Protestant service last night.

[Calgar]

I am a little confused here. Why would Catholic’s of all religions be easy pickens?

I would think we would be the worst of any faith, because speaking for myself here now. I could never go to a Protestant Church and give up the Eucharist.

I think calling any Christian “easy pickings” is kind of offensive.

We don’t actively target Roman Catholics (although you can’t know when you talk to someone on the street) in my area, but they still come walking in the door.

I’m very curious myself about why someone would leave an organization they’ve been a part of their entire lives so I usually ask them, politely, why? The answers mostly fall into two camps:

1. Somebody did something I didn’t like so I’m mad and I’m leaving.
2. An actual disagreement with an RCC stance that leads them to protest (get it? protest, protestant? I tried.).

 

[CopticChristian]

I think calling any Christian “easy pickings” is kind of offensive.

We don’t actively target Roman Catholics (although you can’t know when you talk to someone on the street) in my area, but they still come walking in the door.

I’m very curious myself about why someone would leave an organization they’ve been a part of their entire lives so I usually ask them, politely, why? The answers mostly fall into two camps:

1. Somebody did something I didn’t like so I’m mad and I’m leaving.
2. An actual disagreement with an RCC stance that leads them to protest (get it? protest, protestant? I tried.).

My experience with Protestants that target Catholics is usually targeting Catholics that know little about the Bible that the Church gave us. The conversation usually goes like this…Usually the starting point is Mary and her sinless nature.

The Catholic Church does not teach the truth. What…you are taught that Mary is without sin. Oh yeah we believe that.

Check this out right here in your Bible…

“

FOR ALL HAVE SINNED, AND COME SHORT OF THE GLORY OF GOD” Romans 3:23.

Let me read that again…yup…so how can Mary be sinless?

Oh My God…you mean that after all these years I have been lied to??? Well read it for yourself…

“

FOR ALL HAVE SINNED, AND COME SHORT OF THE GLORY OF GOD” Romans 3:23.

You are entirely correct “it says”…very common to hear “it says”…it says right here that all have sinned…then down the Protestant rabbit hole…of confusion…

Now when I hear this I say…do you believe that this means Mary has sinned. Yes I do. And you want me to belileve that Mary has sinned…well you can read it for yourself…

Let me ask you this…did Jesus sin…well no…Ok …well then what about the newborn baby…well no.

Then the other route is this…

You can know you will go to heaven and be saved…huh? Saved? yeah…well I go to confession, I go to the sacraments…Well did you know all you have to do is just ask Jesus to be your Lord and saviour and then not do all that works righteousness stuff…awe come on where did you get that…right here

“it says”…

that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. Romans 10:9.

See it says it right here. You mean the Church I go to does not teach this…you mean all I have to do is open my mouth…yup it says so right here…and poof another lost soul

I usually say did you happen to know that the letter to the Romans was written to Christians…

7To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

8First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

It says so right in the introduction…OK…did you also know that right around Romans 3 Paul is talking to the Judaizing Christians and says “first”…did you happen to notice that?

1Then what advantage has the Jew? Or what is the benefit of circumcision? 2Great in every respect. First of all, that they were entrusted with the oracles of God.

I usually look for second, and then third after I see first…you can see he is addressing a particular Christian group here…the Judaizing Christian…and then if you look for “second” you won’t find it until…Romans 11 Paul wraps up what he commenced with in Romans 3

1I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew.

In other words the entire dialogue from Romans 3 to Romans 11 is to the Judaizing Christians. The letter is written to Christians and Christians are all saved, yes or no?

Well then Romans 10:9 is written to let the Judaizing Christians know that they have to abandon the Old Covenant and embrace the New as pointed out in Romans 7. So this could never be a formula for new Christian conversion.

Where did you do your Bible study? Certainly not a Catholic Christian Church.

 

[JRRTFAN]

May I respectfully ask why? It just blows my mind that you would do that.

Peace,

Simple, to keep peace in the valley.

 

[Legal_Eagle]

Simple, to keep peace in the valley.

