Protestant tactics used to draw kids away from the Church

[FathersKnowBest]

Our parish has donuts and coffee after Mass once a month, and it is very successful. Some parishes have it every week.

Ours does, too.

Catholics are not into (or are not supposed to be into) long conversations when in church before Mass begins.

We need to be anticipating the Mass by praying, or meditating on the readings for the day in the missal.

Does it seem like Catholics emphasize the spiritual to the detriment of the carnal; and vice-versa for protestants? Both are wrong, but I think that the Catholic stand is closer to correct.

 

[Country_Gal]

For those of you who haven’t been to non Catholic churches before, the ones I’ve been to have coffee hours after church, with homebaked goodies from several contributors who take a lot of pride in their offerings. They would never be satisfied with offering mere donuts like Catholics do. And only once a month? They would consider that a disgrace, I’m certain.

The Episcopal church I went to was tiny, really tiny. Yet there was an array of homebaked goods each week, and a shared meal once a month after church.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

Our parish has donuts and coffee after Mass once a month, and it is very successful. Some parishes have it every week.

Catholics are not into (or are not supposed to be into) long conversations when in church before Mass begins.

We need to be anticipating the Mass by praying, or meditating on the readings for the day in the missal.

Noboby’s asking for a disruption or change of the Mass. But Catholic churches do fail in fellowship.

There could be any number of things to adopt. Pot-lucks, quilting bees, bingo, who knows? I am always left wondering why there is so little sense of liking your neighbor.

 

[CorieDreams]

People at Catholic parishes often are unfriendly.

But this has nothing to do with the scriptural instruction, and I agree that non-Catholics should not receive Catholic Communion.

I agree. There’s not a lot of warmth. I’ve even heard peopel say, “we Catholics don’t do fellowship. We don’t do youth groups or Bible Studies. WE have the eucharist and that’s all anyone needs”

WEll of course, not to devalue the eucharist in any way, but…why is it seem as being something mutually exclusive? can’t we have Mass, Eucharist, AND opportunities for fellowship and fun?

 

[Dorothy]

Noboby’s asking for a disruption or change of the Mass. But Catholic churches do fail in fellowship.

There could be any number of things to adopt. Pot-lucks, quilting bees, bingo, who knows? I am always left wondering why there is so little sense of liking your neighbor.

We do have pot-lucks and craft bees…no bingo.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

I agree. There’s not a lot of warmth. I’ve even heard peopel say, “we Catholics don’t do fellowship. We don’t do youth groups or Bible Studies. WE have the eucharist and that’s all anyone needs”

WEll of course, not to devalue the eucharist in any way, but…why is it seem as being something mutually exclusive? can’t we have Mass, Eucharist, AND opportunities for fellowship and fun?

What you said!

 

[Dorothy]

I agree. There’s not a lot of warmth. I’ve even heard peopel say, “we Catholics don’t do fellowship. We don’t do youth groups or Bible Studies. WE have the eucharist and that’s all anyone needs”

WEll of course, not to devalue the eucharist in any way, but…why is it seem as being something mutually exclusive? can’t we have Mass, Eucharist, AND opportunities for fellowship and fun?

I must be fortunate to live in an area where the parishes have bible studies, youth groups, donuts & coffee, and craft get-togethers. We have door greeters as well. I’m glad I never heard a Catholic say that all they need is the Eucharist and not fellowship, as the Eucharist should enable us to reach out to others.

 

[Country_Gal]

Noboby’s asking for a disruption or change of the Mass. But Catholic churches do fail in fellowship.

There could be any number of things to adopt. Pot-lucks, quilting bees, bingo, who knows? I am always left wondering why there is so little sense of liking your neighbor.

I agree. Catholics should not get defensive about this, or start bringing up how great the Mass is, how people should understand it more, that Protestants aren’t reverent enough, etc.

