leave your church with your bigotry.

Actually, I believe you are wrong. I believe that he will bring many to the Church, and he will foster the weak of faith to stronger faith in God and the Church. I’ve been on this forum for some time, and I have never seen him act bigoted.

I can tell you about “religious bigots” and I can show you where they hide…

You will make a great priest.

On that we agree!!

 

[RobHom]

Enraptured by the splendor of your heavenly beauty and impelled by the anxiety of the world, we cast ourselves into your arms O immaculate Mary, mother of Jesus and our mother. God crowned you queen of the universe. O crystal fountain of faith, bathe our minds with eternal truths. O fragrant lily of all holiness, captivate our hearts with your heavenly perfume. O conqueress of evil and death, inspire us in deep horror of sin. O well beloved of God hear the ardent cries which rise from every heart in this year which is dedicated to you. Convert the wicked, dry the tears of the afflicted and the oppressed. Comfort the poor and the humble. Quench hatred. Sweeten harshness. in your name resounding harmoniously in Heaven, may they all recognize that they are all brothers. Happy with you we may repeat before YOUR throne that hymn which is sung today around YOUR altars. You are all beautiful o Mary you are the glory you are the joy, you are the honor of our people. Pope Pius XII

Beautiful Prayer!!! Of course you do realize it was a prayer for “intercession” on our behalf?

 

[SIA]

Beautiful Prayer!!! Of course you do realize it was a prayer for “intercession” on our behalf?

You may claim it if you so wish, not I.

 

[SIA]

Enraptured by the spledor of your heavenly beauty and impelled by the anxiety of the world, we cast ourselves into your arms O immaculate Mary, mother of Jesus and our mother. God crowned you queen of the universe. O crystal fountain of faith, bathe our minds with eternal truths. O fragrant lily of all holiness, captivate our hearts with your heavenly perfume. O conqueress of evil and death, inspire us in deep horror of sin. O well beloved of God hear the ardent cries which rise from every heart in this year which is dedicated to you. Convert the wicked, dry the tears of the afflicted and the oppressed. Comfort the poor and the humble. Quench hatred. Sweeten harshness. in your name resounding harmoniously in Heaven, may they all recognize that they are all brothers. Happy with you we may repeat before YOUR throne that hymn which is sung today around YOUR altars. You are all beautiful o Mary you are the glory you are the joy, you are the honor of our people. Pope Pius XII

You really just refuse to see it don’t you? You couldn’t care less what Pius XII said just as long as he said something.

 

[RobHom]

You may claim it if you so wish, not I.

I do, and I will.

 

[RobHom]

You really just refuse to see it don’t you? You couldn’t care less what Pius XII said just as long as he said something.

Now you’re leaping to conclusions and “assuming” things…

I think you really have a problem. I think, and I say this very seriously and with all possible charity… you have a serious issue in your person/psyche/id. You need to deal with it. As time is passing the vitriol is gaining a hold on you…

Beyond that, I think another problem you have is that you over accentuate things and are not really able to read expansive writing. You are making a mountain out of a grain of sand.

Peace!

 

[SIA]

I do, and I will.

Good for you.:clapping:

 

[RobHom]

Good for you.:clapping:

Thank you!

 

[SIA]

Now you’re leaping to conclusions and “assuming” things…

I think you really have a problem. I think, and I say this very seriously and with all possible charity… you have a serious issue in your person/psyche/id. You need to deal with it. As time is passing the vitriol is gaining a hold on you…

Beyond that, I think another problem you have is that you over accentuate things and are not really able to read expansive writing. You are making a mountain out of a grain of sand.

Peace!

Oh thank you Mr. Psychiatrist!:bowdown: I guess I am the one with the problem here because I am willing to call a spade a spade.

 

[Pwrlftr]

Ah, arrogance again among those who deny what Christ established… but, this is no surprise, but more of a calling card. The truth escapes the arrogant, but is available to the humble. Ironic that you criticize not figuring something out, when you didn’t identify the essence of my post… your comment is projection, perhaps? In any event, I brought up the root of the issue between you two, and a fundamental problem you’ve exhibited, namely your attempt to slander when you don’t have an answer to basic issues and you’re on shifting sand. People who know me, have a very different view than you. But, then again, they’re honest, intelligent, confident, and secure. No need to go back and read what you wrote, as it’s a waste of time, and will contribute nothing to anyone’s quest for truth. I won’t be discussing with you anymore, unless there’s evidence that you’ve turned into a person who can be behave like a decent individual.

