Protestant marriages, Catholic marriages?

[rinnie]

Saved lady answer me this.

This is the truth, Last Sat.my husband and I worked for the Church. We help the church make 1000. Now we didn’t get out until midnight.

On our way home we stopped and I had 2 drinks and my husband did. We were so sore from standing on concrete all day. Then we went home got in the tub and went to bed. Did we sin?

 

[Saved_Lady]

I can’t find the post relating to my comments below to quote (it was posted here a week or two ago), but I’ve been thinking about that post and wanted to make some remarks. Someone said that Protestants could rationalize and twist the will of God to suit their own desires in the matter of divorce, whereas Catholics can’t because we have the Church to guide us regarding marriage (something like that). I wanted to say that I don’t think Protestants have the corner on rationalizing and twisting God’s will. I also don’t think there is that big of a difference between what Catholics believe and Protestants as some think. I think both of us believe Jesus taught lifetime marriage, the sanctity of the marriage bonds, and whereas we have both the Bible and the Church to guide us, they have the Bible and often their individual congregations.

I think that people who do rationalize, thinking God is telling them what isn’t okay, is okay, have not really learned to listen to God. God speaks to all of us individually through a variety of ways - through prayer, through our conscience when we do something wrong, through anxiety when we are on the wrong path, through peace and blessings when we are on the right path. For example, I have a family member who is doing things I think are patently wrong (she got a divorce and got into an ill-advised other marriage shortly thereafter), but she says “God told me to do this” and is obviously very religious, quoting Bible verses to justify just about anything. However, God is speaking to her by a lot of negative things, difficulties and pain, that are happening to her right now. He is a loving God who allows some things to bring us back to Him.

I have learned that God will not tell us individually to do something that He expressly said the opposite in his Word or in the guidance of the Church. That is how you tell if you’re rationalizing or twisting what you heard. Also my way of being sure I’m hearing Him right is by being in His Presence through the Eucharist at Mass or Adoration. Maybe that is why some Protestants have more difficulty - they do have the Bible and some experience of God’s Presence, but not the Lord’s Real Presence in the Eucharist to guide them.

I do agree with most of what you said, but,who told you that Protestants ( I guess you are including Baptist in that) do not have the Lord’s Real Presence because we don’t have the Eucharist? We have just as much presence of God in our services as you do. Not to sound harsh, but that is what it sounds like to me when you say we don’t have the presence of God.

 

[Saved_Lady]

[SIGN][/SIGN]
Saved Lady;5839966:

My question means, are we not going to not accept anyone that has sin in their life? Because the bible says if we can’t forgive our brother that has sin, Jesus can not forgive us of our sins.
And taking a drink is not the sin, but endulging in drinking, in which a lot of cases that is where it leads, and what some do when they drink is the sin. So, it is best that you not partake in alcoholic beverages to keep temptations down. [SIGN]And if my church is against it, and I am part of that church and I drink it, I think that it ruins my testimony.

]

Okay then what about sin? If I am going to be on the same train of thinking as you what if you sin? See my church forbids sin. But what about the people who do not take a drink and sin anyway?

Forbids sin? So, not one of your church members sin? The bible says “that all haved sinned and come short of the Glory of God.”
Drinking is just one of the controversies, sin is things we think, lust after, and perform.

 

[Saved_Lady]

Saved lady answer me this.

This is the truth, Last Sat.my husband and I worked for the Church. We help the church make 1000. Now we didn’t get out until midnight.

On our way home we stopped and I had 2 drinks and my husband did. We were so sore from standing on concrete all day. Then we went home got in the tub and went to bed. Did we sin?

If you have the conviction that what you are doing is sin, then you better believe that God put that conviction in your heart! And if you don’t, well take your chances. If I am wrong, I have lost nothing by doing what I think is right, but, what if you are wrong, what are the consequences? There are other things to drink besides alcohol.

Galations 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[Saved_Lady]

I know in my church, they frown upon divorce. In fact, when my wife and I approached our Priest to get married, since my wife had been divorced some years before, we had to receive a dispensation from the Bishop before we could get married in the church.

I do personally know of perhaps 5 or 6 former Roman Catholic individuals who joined our parish because they were divorced and couldn’t remarry in the RCC. That may not be the norm, but in this case thats what happened.

So, does that mean that the Priest overrules Gods law?

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

If you have the conviction that what you are doing is sin, then you better believe that God put that conviction in your heart! And if you don’t, [SIGN]well take your chances[/SIGN]. If I am wrong, I have lost nothing by doing what I think is right, but, what if you are wrong, what are the consequences? There are other things to drink besides alcohol.

[SIGN]Galations 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,[/SIGN]
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 [SIGN]Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which [/SIGN]do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

But I didn’t do any of that I just took 2 drinks. Now are you saying by taking those 2 drinks I sinned? And yes there are other things to drink besides alcohol but I enjoyed it. Was I sinning? Now also when Jesus drank wine was it a sin?