Fair enough. You went above and beyond the call of duty, in my opinion. Did it work?

Peace,

 

[crazzeto]

I have a protestant friend who, while I consider him an honest trying Christian to the best of his ability, is similarly misguided. In fact this particular person goes as far as to not consider any source but the King James “authorized” version as authoratative. Ironically, though through no fault of his own, he is not blessed with a good reading ability. So he hasn’t read much of the bible, and has trouble understanding the parts he reads. He literally goes completely on what he’s heard (sounds like a tradition to me huh??).

I would say, just live your faith around your friend. No need to be eccumeical like this and set your self up to be upset. Just life your faith and that should speak volumes, even if they’ll never trust catholisism. I would also suggest there’s nothing wrong with a respectful theological debate, I’ve had a few with many evangelical friends and they have been shocked to find them selves unable to respond to many of the points being brought up. No testament to my own intellegence there, basically I repeat holy mother church. It’s amazing how strong a case you can make just studying the published works of the fathers and especially the catichism, and tieing it all together with some home bible study so you can refer to the “correct sections” of the bible (ie. as mentioned only the protestant subsection of it).

Setting up a meeting with the pastor as Cat I beleive suggested isn’t a bad idea either if you feel comfortable.

 

[peace2u2]

I’m very curious myself about why someone would leave an organization they’ve been a part of their entire lives so I usually ask them, politely, why? The answers mostly fall into two camps:

1. Somebody did something I didn’t like so I’m mad and I’m leaving.
2. An actual disagreement with an RCC stance that leads them to protest (get it? protest, protestant? I tried.).

Recently, I listened to an audio tape titled, How To Keep Your Kids Catholic by a man named, Ken Hensley, a former Baptist Minister and convert to Catholicism.

He gives some interesting percentages as to why baptized Cathoics leave their Catholic Faith:

Surprisingly, He states that 52% of Catholics who left their Catholic Faith left because their family life growing up was unhappy so they as they grew up left the faith that they were brought up in during that unhappy time. And, not because they were unhappy with the Church, but rather, unhappy period.

2% left their Catholic Faith because the Church did not meet their spiritual needs. Thats right just 2%.

19% left the Church because they were engaged in behavior that was at odds with the teachings of Jesus Christ and His Cathoic Church. I’m sure there are just as many who practice their Catholic faith and are engaged in behavior that is contrary to same right now.

23% left the Church simply because they didn’t relate so they walked.

I suppose they couldn’t related because they were not strong in their faith due to partly the fault of their parents who were probably ignorant of their Catholic Faith. Trust me when I say if you are a public school child and attend from 1st grade until 8th grade formal religious education lessons for approx. an hour and half a week and you are not being brought to church to worship God on Sunday on a regular basis and nothing is being taught at home about God, Jesus or His Holy Spirit and no one is saying grace before meals and no one is prayiing bedtime prayers together, then trust me, the wolf in sheeps clothes is just waiting around the corner for the opportunity to lead you away with lies.

 

[ZoeyBdo]

I attended a Lutheran service two weeks ago for my husband. He is Lutheran. He has been attending Mass with me, however, as “happy wife happy life” makes him happy

He asked, however, if we could attend the church he grew up going to, schooled at, and I agreed.

The Pastor was MORE than wonderful. Very nice man, younger, married with children, and his sermon was honestly great. He introduced himself to my husband and I, recognizing that we had not been before, and when I told him that I was Catholic, he said “all are welcome”.

I’ve been to churches (in my younger years with friends) that were Protestant, and I’ve heard the Catholic bashing. I then of course never attended that church again.

There was none of that at this Lutheran church.

It was a nice experience. My husband asked if it would be alright if we attend more often. I agreed, as I can go to both (Saturday then Sunday).

He’s respectful of me, I’m respectful of him. He does not try to change me, or tell me I’m wrong, and I just jokingly tell him what a Catholic customer of mine once told me on Christmas eve “Oh, your husband’s Lutheran? Well, at least that’s not too far off the wagon”…
His mother, on the other hand, attends a Methodist church and expressed that we should “church-shop” until we find one that we both agree on.
I stated to my husband ~ no, absolutely not ~ and said “I’m Catholic. That’s not going to change. If I’m already on the wagon why would I jump off?”