I’ve known people leave the Church because they got no emotional support after a death in the family, I personally left for similar reasons, the lack of fellowship for my daughters really affected their feelings about the faith. They think the Catholic Church is lifeless and all the priests gay, that’s what they told me.

 

[Country_Gal]

I agree. There’s not a lot of warmth. I’ve even heard peopel say, “we Catholics don’t do fellowship. We don’t do youth groups or Bible Studies. WE have the eucharist and that’s all anyone needs”

WEll of course, not to devalue the eucharist in any way, but…why is it seem as being something mutually exclusive? can’t we have Mass, Eucharist, AND opportunities for fellowship and fun?

Exactly. The Church needs to have a more Holistic approach and meet peoples needs on many levels. It needs to do an honest self assessment, rather than circling the wagons around the Eucharist and saying that’s all we do, it should be enough.

 

[SecretaryMonday]

In light of this thread I found it ironic and funny that this happened today.

I was on my way to take my kids to an indoor bounce house place, you know one of those kids zones. I had never been there and thought I passed it when I saw this cartoon like decorated kid place. I turned around and pulled in the lot to find…

An evangelical church and their “treasure Island” kid zone.

Classic example of how they “get them in”

See attachment for photo…yes that’s a grass roof.

It’s a church? :ehh:

At first I thought that the slanted “T” was supposed to look like an “X” (for buried treasure), but now I can see that it is probably supposed to be a cross. (Also for buried treasure?)

 

[Kelfa28]

I must be fortunate to live in an area where the parishes have bible studies, youth groups, donuts & coffee, and craft get-togethers. We have door greeters as well. I’m glad I never heard a Catholic say that all they need is the Eucharist and not fellowship, as the Eucharist should enable us to reach out to others.

Same boat here.

Our Parish is good when it comes to fellowship. I don’t think it’s on the same level as some of the local evangelical churches but it’s definitely better then what I’ve seen at other Catholic Churches.

We have lots of activities all year round for every age. Our Parish attracts a lot of young families and the WOG group has 60 regular members…we do pot luck and other activities.

We have summer retreats, spaghetti dinners and pancake breakfasts and its fun seeing everyone from Church with their hair down…so to speak.

I wonder if it’s because we have a Catholic school attached and most of the families know each other anyway. But my husband and I are really new to the parish and we are just starting our family…and I’ve been greeted with nothing but warmth and open arms.

The outside of our Church after Mass is just lots of people mingling and chatting. It would be nice to have coffee and donuts but we don’t really have the space for it.

I guess not all Churches are like this…but to say all or even most Catholic Churches have no sense of fellowship is an incorrect statement.

Maybe some parishes have an older crowd and not too many young families…who knows?

 

[Jon_S_1]

Yeah I think we all could do a lot better at fellowship. I’m not sure why things evolved differently but it’s a constant concern I hear from Protestants and converts regarding the lack of fellowship.

I am fortunate that my parish has a lot if good fellowship, but I know most struggle in this area.

When I was evangelical, the fellowship largely originated in the small adult fellowship groups (Sunday School). We would go to the main service (equivalent of going to mass) and then go to a second hour where we did a light Bible Study and mostly just fellowship. This group did a lot of outside activities too and it was like a small family. Then it was more fun to go to all the big events the church did because you knew people well. These groups were typically split up by age ranges.

It was a great model I think we could learn from.

One way my parish has tried similar things is with a Monday night Catechism series led by the priest and a thing called Small Christian Communities where they meet weekly in homes for study and fellowship.

And as far as my pic goes of that church. I think it’s great to have a VBS fun atmosphere for kids to help them learn. It just can’t stop there, it has to be a supplement to the mass and the message.

Too often in my evangelical youth experience it was about the fun and not church, and the meat of Christianity was not really taught until high school or even college.

 

[FathersKnowBest]

One way my parish has tried similar things is with a Monday night Catechism series led by the priest

Hmmm … that right there gave me pause.

Perhaps one issue is that, for too long, we had been blessed with a surplus of priests, and now that’s ending what with priests becoming older & scarcer on average.