 

[BarbGl]

I do agree with most of what you said, but,who told you that Protestants ( I guess you are including Baptist in that) do not have the Lord’s Real Presence because we don’t have the Eucharist? We have just as much presence of God in our services as you do. Not to sound harsh, but that is what it sounds like to me when you say we don’t have the presence of God.

I think you don’t understand what is meant by the Real Presence. Many Protestants don’t understand this, even some who used to be Catholic. It is not saying that the presence of God is not stirring in your church services or that Protestants can’t experience God in their lives. I occasionally listen to a well-known Protestant pastor speak on the Internet, and he is truly a man of God. There are many godly people among our separated breathern. This is not what I meant by “Real Presence.”

What this means is that the Holy Eucharist is the true body and blood, soul, and divinity of our Savior. In Matthew 26:26-29 Christ said, “Take, eat; this is My body…this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.” In John 6:51 Christ says, “I am the living bread, which comes down from heaven.” I Corinthians 13: 24-26, it says He said, “Take, eat, this is My body which is broken for you…This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.” (All quoted from the Protestant Bible, the New King James version - check it out, there is a lot more about it there.)

This was the faith of the Church for a thousand years. No one questioned it until the 9th century. In the 9th century one person questioned that the Eucharist might just be a symbol, but no one believed him. In the 11th century there was a slightly bigger controversy. In fact, a new book is coming out I want to read about this controversy. This also died down, but was taken up again in the Protestant reformation. Now half of Christendom thinks the Eucharist is only a symbol, but that was not what Christ taught explicitly in the Bible. Again, I don’t want to say that in His loving kindness He won’t bless people who don’t see it this way, because it is obvious he does. However, it is not what the Bible teaches. I would have to say for myself that it is my experience that He is present in the sacrament like in no other way I know. I hope this helps your understanding of what I meant, Saved Lady.

 

[Reuben_J]

I do agree with most of what you said, but,who told you that Protestants ( I guess you are including Baptist in that) do not have the Lord’s Real Presence because we don’t have the Eucharist? We have just as much presence of God in our services as you do. Not to sound harsh, but that is what it sounds like to me when you say we don’t have the presence of God.

You do not have the Real Presence because you do not have the Eucharist. That’s a correct statement if you understand what Catholics meant by the Sacrament of Eucharist.

We do not deny that you have real presence of Jesus in your life though. If you say that Jesus’ presence is really real in your life, gathering, service and prayer, there is no reason not to believe you. You just need to understand what we mean by Real Presence in the Eucharist.

God bless you.

 

[no_good]

This has nothing to debate about the last several posts…but about the main thread. I have interest in joining the Catholic Church. My husband is a non-practicing catholic, I’m a baptist. We were married in a baptist church. I have heard that those wanting to be married in a catholic church must go to a class of some type. My husband was not interested and wanted to be married outside the church. Why does the catholic church not recognize our married? This particular wedding had just as much scripture (if not more) read, than any catholic wedding that I have every attended. Baptist or Catholic, we all believe in the Word of God, I don’t understand?

 

[4Squarebaby]

This has nothing to debate about the last several posts…but about the main thread. I have interest in joining the Catholic Church. My husband is a non-practicing catholic, I’m a baptist. We were married in a baptist church. I have heard that those wanting to be married in a catholic church must go to a class of some type. My husband was not interested and wanted to be married outside the church. Why does the catholic church not recognize our married? This particular wedding had just as much scripture (if not more) read, than any catholic wedding that I have every attended. Baptist or Catholic, we all believe in the Word of God, I don’t understand?

They recognize you as married, it is just not valid under their rules because your husband was suppose to be taught them and as far as they are concerned he was disobedient. remember the Catholic Church position is they have full faith and others are only part way there. So now when he goes to Mass he is not suppose to go forward and receive communion. When in a Baptist Church he is also suppose to refuse communion.

 

[Bluegoat]

This has nothing to debate about the last several posts…but about the main thread. I have interest in joining the Catholic Church. My husband is a non-practicing catholic, I’m a baptist. We were married in a baptist church. I have heard that those wanting to be married in a catholic church must go to a class of some type. My husband was not interested and wanted to be married outside the church. Why does the catholic church not recognize our married? This particular wedding had just as much scripture (if not more) read, than any catholic wedding that I have every attended. Baptist or Catholic, we all believe in the Word of God, I don’t understand?

If you and your husband had both been non-Catholic, your marriage would have been valid (as long as there were no other problems with it, just like a marriage between Catholics.)

But, the rules of the Catholic Church say that a Catholic must marry in the Catholic Church, or get permission to marry elsewhere. This is what you could characterize as a matter of discipline. Because your husband broke the rules on this, his marriage would not be valid if it were brought to an annulment tribunal. (I believe, if your husband had formally written to his Bishop breaking his ties to the Catholic Church, he would no longer be bound to those rules. But just not attending doesn’t count.)

You can, however, now apply to have your marriage convalidated by the Catholic Church, if your husband wishes to. As it stands at the moment, if you got a civil divorce, you could easily ask for and receive an annulment from the Catholic Church, though that may not matter to your husband if he doesn’t practice.