For some reason that “wagon” comment from the customer years ago really stuck with me, but makes a lot of sense! LOL

 

[rinnie]

JL: Catholics are considered easy picken because they are seen as ignorant of the bible. Most Catholics who convert to other denomination are ignorant of the bible and even the Catholic faith. However most Protestants who convert to Catholic know the bible and can see those things you point out such as Eucharist etc…

You know I used to think that also. Simply because when I would say something I was asked where is that in the bible. I would think, I don’t know exactly but I am sure its in there.

Then I learned not all is in the bible. The Bible told me that

But ironically what I really learned is this, we are not ignorant of the bible, but the numbers and the verses.

Think about it we are read to, from a Priest every single day, or Sunday, from the Bible.

We are taught how the O.T. ties into the N.T. We just don’t realize what we do know because we are spoiled, to an extent, Because we hear it over and over.

 

[GaryTaylor]

You know I used to think that also. Simply because when I would say something I was asked where is that in the bible. I would think, I don’t know exactly but I am sure its in there.

Then I learned not all is in the bible. The Bible told me that

But ironically what I really learned is this, we are not ignorant of the bible, but the numbers and the verses.

Think about it we are read to, from a Priest every single day, or Sunday, from the Bible.

We are taught how the O.T. ties into the N.T. We just don’t realize what we do know because we are spoiled, to an extent, Because we hear it over and over.

Well said, you often absorb much more that your realize.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I attended a Lutheran service two weeks ago for my husband. He is Lutheran. He has been attending Mass with me, however, as “happy wife happy life” makes him happy

He asked, however, if we could attend the church he grew up going to, schooled at, and I agreed.

The Pastor was MORE than wonderful. Very nice man, younger, married with children, and his sermon was honestly great. He introduced himself to my husband and I, recognizing that we had not been before, and when I told him that I was Catholic, he said “all are welcome”.

I’ve been to churches (in my younger years with friends) that were Protestant, and I’ve heard the Catholic bashing. I then of course never attended that church again.

There was none of that at this Lutheran church.

It was a nice experience. My husband asked if it would be alright if we attend more often. I agreed, as I can go to both (Saturday then Sunday).

He’s respectful of me, I’m respectful of him. He does not try to change me, or tell me I’m wrong, and I just jokingly tell him what a Catholic customer of mine once told me on Christmas eve “Oh, your husband’s Lutheran? Well, at least that’s not too far off the wagon”…
His mother, on the other hand, attends a Methodist church and expressed that we should “church-shop” until we find one that we both agree on.
I stated to my husband ~ no, absolutely not ~ and said “I’m Catholic. That’s not going to change. If I’m already on the wagon why would I jump off?”

For some reason that “wagon” comment from the customer years ago really stuck with me, but makes a lot of sense! LOL

The Lord works in mysterious ways as has been so often stated. I seen a great show on the Journey Home on EWTN of the exact situation as yours, only in reverse, she was Lutheran and he was Catholic. He attended the Lutheran church to get along and they did, and do.

As the Lord would have it by providence she enrolled her child in a Catholic daycare close by. As she viewed the statues of the Blessed Mother she decided she better read a bit more about the Catholic Faith. Seems to me she wound up not only converting, but teaching her husband a whole lot he seemed to have overlooked.

 

[Calgar]

trust me, the wolf in sheeps clothes is just waiting around the corner for the opportunity to lead you away with lies.

So, we’re liers and wolves. Well, at least I know where we stand now, “peace2u2”.

 

[Diana_Catherine]

Recently, I listened to an audio tape titled, How To Keep Your Kids Catholic by a man named, Ken Hensley, a former Baptist Minister and convert to Catholicism.