I think that there’s a whole lot to be thought of; for instance:

1. some Catholics have gotten complacent, relying on the priests for all types of extracurriculars
2. some Catholics have a distrust for Church activities which don’t involve a priest
3. our priests are being pulled every which way (they’re spread too thin)
   and many more.

And as far as my pic goes of that church. I think it’s great to have a VBS fun atmosphere for kids to help them learn. It just can’t stop there, it has to be a supplement to the mass and the message.

Too often in my evangelical youth experience it was about the fun and not church, and the meat of Christianity was not really taught until high school or even college.

AMEN to that!

 

[DeSanto]

I am a Baptist turned Heathen who converted to Catholicism. I come from a particularly anti-Catholic family. Ditto what other say about using social relationships and lively worship services to draw people away. Every time I go to church with my family, I am stunned by the band up where the alter and crucifix should be. It can be quite exciting, but never do I leave with the sense of peace that pervades my soul when I attend mass.

Although I am in my 40s, they are convinced I am on the road to hell and trying to get me back. Here are some of the things I hear about, all of which might be said to your teenagers…

The Roman Catholic Church is a cult and it has brainwashed you.
You aren’t reading God’s word.
You are worshipping Mary. This is idolatry and goes against God’s word.
God has already forgiven you. You should not have to confess your sins to the priest.
You are a slave to the church and its Traditions, not our Lord Jesus Christ.

Try not to worry about all of this too much and instead focus on teaching your children about the faith. Someone else mentioned the Eucharist. I really believe that people would never, ever leave the Catholic church if they know in their soul that when we receive communion that it really is the body, blood, soul and divinity of our Lord. If you believe that, you will always sense that something is missing in these other churches. I would encourage you to focus on that point with your children. They may wander off. If they do, pray for them. It will work itself out.

Yes, you’re right. It is in His hands, I need to step back and remind myself of that. I too had many years where I had wandered off, but He never lost sight of me.

I believe it is the Eucharist that many who have received, will yearn to receive again in their soul, even if they don’t know it.

I recall a debate I heard once, it was Robert Spencer and Karl Keating. I’ll find the link and post it, it was really good. They were debating Islam. Keating spoke of a Muslim student who attended mass with him, just out of curiosity. He asked if we really believed that piece of bread was the real presence of The Lord. Keating said “yes”. The student said, “no, I don’t buy it.” Keating asked why… “He said because if you really believed that you would never get off your knees.”

That really struck me. After much thought on it though, I realized, God does not call us to be on our knees, He calls us to go out and proclaim the good news!!!

 

[DeSanto]

Many great replies already…
I have only two pieces of advice to offer.

1. the best defense is a good offense. - Make sure you children know the faith. Encourage them to ask questions and to understand the “why” of something and not just the “what”.
2. If they are approached and if they are interested in going to visit another Church - Go with them. See for yourself what is being taught…especially in regards to their view of the Catholic Church. Then you can research any errors in understanding and share this with your children and possibly even with the members of the other church.

Some of these other communions have things that are quite attractive to teens and young adults. Modern music and lights, animated pastors and speakers, youth groups etc. These are things that teens are naturally attracted to and they are not bad things in themselves.
But what needs to occur is that the meat be separated from the fluff. What can another Church offer that the Catholic Church cannot…What can the Catholic Church offer that another church cannot…The answer to that question makes the Catholic Church the winner hands down.

Peace
James

Yeah, getting my teens excited about reading scripture with me, not so easy. My girls have the most interest, my boy… Well, its a bit more of a balancing act with him. I’m just happy to get him to mass every week. Also, being that my husband grew up evangel, it has been a bit of a change from what he’s used to. I know the Holy Spirit is at work with him. When I finally got the nerve to tell him I was going to church, he was right on board and never looked back. Really not what I expected.

And that’s the lesson I’m getting from this thread, trust in The Lord, He’s got this.