 

[Reuben_J]

This has nothing to debate about the last several posts…but about the main thread. I have interest in joining the Catholic Church. My husband is a non-practicing catholic, I’m a baptist. We were married in a baptist church. I have heard that those wanting to be married in a catholic church must go to a class of some type. My husband was not interested and wanted to be married outside the church. Why does the catholic church not recognize our married? This particular wedding had just as much scripture (if not more) read, than any catholic wedding that I have every attended. Baptist or Catholic, we all believe in the Word of God, I don’t understand?

Well it seems advice on Catholic marriage is very forthcoming in this forum so I hope it is no harm to hear another one from a Catholic.

You are a Baptist and your husband is a non-practicing Catholic. Now you are interested in becoming Catholic and hopefully you will be confirmed as one. Well, everything seems to be going great for you. Once you are confirmed Catholic, I am not sure if you need to be Baptized – you have to if that’s not done in the Baptist Church, you can have your marriage blessed by a Catholic priest. There you are – a full-fledge Catholic couple.

There are a couple of things that you need to know though. Now every couple wanting to get married needs to undergo a short (two days) pre-nuptial marriage course in the parish where they intend to get married. That’s where they learn about what a Christian marriage is, Christian husband/wife/parents and sexuality. It is where they will be taught that once married there will be no divorce not even annulment. That they have to bring up their **children in the Catholic faith **and that birth control is prohibited. Marriage being a Sacrament needs to be administered by an ordained priest. Thus marriage outside the Catholic Church is not considered valid because of the absence of the said requirement.

So you see, marriage comes with great responsibility. Your husband does well to appreciate this if he loves you that much to take your marriage seriously and willing to go through the entire requirement to make your marriage a valid one.

Good luck and may God bless both of you.

p/s the Catholic Church allows for mixed marriage so I am not sure why you all did not marry by it then.

 

[Saved_Lady]

[SIGN][/SIGN]
Saved Lady;5839966:

My question means, are we not going to not accept anyone that has sin in their life? Because the bible says if we can’t forgive our brother that has sin, Jesus can not forgive us of our sins.
And taking a drink is not the sin, but endulging in drinking, in which a lot of cases that is where it leads, and what some do when they drink is the sin. So, it is best that you not partake in alcoholic beverages to keep temptations down. [SIGN]And if my church is against it, and I am part of that church and I drink it, I think that it ruins my testimony.

]

Okay then what about sin? If I am going to be on the same train of thinking as you what if you sin? See my church forbids sin. But what about the people who do not take a drink and sin anyway?

Any sin you do purposely will ruin your testimony. Your church forbids sin, so no one in your church has any sin at all? There again, the Bible says that everyone has sinned and come short of the Glory of God. “If you say you have no sin, the truth is not in you.”

 

[Saved_Lady]

You do not have the Real Presence because you do not have the Eucharist. That’s a correct statement if you understand what Catholics meant by the Sacrament of Eucharist.

We do not deny that you have real presence of Jesus in your life though. If you say that Jesus’ presence is really real in your life, gathering, service and prayer, there is no reason not to believe you. You just need to understand what we mean by Real Presence in the Eucharist.

God bless you.

We will have to agree to disagree on this subject about the Real Presence is only through the Eucharist.

 

[Saved_Lady]

So, does that mean that the Bishop overrules Gods law?

Any answers on this question?

 

[Godfollower]

Any sin you do purposely will ruin your testimony. Your church forbids sin, so no one in your church has any sin at all? There again, the Bible says that everyone has sinned and come short of the Glory of God. “If you say you have no sin, the truth is not in you.”

The Catholic Church has never taught that none of its members sin. Jesus didn’t come for the righteous; He came for the sinners. One of the most comforting thoughts from the Bible is the fact that Jesus took Peter – who denied Him three times the night He was betrayed – and made him the rock on which He built His Church.

 

[Godfollower]

Saved Lady;5840805:

So, does that mean that the Priest overrules Gods law?

Any answers on this question?

No one claims that the bishops can overrule God’s law. In fact, Catholic canon law refers to two types of laws: divine law (established by God and which cannot be changed by the Church) and “merely ecclesiastical” law (established by the Church and which can be changed by the Church).

 

[no_good]

4Squarebaby, Bluegoat, and Reuben J thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut. This helps so much! I wish I would have know this information years ago when we were married. But I didn’t, so now I must move forward to correct the error of our ways. Hopefully once I convert (I have attended only 2 RCIA classes) I can get my husband interested in attending mass once again. We shall see.

 

[Reuben_J]

4Squarebaby, Bluegoat, and Reuben J thank you all for your (name removed by moderator)ut. This helps so much! I wish I would have know this information years ago when we were married. But I didn’t, so now I must move forward to correct the error of our ways. Hopefully once I convert (I have attended only 2 RCIA classes) I can get my husband interested in attending mass once again. We shall see.

God bless you dear. I keep both of you in my prayer.