He gives some interesting percentages as to why baptized Cathoics leave their Catholic Faith:

Surprisingly, He states that 52% of Catholics who left their Catholic Faith left because their family life growing up was unhappy so they as they grew up left the faith that they were brought up in during that unhappy time. And, not because they were unhappy with the Church, but rather, unhappy period.

2% left their Catholic Faith because the Church did not meet their spiritual needs. Thats right just 2%.

19% left the Church because they were engaged in behavior that was at odds with the teachings of Jesus Christ and His Cathoic Church. I’m sure there are just as many who practice their Catholic faith and are engaged in behavior that is contrary to same right now.

23% left the Church simply because they didn’t relate so they walked.

I suppose they couldn’t related because they were not strong in their faith due to partly the fault of their parents who were probably ignorant of their Catholic Faith. Trust me when I say if you are a public school child and attend from 1st grade until 8th grade formal religious education lessons for approx. an hour and half a week and you are not being brought to church to worship God on Sunday on a regular basis and nothing is being taught at home about God, Jesus or His Holy Spirit and no one is saying grace before meals and no one is prayiing bedtime prayers together, then trust me, the wolf in sheeps clothes is just waiting around the corner for the opportunity to lead you away with lies.

I listened to that talk, also. I think your last point at the end puts it into perspective. I remember him saying if the parents at home are not teaching the faith, are not showing anymore than just faith on Sundays and then don’t provide love in the home, it is a great reason children leave the faith. Shaking off the faith is kind of a shaking off of the unhappiness he experienced at home.

My experience with Protestants that target Catholics is usually targeting Catholics that know little about the Bible that the Church gave us. .

Then, agreeing with and adding this type of experience added to their life, it is easy to see why they leave. They can’t fight back because they don’t know the answers to the attacks, so they believe them.

People are hungry for God and His truth today. The Catholic schools stopped teaching it back in the day, parents are very busy today (probably don’t know the faith themselves)and figure their kids get catechised at CCD or youth group and then top it off someone telling them their faith or their Church has lied to them and the Church’s crisis right now added in, it is easy to see why the leave.

Not too long ago, I heard a woman coming in to the faith ask a Sister when will they learn what the catechism says. Sister (in plain clothes) says, “we don’t teach the catechism anymore.” Fortunately we don’t attend there and the Catholic school my son attends now has several young priests who are coming in bringing back the catechism and Catholic identity and I hope and pray that I can pass on the faith to him, so he will never want to leave. It is very frightening. I heard recently we should always be asking for the intercession of St. Monica for our children.

And then this is my own opinion. I am not saying protestants are not Christian but we hear so much when asked about protestants that they are our brothers and sisters in Christ, (and they are) and the way the talk goes around it is almost sounds like a permission to fellowship, participate and join in with them. You’ve heard the saying, “come join your protestant brothers and sisters…” Fill in the blanks. Almost as if they are okay so just leave it at that, instead of helping protestants realize they do not know the whole truth. They are the ones being deceived.

 

[CopticChristian]

I attended a Lutheran service two weeks ago for my husband. He is Lutheran. He has been attending Mass with me, however, as “happy wife happy life” makes him happy

He asked, however, if we could attend the church he grew up going to, schooled at, and I agreed.

The Pastor was MORE than wonderful. Very nice man, younger, married with children, and his sermon was honestly great. He introduced himself to my husband and I, recognizing that we had not been before, and when I told him that I was Catholic, he said “all are welcome”.

I’ve been to churches (in my younger years with friends) that were Protestant, and I’ve heard the Catholic bashing. I then of course never attended that church again.

There was none of that at this Lutheran church.

It was a nice experience. My husband asked if it would be alright if we attend more often. I agreed, as I can go to both (Saturday then Sunday).

He’s respectful of me, I’m respectful of him. He does not try to change me, or tell me I’m wrong, and I just jokingly tell him what a Catholic customer of mine once told me on Christmas eve “Oh, your husband’s Lutheran? Well, at least that’s not too far off the wagon”…
His mother, on the other hand, attends a Methodist church and expressed that we should “church-shop” until we find one that we both agree on.
I stated to my husband ~ no, absolutely not ~ and said “I’m Catholic. That’s not going to change. If I’m already on the wagon why would I jump off?”