 

[DeSanto]

One pitfall to avoid is letting apologetics become a substitute for actual spiritual development and prayer time. It’s very easy to allow genuine zeal for Christ to become intellectual pride at having the “right” answer. Limit the time you spend on it compared to prayer and sacraments.

It’s too late for me, save yourself while you still can!

Lol! Great advice, I noticed that very quickly. I have given myself time limits.

 

[DeSanto]

You may want to look into the Friendly Defender flash card series. They are short answers to many protestant objections to Catholicism in a flash card format. You may want to teach your children to answer objections with “I don’t know, but I will find out & get back to you”

Now I like that! I will definitely check that out, thanks.

 

[DeSanto]

I’m not Protestant, but I am raising a few kids and have thought about this problem myself. My resolution has been to arm them now (they are all still small) for the likelihood of having to deal with this. First, I unapologetically teach them the truth about the Catholic Church, that it is the one true Church of Christ and that Protestantism was founded by people who didn’t accept all that Christ wants us to accept. Second, I try to ground our family life in the Sacraments of the Church and various sacramentals to give them a Catholic worldview, one that would be shocked by a rock band standing where the altar is. I attend the EF (“Latin Mass”) with the kids in addition to going to our parish in the hopes to helping them to better understand what is happening at the Mass isn’t what is happening at Protestant services. Thirdly, as they get older I plan on teaching them about the Bible and while doing so to show them that the Bible came from the Church, as opposed to thinking the Church came from the Bible and should be judged by it. Lastly, I pray for them to stay faithful to the Church - this of course is the most important thing we can do for our kids (or anyone). I don’t know if any of that helps or if any of that will end up working for my little ones, but that is what I’m trying. God bless you and your family.

Yes, great insights, thank you.

 

[DeSanto]

I was baptized as an infant, made my First Communion, and Confirmation in the Catholic Church. I loved God and understood that Jesus died for my sins. I attended church weekly and was very happy, involved, and comfortable in my faith. When I was 17 I had even taught CCD classes to 5th graders. When I was 19 I met a man (my now husband) who attended a non-denominational protestant church. Everyone there was so welcoming, friendly, and nice. They had Bible studies at people’s homes on Tuesday night and snacks.

It wasn’t long before they asked me if I was “saved”. I had never heard that term before so I told them I didn’t know. They acted like that was such a big deal. They told me “if you died tonight where would you go?” I said purgatory. They gasped. They told me all I had to do was say “The Sinners Prayer”, ask Jesus into my heart and that I would go to heaven. So I did. As a 19 year old I thought it didn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that it’s better to go to heaven than purgatory. Looking back, I have no idea why I believed them so unquestioningly. They were just SO convincing. They had such sincerety. And just like that, much to my grandparents dismay, I left the Catholic church and started attending that denominational church. Then they started hitting me with things like

1. Crucifixes are wrong because Jesus isn’t on the cross anymore
2. Rosaries are occultic beacuse it is praying to a dead person (Mary)
3. The infallibility of the Pope is a joke because the Pope is just a man like everybody else
4. A wafer really can’t become Jesus’ body just because a priest says it does
5. Celibacy of priests is wrong because some of the apostles were married
6. Purgatory isn’t real
7. Mary had other children after Jesus and therefore shouldn’t be called the Virgin Mary
8. A priest can’t forgive sins, only Jesus has that power
9. Praying to saints is wrong because that’s communicating with the dead and they can’t hear you anyway because they’re not omniscient

Yes, I’ve heard them all. A few years ago, I would have been in no shape to combat those attack, today I might have a few good comebacks for them. But my kids, perhaps for now I should just let them know to keep the lines of communication open. To ask questions and let me know if they have heard these type of things to please come talk to me or somebody in the church to see what the counter arguments are first. That’s the great thing about our little church, the fellowship is a lot like the Protestant churches in the sense we are very close knit and everybody knows each other. The kids have gained some great role models and found people they can trust and talk to through RCAI and the youth groups.

