Protestant vs Orthodox - who's closer?

[CathBoy1]

Roman or Latin is a rite in the Church but not the name of the Church. I am a Catholic of the Roman Rite.

Technically you, as am I, are Latin Catholics of the Roman Rite, as there is no “Latin Rite”, so the correct name of our church is the Latin Church, yet we’d be hard pressed (in the US anyways) to find a parish that says St (insert st name) Latin Catholic Church on the sign, yet we see Roman Catholic Church on the signs out front everywhere. :man_shrugging:t2:

The Catholic Church (commonly called Roman Catholic Church) is a body of 24 churches sui iuris all in full communion with one another and under the Pope of Rome, the largest church sui iuris is the Latin Church which uses the Roman Rite, which is but one of 6 rites within Catholicism.

Anyhow, Catholicism in general is commonly called the Roman Catholic Church, many churches even use the term Roman Catholic, it really isn’t derogatory nowadays, just a common misconception, and it doesn’t help that we (the Catholic Church in general) call ourselves by this name, therefore it really shouldn’t be anything that anyone (in the Latin Church) gets worked up about.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[OrbisNonSufficit]

That makes sense. In my country it is very common to identify everything as “Roman Catholic”. We also have Greek Catholics (Eastern Catholics). Honestly even schools are confused about distinction between Greek Catholics and Orthodoxy so that doesn’t help.

Anyway I have yet to see anyone here get offended by words “Roman Catholic”. I also once read on these forums that “English started it as a slur” is actually a myth… I will try to find the source.

Ecumenical Councils often say “Sancta Romana Ecclesia” which translates to “Holy Roman Church”. Vatican I document Dei Filius which meant to use above phrase was even amended it (because it seems to favour Anglican branch theory) and used " Sancta catholica apostolica romana Ecclesia " (‘Holy Catholic Apostolic Roman Church’)- which is very close to Roman Catholic Church.

 

[Bithynian]

“English started it as a slur” is actually a myth

Yes it’s very odd that some have this idea. The term ‘Roman Catholic’ largely entered currency in 16th century English as a polite term (not a slur) for Catholics, as opposed to calling us ‘Papists’, ‘Romish’ and other such pejorative labels. The need for differentiation arose, I suppose, because ‘catholic’ was at that time still very frequently used in the sense of ‘general’ or ‘universal’ even in non-theological contexts. The Oxford English Dictionary cites a naval medical manual as an example:

It hath the prime place, for a Catholick [i.e. universally efficient] medicine in exulcerations.

I suspect one reason why ‘Roman Catholic’ is perceived so negatively is due to what you mentioned, that it can be construed as supporting the branch theory in Anglican theology.

Interestingly, ρωμαιοκαθολικός romaiokatholikos in (modern) Greek is a direct borrowing from English, again, largely as a polite term instead of all the more derogatory labels. I surmise that, for most of history, it would not have made sense for Greeks to call us ‘Roman Catholics’, as ‘Roman’ often referred to Greeks themselves (and by extension, non-Greek Eastern Orthodox). I can’t actually recall many instances of pre-contemporary Greek literature referring to us as καθολικοί either: usually they used terms like ‘Franks’, ‘Latins’ or ‘Franco-Latins’ (which is essentially equivalent to ‘Papist’).

 

[phil19034]

phil19034:

Orthodoxy has ZERO influence in Communist Russia. The Communists were atheists, not Russian Orthodox.

If the Communists didn’t think that Orthodoxy had no influence on the people, they wouldn’t have recruited so many Orthodox priests, bishops & the Patriarch of Moscow to become KGB agents. You could go to confession and have the KGB arrest you because of what you said in confession.

Yes, but that’s not what I meant. I was referring to the government, not the people. Of course Orthodoxy had influence on the people. In the 1920s, most people in Russia were not atheists. The communists took over and tried to force atheism on everyone.

As we know, when Christians are persecuted, the faith grows.

What I meant was that the Communist govt didn’t have an Orthodox world view. Of course they tried to use the Church to their advantage, but the OP tried to claim that the Soviet Union was an Orthodox government, which it was not.

 

[Anesti33]

Roman or Latin is a rite in the Church but not the name of the Church. I am a Catholic of the Roman Rite. I am not a Roman Catholic. There are parishes that use the name Roman in order to give information but it is no where used officially by the Church. It is like the Mormons. It is not the name of the Church but in the past they used it because others found it so identifiable. They are now trying to end that identification.

Actually, “Latin Church” is the legal name of our sui iuris Church. It is used all the time in Canon Law.

 

[adamhovey1988]

This happened in Bulgaria with the KGB analogue there. This is well documented.

 

[adamhovey1988]

Papists

I’d honestly rather be called a “papist” than a “Roman” Catholic. Latin Catholic is fine, though

 

[BlueKumul]

Communism was started by Karl Marx, who was a German Jew. In love of German culture, and somewhat ashamed of his Jewish heritage. And Russians always looked up to Germany, as a more developed country.

In my experience Protestants are more focused on practical side of religion, and Orthodox on the mystical, contemplative side. We Catholics are in between, we have balance between the two aspects.

 

[Buzzard3]

Who is closer to Catholicism?

I always thought Orthodoxy is closer. They also worship saints and Mary the Mother of God. They can receive communion in our churches. But now on another board some guy keeps telling me Protestants are closer to Catholics because their views on civilization are more similar

No contest - Orthodox by a country mile!

 

[AlNg]

Some of the Melkite or Orthodox prayers use the term worship. I don’t know if the Melkites actually use the term worship, but they do sell the Orthodox prayer book that has it.
“. . . We suddenly were all lifted upon the clouds; and as thou seest, we are come unto thine abode, now to worship thee as a holy and fiery throne, and to see thy departure and divine emigration hence, . . . .”
". . . Then the Apostles, seeing thee, O Virgin, were filled with grace, and with exceeding great reverence, they all then sacredly worshipped thee and cried out with firm faith: O rejoice, thou who hast brought forth Great Mercy for the world."
These prayers come from the August Menaion published by Holy Transfiguration Monastery in Brookline, MA,