For some reason that “wagon” comment from the customer years ago really stuck with me, but makes a lot of sense! LOL

There is a difference from denominational Protestants and those that are “just Christian”…you may look at the varying types of Lutheran as they are not all alike. It may make sense that the Lutheran Church you go to ascribes to “confessions” rather than those that just pick up a bible and have ready instant knowledge and theology as taught in their bible study and church services.

 

[CopticChristian]

You know I used to think that also. Simply because when I would say something I was asked where is that in the bible. I would think, I don’t know exactly but I am sure its in there.

Then I learned not all is in the bible. The Bible told me that

But ironically what I really learned is this, we are not ignorant of the bible, but the numbers and the verses.

Think about it we are read to, from a Priest every single day, or Sunday, from the Bible.

We are taught how the O.T. ties into the N.T. We just don’t realize what we do know because we are spoiled, to an extent, Because we hear it over and over.

Interesting. My priest usually addressed the congregation before Mass and asks questions like…

How is everyone doing?

Is everyone ready to come to the Lord?

Has everyone been living out thier Faith this week? and then he says How?

Is everyone ready for the readings? Has everyone read them before Mass?

yes he asks.

 

[seanman611]

When I was searching for a local church to attend, I had one rule that I used to “weed” out a number churches. If they didn’t belong to some sort of “denomination” or didn’t have some sort of oversight, I avoided that church like the plague.

Probably the biggest problem with these independent non-denom churches is that they can be started and run by anybody, regardless of training or even attending seminary. At least with denominational churches, they have some sort of board who really runs the church and the pastor has to meet certain requirements to be able to pastor. That’s not to say that these churches are free from these problems, but they are usually far better options.

The local non-denom church in our town has the largest Sunday attendance of all the churches and they are very heretical in their teachings, even by most protestant standards.

 

[MrZetterlund]

Ok, so I went to a Non-denominational service last night. I was doing it as a favor and trying to be somewhat ecumenical. Knowing where they stand, I had serious misgivings about attending. Now I know why.

The sermon was on Revelation Chapter 2:18-3:5, specifically the the churches of Thyatria and Sardis. The pastor proceeded to say the church of Thyatria represented the Catholic church, talking about all of the good the Catholic church has done in the world. Then, quoting the passages addressed to the churches of Thyatria, especially v 20-21, proceeded to talk about idolatry and false teachings. He then mentioned purgatory, confession to a priest, and the Mass itself, all as being unbiblical. He kept talking about how people are “caught up in this system”, and “the system isn’t going to save you”. “dont need a church, just a relationship”. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. I wasn’t really surprised, but I was upset by it.

When talking about the church at Sardis, he immediately compared it to Protestantism. Honestly, I know I didn’t take in all he said here, because I was so upset that he was using the pulpit to attack Holy Mother Church. However, I do remember that when he spoke negatively of Protestantism, it was mainly the Lutheran, Anglican, or Methodist churches (probably because they werent enough like his church). Of course he only had good things to say about his own brand of Protestantism.

The pastor asked for a show of hands before the sermon of how many had a Catholic upbringing. About 40-50 people raised their hand. I wanted to walk out in the middle, but I didn’t out of respect for who I was there with. All I wanted to do afterward was go to Adoration.

A lot was on my mind afterward. I know a lot of what this preacher said was nonsense. Should I have walked out? Should I not have gotten so upset? This pastor was using his position and attacking the Catholic church as idolatrus and false. Not sure whether it was ignorance or malice. It seems as though my misgivings about attending were confirmed.

