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MaryT777
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Jon What doctrinal agreement are you looking for with the ELCA to be able to receive communion kneeling together?
Mary.
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MSSheBear
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I have been to one Lutheran service in my life and it was an LCMS service. The closed Communion bit didn’t bother me. Wow, everybody kneeled, there was silence in the church before and after the service. The church building looked like a church.
Unfortunately my experience with most Evangelicals is they shy away from meeting in church buildings, there is an emphasis on fellowshipping or socializing to a point where it dominated the service. One thing also I have noticed is that if you had financial challenges it was because you wasted your money or you were sinning. Church plants were directed toward middle class professionals.
I imagine the trend will continue toward mega-churches with an emphasis on contemporary worship music and meeting people’s social needs. I miss those doughnuts.:sad_yes:
Unfortunately my experience with most Evangelicals is they shy away from meeting in church buildings, there is an emphasis on fellowshipping or socializing to a point where it dominated the service. One thing also I have noticed is that if you had financial challenges it was because you wasted your money or you were sinning. Church plants were directed toward middle class professionals.
I imagine the trend will continue toward mega-churches with an emphasis on contemporary worship music and meeting people’s social needs. I miss those doughnuts.:sad_yes:
I pretty much mentioned most of them. Morality, including a firmer rejection of abortion, pastoral care for those with same sex attraction that does not undermine or change the teachings of the Church. Clergy: a return to ordination practices consistent with historic Lutheranism; here I am speaking of those who are eligible to be ordained, not AS, which is acceptable and even desirable. Fellowship practices that reflect confessional teachings This Lutheran doesn’t mind the Anglican Eucharistic fellowship as much as I mind that with those who by their teaching reject the real presence.
Jon
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MaryT777
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This is a good point. I live in a University town and we had a large non denom church
(the only theology was the Bible was the sole rule and norm of Faith but we as humans
had not perfected interpreting it) and it was amazing what this Church had to offer its people:
There were after school programs, Bible studies in like 5 languages, support groups for AA alanon, Widows widowers etc it was truly amazing
Mary.
It was flooded and not insured so that was the end of that but I believe social needs need to be addressed in Churches.
That said some like myself will say we have the Word and the Sacraments and the Cross and that sustains me more than anything
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MaryT777
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Yes those are important issues, Jon. It’s odd for it seems easier to dialogue with the LWF
with the JDDJ when in fact it often seems we have more in common with the LCMS.
Go figure
The ELCA/LWF also has an easier time in dialogue with Reformed groups, and others. I think it may be because they are more willing to “flex” their beliefs to make dialogue work.Yes those are important issues, Jon. It’s odd for it seems easier to dialogue with the LWF
with the JDDJ when in fact it often seems we have more in common with the LCMS.
Go figure
The “flex” depends, then, on who they are in dialogue with at a given time. I mean this, not as a criticism, but as an observation. One might say they have a “big-tent” view of what a unified Church might look like. My Lutheran brother EvangelCatholic seems to imply this approach in his posts, as distinct from the LCMS/ILC stance that doctrine is doctrine.
My would actually think that the Catholic Church would be more interested in dialogue with us for that very reason. In our dialogue with the ELCA, it often seems like it is a moving target.
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MaryT777
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That makes good sense.The ELCA/LWF also has an easier time in dialogue with Reformed groups, and others. I think it may be because they are more willing to “flex” their beliefs to make dialogue work.
The “flex” depends, then, on who they are in dialogue with at a given time. I mean this, not as a criticism, but as an observation. One might say they have a “big-tent” view of what a unified Church might look like. My Lutheran brother EvangelCatholic seems to imply this approach in his posts, as distinct from the LCMS/ILC stance that doctrine is doctrine.
My would actually think that the Catholic Church would be more interested in dialogue with us for that very reason. In our dialogue with the ELCA, it often seems like it is a moving target.
Jon
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EvangelCatholic
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Interestingly, I oppose government mandates on the Church and think back to the Prussian coercion on Lutheran and Calvinist or the parliaments of Scandinavian countries selecting the archbishop. The ecumenical work of Lutherans and Reformed predates the ELCA full communion. In 1982 the World Council of Churches produced a wonderful document entitled Baptism, Eucharist, and Ministry that identified the common beliefs of Christians who profess the ecumenical creeds [Apostles, Nicene and Athansian]. The position of at least the ELCA [the only Lutheran synod, to my knowledge, in full communion with Reformed] is that we will be a more effective witness together than apart.The ELCA/LWF also has an easier time in dialogue with Reformed groups, and others. I think it may be because they are more willing to “flex” their beliefs to make dialogue work.
The “flex” depends, then, on who they are in dialogue with at a given time. I mean this, not as a criticism, but as an observation. One might say they have a “big-tent” view of what a unified Church might look like. My Lutheran brother EvangelCatholic seems to imply this approach in his posts, as distinct from the LCMS/ILC stance that doctrine is doctrine.
My would actually think that the Catholic Church would be more interested in dialogue with us for that very reason. In our dialogue with the ELCA, it often seems like it is a moving target.
Jon
I am totally appalled and sadden by those, in authority [bishops or theologians] who question the very divinity of our Lord but understand that there will be disagreements and some dead-ends in our journey of the holy Faith. Based on what your profess, I can safely said I am in total agreement with you, Jon because you are a Lutheran. Maybe I don’t agree with Reformed theology on the Eucharist but I believe Christ is bodily Presence and will drop to my knee regardless if I am in Lutheran or Presbyterian church. Lutherans are the via media as archbishop Söderblom pointed out a 100 years ago. By example, we hope to influence all Christians to accept the apostolic faith and reunite with the Pope.
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cheese_sdc
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Read Heinlein’s “Stranger in a Strange Land”. The Fosterites are where I see mega churches heading.
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