I don’t remember ever dialoguing with you but I haven’t posted here in a long time so I’m not sure how much of you post applies to me.

I don’t really have an opinion of you one way or the other but it does appear that I was right about you not seeing his blatant bigotry.

So I do hope he becomes a priest 'cuz I am sure he will turn many reasonable parishioners off with his attitude.

 

[MDK]

Most Protestants who have issues with Marian doctrine of the Church do not realized it that when they preach this, they are doing it out of the hatred of Mary indirectly.

Manny,
God bless you and I hope you do whatever God calls you to do. Your love of our Savior Jesus Christ and all that He established and loves is on the right track. Thank you for standing up for Him, His Church, and His mother. If Jesus honored her, who are we not to follow His example? He gave her to us as our spiritual mother, so now we honor her as such. While we honor Mary for being full of grace that comes from God, and for her “yes” to God at all times, we seek to become closer to her Son who we worship as the Son of God, the second person of the Holy Trinity from whom all salvation comes.

How can we say that we love Christ, and then denigrate his mother? We see this a lot in today’s disrespectful culture, of disrepsecting one’s mother which translates to mean that they are unworthy due to whose genes they received half of, and how they came into the world.

God created Mary and chose Mary for a reason. King David danced and lept in front of the Ark of the Covenant with God’s word inside. John lept at hearing Mary’s voice, the ark of the New Covenant with God’s Word made flesh inside. Jesus did not break any Commandment, and so He honored His mother. On the cross, Jesus gave his mother to the disciple He loved, to all disciples He loves. As a disciple He loves, she is my spiritual mother, and spiritual mother to all who love Christ. King Solomon put his mother at his right hand. Jesus has His mother at His right hand, for whom it was reserved. We revere and worship Christ, and so we honor and respect His mother as well.

God bless all who love and worship Christ as the Son of God, Second Person of the Holy Trinity, our Lord and Savior.

 

[TBolt1000T]

Mm, I don’t know that I’d say Catholic exaggeration; rather, I’d call it Protestant misinformation. See, I was (operative word: WAS) a person I’d consider as hating Mary. I saw Her as no better than a baggie–a non-essential, just a mere means to an end, yadayadayada. She disgusted me, and it makes the pit of my stomach drop that I used to think that.

You see, not just Protestant misinformation, but Protestant exageration is what leads people to think that Catholics worship Mary. I think that a lot of Protestants would agree with your former view, that Mary was just a means to an end, but I don’t think that they would go as far as to be disgusted by her.

 

[RobHom]

Oh thank you Mr. Psychiatrist!:bowdown: I guess I am the one with the problem here because I am willing to call a spade a spade.

Actually SIA, I have more than just a little bit of training in the field of Psychological studies, and practical experience to go with it. I see a highly definitive pattern of accelerating vitriol in your posts that are …well… bluntly put: Obsessive in nature. You just can’t let go of something no matter what is proven to you. And you mistakenly think sharp wit with a sharp tongue is a proper weapon in these forums.

So be it…its your life.

 

[twosweetgirls]

You see, not just Protestant misinformation, but Protestant exageration is what leads people to think that Catholics worship Mary. I think that a lot of Protestants would agree with your former view, that Mary was just a means to an end, but I don’t think that they would go as far as to be disgusted by her.

Yes, I’d agree on that one, too. I think where my disgust came from was my exaggerated ignorance of, how dare they (Catholics) even place a mere sinful human being (Mary) anywhere CLOSE to Jesus??

 

[patrickmwebb]

LOL

I can’t believe the “line of reasoning” I’m reading here…
Ok, first things first:

1: Claiming that Mary did not remain a virgin her entire life is not hatred of Mary. Period. It is examining what the Scriptures indirectly say on this subject.

2: So, a family where there is no mother is not a family? What about those single parents outthere?
And how does THIS show a hatred of Mary? You’re changing the subject, but it’s not going to work.