I welcome any thoughts on this

Its this simple: The Catholic Church is a big entity. So big, that it is either the one true Church intended by Jesus Christ or the scarlot beast ‘drunk with the blood of the saints.’ Your “Non-Denominational” pastor here chooses the latter because he realizes that the Catholic Church is so vastly different from what he understands to be “Christianity” that he realizes that our beliefs and practices would either invalidate his own or make us invalid, and of course he takes the latter to save his own hide…

I wouldn’t care who I was there with, I would have got up and walked out. If anyone asked where I was going I would probably yell “Open your Bibles to Proverbs 19:2!!” before I left. It is more disrespectful to make your Catholic friend sit in an anti-catholic environment than it is to actually be expected to sit there and attend such nonsense…

 

[MrZetterlund]

I was under the impression that the Holy Spirit was involved somehow.

Then you would be a Catholic so you don’t have an edition of the Bible that Luther ripped apart. If the selected works of God’s Church, the only CHURCH around at the time, saw these Scriptures as inspired then we should be obligated to keep them…

 

[CopticChristian]

When I was searching for a local church to attend, I had one rule that I used to “weed” out a number churches. If they didn’t belong to some sort of “denomination” or didn’t have some sort of oversight, I avoided that church like the plague.

Probably the biggest problem with these independent non-denom churches is that they can be started and run by anybody, regardless of training or even attending seminary. At least with denominational churches, they have some sort of board who really runs the church and the pastor has to meet certain requirements to be able to pastor. That’s not to say that these churches are free from these problems, but they are usually far better options.

The local non-denom church in our town has the largest Sunday attendance of all the churches and they are very heretical in their teachings, even by most protestant standards.

Your mindset is different than many of those others who believe that the Church was underground, met in homes and for them this is consistent with that notion, loose and not organized.

 

[jlhargus]

Ok, so I went to a Non-denominational service last night. I was doing it as a favor and trying to be somewhat ecumenical. Knowing where they stand, I had serious misgivings about attending. Now I know why.

The sermon was on Revelation Chapter 2:18-3:5, specifically the the churches of Thyatria and Sardis. The pastor proceeded to say the church of Thyatria represented the Catholic church, talking about all of the good the Catholic church has done in the world. Then, quoting the passages addressed to the churches of Thyatria, especially v 20-21, proceeded to talk about idolatry and false teachings. He then mentioned purgatory, confession to a priest, and the Mass itself, all as being unbiblical. He kept talking about how people are “caught up in this system”, and “the system isn’t going to save you”. “dont need a church, just a relationship”. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. I wasn’t really surprised, but I was upset by it.

When talking about the church at Sardis, he immediately compared it to Protestantism. Honestly, I know I didn’t take in all he said here, because I was so upset that he was using the pulpit to attack Holy Mother Church. However, I do remember that when he spoke negatively of Protestantism, it was mainly the Lutheran, Anglican, or Methodist churches (probably because they werent enough like his church). Of course he only had good things to say about his own brand of Protestantism.

The pastor asked for a show of hands before the sermon of how many had a Catholic upbringing. About 40-50 people raised their hand. I wanted to walk out in the middle, but I didn’t out of respect for who I was there with. All I wanted to do afterward was go to Adoration.

A lot was on my mind afterward. I know a lot of what this preacher said was nonsense. Should I have walked out? Should I not have gotten so upset? This pastor was using his position and attacking the Catholic church as idolatrus and false. Not sure whether it was ignorance or malice. It seems as though my misgivings about attending were confirmed. I welcome any thoughts on this

JL: I have been thinking about what I would do in this situation. I don’t think I would walk out but maybe talk to the pastor after the service. Pointing out his misconceptions. I wouldn’t interrupt the service but if people in the congregation were shouting amen, in agreement, I might shout NO SO, in disagreement. I guess it would depend on the particular circumstances

 

[JustaServant]

JL: Catholics are considered easy picken because they are seen as ignorant of the bible. Most Catholics who convert to other denomination are ignorant of the bible and even the Catholic faith. However most Protestants who convert to Catholic know the bible and can see those things you point out such as Eucharist etc…

Actually that’s not totally true.
When I was in fundamentalism many moons ago Catholics were considered the hardest to ‘evangelize’ because they would be ‘regecting thier families.’
You know who are the easiest?
People who are getting a divorce. They are already at a crisis point in their life that can be easily exploited.
I’ve seen it.