That’s what I can remember off the top of my head, And I bought it hook, line, and sinker. I think they meant well. But after several years (it took me that long unfortunately) I began to question their teachings. There were other red flags that my husband finally started to see also - prophecies that didn’t come true, etc. We left there and attended a Baptist church for a while because my husband was not interested in Catholic anything. It got to a point though where I had to be honest with him and tell him that the Baptist church just felt like a cheap wanna-be imitation of Mass. I wanted the real thing again and I wanted to raise our 3 children the way I was raised. I, like the OP, all of a sudden felt a great deal of urgency. My husband was reluctant at first but he came to realize how important it was to me. Last month we had our marriage convalidated and our children baptized. I enrolled our oldest daughter in CCD and much to my disbelief my husband is going to start RCIA class this week My dream of us being a family of one faith may actually come true! I am praying he perseveres and finishes the classes…

Thanks be to God! I will pray for your family.

 

[DeSanto]

Cardinal Newman said “To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant.”

In addition to Keatings “Catholicism and Fundamentalism” I would recommend a couple of other books-

“Faith of the Early Fathers” edited and translated by Jurgens- at a minimum Volume I.

'Surprised by Truth" collected and edited by Patrick Madrid. Conversion stories of protestant ministers.

You have two issues as I understand it:

First issue. Concern for your kids. Have them read the bible as well as the books that have been recommended. I find ‘Faith of the Early Fathers’ particularly helpful in countering protestant arguments that the Catholic church has strayed from the practices of the earliest Christians. (St. Justin the Martyr’s description of a mass in the year ~148 is something I read to my 7th grade CCD class. Other than not mentioning singing, it is exactly what we do today).

Since we as Catholics believe in scripture and Sacred Tradition, and most protestants emphasize Sola Scriptura- you need to address that with them. What is our and the protestants authority for accepting our respective versions of the Bible as scripture? We rely on the Church’s authority- what do protestants rely on in accepting their version of the Bible as scripture? Kids do need to know this, that there are differences (deutero canonical books). As well as the Catholic Church teaches the whole truth which consists of Sacred Tradition along with scripture. A couple of handy quotes for your kids to see this is in fact biblical in responding to protestant criticism.

. 2 Thessalonians 13-17
13 But we must always thank God for you, brothers whom the Lord loves, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved by the Spirit who makes us holy and by faith in the truth. 14 Through our gospel he called you to this so that you should claim as your own the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

15 Stand firm, then, brothers, and* keep the traditions that we taught you, whether by word of mouth or by letter. *
16 May our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who has given us his love and, through his grace, such ceaseless encouragement and such sure hope,
17 encourage you and strengthen you in every good word and deed.

John ch.20
There were many other signs that Jesus worked in the sight of the disciples, but they are not recorded in this book. 31 These are recorded so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing this you may have life through his name.

Second issues- continuing apologetics work, which requires really knowing the scriptures. Particularly entire passages vice the snippets protestants tend to quote. Really hard work, I find it beyond my abilities at the moment.

I could go on about it, but Keatings and Madrids books are a very good start in common protestant criticisms and responding to them. In addition to the solid grounding the Faith of the Early Fathers will give you in understanding the early church.

Yes, it is work (apologetics) and it can get overwhelming, I think that’s why I have such concern for my kids. I’m learning all this stuff but they’re not in the same zone I’m in. I surely wasn’t into searching scriptures and reading church fathers at their age. I have recently purchased the Catholicism and Fundamentalism ebook. Love Keating and Madrid, Spencer, Sunginis, Pakwa. I’m really into to watching their debates. I discovered Justin Martyr a couple years ago. His writings are a great blessing to the Church. The church fathers are fascinating to me but there’s just sooooooo much. I will check out the book you referenced though. For me probably more so than for the kids.

What I’m thinking is that all this is going to be way over their heads and I need to keep things simple. You know?