Your reasoning is downright ridiculous, and the worst part is that after so long in here, I’m no longer surprised…

But, ok, now I’m going to assume your reasoning is correct (though I don’t believe that it is):

If it is as you say, that Mary must be “the mother” in the family of the Father and the Son, then it must ALSO follow that Marry too is preexistant; and thus: Part of the Trinity. Now, I expect you to howl and scream that it’s not the case, and that I’m just an RC-hater, etc. I’ve heard it before. But it is the logical conclusion of your own reasoning.
If Mary is “the mother” in the “divine family”, then she must also be pre-existing like both the Father and the Son. You can’t HAVE your cake, AND eat it.

I hope you won’t mind me butting into your debate. Mary is not Divine, and Catholic teaching never said she was. Mary was given the honer of giving birth to Gods Love, Jesus, into the world, by the power of the Holy Spirit. And she now gives birth to that same Love in the mystical body and brings him to full maturity in us. So that on longer are we seen but Christ. We are being formed in the mystical womb of our mother,to a true image of Gods Love Jesus in the world. There are parts of the body that are very sick, because they want, to hold on to their own individuality and resist continually so that we cannot be one in the Lord. “Unless the seed fall to ground and die to it self,it cannot give life.”

honer your Mother and she will give life to you!

 

[TBolt1000T]

Yes, I’d agree on that one, too. I think where my disgust came from was my exaggerated ignorance of, how dare they (Catholics) even place a mere sinful human being (Mary) anywhere CLOSE to Jesus??

Well, even if you show some Protestants Revelation 12, which seems to clearly indicate that Mary is a queen, and the mother of the church, they still refuse to admit that we may be right. If they do hate Mary, it’s because they’ve been tought to hate the Catholic Church, and Mary is a big part of our faith. When you’ve been tought one thing all your life, it’s hard to accept that what you have been tought may be a lie, and I can say that from experience.

 

[TBolt1000T]

LOL

I can’t believe the “line of reasoning” I’m reading here…
Ok, first things first:

1: Claiming that Mary did not remain a virgin her entire life is not hatred of Mary. Period. It is examining what the Scriptures indirectly say on this subject.

2: So, a family where there is no mother is not a family? What about those single parents outthere?
And how does THIS show a hatred of Mary? You’re changing the subject, but it’s not going to work.

Your reasoning is downright ridiculous, and the worst part is that after so long in here, I’m no longer surprised…

But, ok, now I’m going to assume your reasoning is correct (though I don’t believe that it is):

If it is as you say, that Mary must be “the mother” in the family of the Father and the Son, then it must ALSO follow that Marry too is preexistant; and thus: Part of the Trinity. Now, I expect you to howl and scream that it’s not the case, and that I’m just an RC-hater, etc. I’ve heard it before. But it is the logical conclusion of your own reasoning.
If Mary is “the mother” in the “divine family”, then she must also be pre-existing like both the Father and the Son. You can’t HAVE your cake, AND eat it.

Your reasoning is logically invalid. You’re forgetting one VERY important thing. Mary is Jesus’s earthly mother, not his heavenly mother! It was God’s plan that Mary give birth to him on Earth, so that he could become human. If Jesus wouldn’t have become human, his sacrifice would have meant nothing. In order for us to believe like you claim, we would have to be monophysites, people who believe that Jesus only has a divine nature, and not a human nature. How can you even accuse us of believing that Mary was preexistent, and that she’s part of the Trinity? The Son was preexistent, but Mary was NOT! I have to cry foul here!

 

[patrickmwebb]

Your reasoning is logically invalid. You’re forgetting one VERY important thing. Mary is Jesus’s earthly mother, not his heavenly mother! It was God’s plan that Mary give birth to him on Earth, so that he could become human. If Jesus wouldn’t have become human, his sacrifice would have meant nothing. In order for us to believe like you claim, we would have to be monophysites, people who believe that Jesus only has a divine nature, and not a human nature. How can you even accuse us of believing that Mary was preexistent, and that she’s part of the Trinity? The Son was preexistent, but Mary was NOT! I have to cry foul here!

Did you get my reply confused with Lutherandk’s. My name is patrick m webb?? I spoke about Mary being the mother of the mystical body of Christ.
If you are speaking to me, let me know and I’ll reply to you.
Thank you!!

 

[dougfreed]

I see you folks always refer to this Marian doctrine, where might someone who wants too read it find a copy of this online. I’ve found some but want to make sure it’s what you all are talking about. I believe Mary was The mother of Christ and was a virgin when she conceived Jesus and gave birth.